Rookie Play, Highlights & Discussion

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Who are your top 3?

Anthony
22
3%
Ball
232
34%
Bey
27
4%
Edwards
112
17%
Haliburton
164
24%
Okoro
5
1%
Quickley
69
10%
Tate
4
1%
Williams
12
2%
Wiseman
27
4%
 
Total votes: 674

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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1581 » by BugginOut » Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:46 am



Quickley with a big 2nd quarter explosion. 17 points on 9 shots.

Also did his best Steph impersonation with this step back 3
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1582 » by Quentin » Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:46 pm

Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl

Pretty damn good for the 19yo.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1583 » by Baseline81 » Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:56 pm

Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl

Pretty damn good for the 19yo.

It's not just April (11 games).

Look at his post all-star (23 games) split:
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/4594268/anthony-edwards

But you'll continue to see articles, such as the recent one by The Ringer, stating his closest comp is Dion Waiters.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1584 » by BadWolf » Wed Apr 21, 2021 9:31 pm

Yeah that article was brutal
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1585 » by HotelVitale » Wed Apr 21, 2021 9:33 pm

Baseline81 wrote:
Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl
Pretty damn good for the 19yo.
It's not just April (11 games). Look at his post all-star (23 games) split:
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/4594268/anthony-edwards But you'll continue to see articles, such as the recent one by The Ringer, stating his closest comp is Dion Waiters.


Eh, I've been a steady Ant supporter but Wolves fans gotta stop finding ways to make yourself the victims. The article you're citing is literally making strict statistical comps and finds Waiters to be one of the closest ones to him based on his overall stat output. Edwards shot the ball poorly for many months so he falls into a similar category as Waiters overall. No harm no foul there. They actually have a full paragraph at the top that screams this: "As always, an important caveat is that every player is different, so these comps represent possible futures rather than definitive outcomes. For instance, if we plug LeBron James’s rookie season into the model, his top comps include Russell Westbrook on the one hand—and Tyreke Evans and Michael Carter-Williams (both fellow Rookie of the Year winners) on the other."

Also it's not fair to insist that the recent Ant is the 'real' one and the one from before the AS break is fake, or that he's figured it out and is on track now and forever. Obviously a Wolves fan would hope that's the case but there have been so many annoying exchanges over the years about that on these boards that I'm hoping we can learn from it. Last year's argument about Cam Reddish comes to mind, there were dozens of posts about how his 2nd half was the real story on Cam--only for him to be even worse at shooting this year than the first half of his rook year.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1586 » by zimpy27 » Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:45 pm

Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl

Pretty damn good for the 19yo.


Since the all-star break (last 23 games):
23.6 PPG, 5 RPG, 3 APG, 1.6 SPG and TS% 0.55

Those are close to sophomore Wade numbers while being 4 years younger, the same numbers as Mitchell last season while also being 4 years younger.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1587 » by Klomp » Wed Apr 21, 2021 11:14 pm

HotelVitale wrote:
Baseline81 wrote:
Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl
Pretty damn good for the 19yo.
It's not just April (11 games). Look at his post all-star (23 games) split:
https://www.espn.com/nba/player/splits/_/id/4594268/anthony-edwards But you'll continue to see articles, such as the recent one by The Ringer, stating his closest comp is Dion Waiters.


Eh, I've been a steady Ant supporter but Wolves fans gotta stop finding ways to make yourself the victims. The article you're citing is literally making strict statistical comps and finds Waiters to be one of the closest ones to him based on his overall stat output. Edwards shot the ball poorly for many months so he falls into a similar category as Waiters overall. No harm no foul there. They actually have a full paragraph at the top that screams this: "As always, an important caveat is that every player is different, so these comps represent possible futures rather than definitive outcomes. For instance, if we plug LeBron James’s rookie season into the model, his top comps include Russell Westbrook on the one hand—and Tyreke Evans and Michael Carter-Williams (both fellow Rookie of the Year winners) on the other."

Also it's not fair to insist that the recent Ant is the 'real' one and the one from before the AS break is fake, or that he's figured it out and is on track now and forever. Obviously a Wolves fan would hope that's the case but there have been so many annoying exchanges over the years about that on these boards that I'm hoping we can learn from it. Last year's argument about Cam Reddish comes to mind, there were dozens of posts about how his 2nd half was the real story on Cam--only for him to be even worse at shooting this year than the first half of his rook year.

Did Reddish have a midseason coaching change last year that could also help explain his growth?
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1588 » by Grits n Gravy » Thu Apr 22, 2021 1:38 am

Let's say Ball comes back for last 10 games and plays decent - Is 20(more than 1/4 of season) games less than Edwards enough to win rookie of the year? Ant has quietly been playing pretty well. Given Ball was playing on a .500 team and Ant on a bottom 2 team, that obviously plays a factor - Thoughts?
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1589 » by theGreatRC » Thu Apr 22, 2021 1:43 am

Grits n Gravy wrote:Let's say Ball comes back for last 10 games and plays decent - Is 20(more than 1/4 of season) games less than Edwards enough to win rookie of the year? Ant has quietly been playing pretty well. Given Ball was playing on a .500 team and Ant on a bottom 2 team, that obviously plays a factor - Thoughts?


If Balls comes back like he never left, he wins ROY.

Ant has to completely dominate the rest of the way to make it a competition.

Ant after the all-star break looks like a future star in this league..Ant before the break looked like he wasn't even worth a 2021 lotto pick
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1590 » by DroseReturnChi » Thu Apr 22, 2021 1:56 am

Grits n Gravy wrote:Let's say Ball comes back for last 10 games and plays decent - Is 20(more than 1/4 of season) games less than Edwards enough to win rookie of the year? Ant has quietly been playing pretty well. Given Ball was playing on a .500 team and Ant on a bottom 2 team, that obviously plays a factor - Thoughts?


no bc antman efficiency is horrible. if antman wins over hali/ball roy will not be taken seriously like coy.
if every rookie was gifted 20 shots, they would avg at least 20 points otherwise you dont belong.
roy means nothing hali can win 50/50 but everyone knows he is not the best player like Doncic.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1591 » by DroseReturnChi » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:02 am

zimpy27 wrote:
Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl

Pretty damn good for the 19yo.


Since the all-star break (last 23 games):
23.6 PPG, 5 RPG, 3 APG, 1.6 SPG and TS% 0.55

Those are close to sophomore Wade numbers while being 4 years younger, the same numbers as Mitchell last season while also being 4 years younger.


if he can maintain until end of season, its is quite impressive he can change his career projection from bust to mitchell.
but im highly doubtful like 90% odds against. i think this is his streaky great month or 2 and not a 82 game thing.
plenty of rookies like coby white avged 25/4/4 on 40% deep post all star and yet i knew he was a bust.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1592 » by Klomp » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:14 am

DroseReturnChi wrote:
Grits n Gravy wrote:Let's say Ball comes back for last 10 games and plays decent - Is 20(more than 1/4 of season) games less than Edwards enough to win rookie of the year? Ant has quietly been playing pretty well. Given Ball was playing on a .500 team and Ant on a bottom 2 team, that obviously plays a factor - Thoughts?


no bc antman efficiency is horrible. if antman wins over hali/ball roy will not be taken seriously like coy.
if every rookie was gifted 20 shots, they would avg at least 20 points otherwise you dont belong.

This tells me you haven't really watched him very much lately, and don't understand some of the early-season circumstances.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1593 » by BugginOut » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:15 am



Another good game from Quickley. Hit big shots in the 4th and OT as well as the dagger to put the game away

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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1594 » by robillionaire » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:22 am

I would still give it to LaMelo even if he never plays another game, the Wolves are the worst/2nd worst team in the NBA, putting up numbers in losses doesn't do much for me. I give Edwards credit for having some nice games lately though. This is like when they gave it to Embiid over Brogdon
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1595 » by FinnTheHuman » Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:27 pm

DroseReturnChi wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:
Quentin wrote:Edwards in April:
22.5 on 44.3/37.9/83.3, 4.5R, 3.5A, 1.5St, .4Bl

Pretty damn good for the 19yo.


Since the all-star break (last 23 games):
23.6 PPG, 5 RPG, 3 APG, 1.6 SPG and TS% 0.55

Those are close to sophomore Wade numbers while being 4 years younger, the same numbers as Mitchell last season while also being 4 years younger.


if he can maintain until end of season, its is quite impressive he can change his career projection from bust to mitchell.
but im highly doubtful like 90% odds against. i think this is his streaky great month or 2 and not a 82 game thing.
plenty of rookies like coby white avged 25/4/4 on 40% deep post all star and yet i knew he was a bust.


You sound like you haven't watched Edwards. Coby is an undersized combo guard, Edwards is probably the most athletic guy in the league after Zion and Giannis, maybe Gobert depending on how you define athleticism. Probably the best 1st step in the league, he gets to the rim at will, which is the best predictor of stardom. He's also got high IQ on the offensive end. There is zero reason to believe Edwards is not gonna be at least a top 30 guy in the league, let alone a bust. I know it hurts that your boy PWill is struggling, but there's no reason to hate on his competition like this.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1596 » by jpatrick » Thu Apr 22, 2021 3:31 pm

FinnTheHuman wrote:
DroseReturnChi wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:
Since the all-star break (last 23 games):
23.6 PPG, 5 RPG, 3 APG, 1.6 SPG and TS% 0.55

Those are close to sophomore Wade numbers while being 4 years younger, the same numbers as Mitchell last season while also being 4 years younger.


if he can maintain until end of season, its is quite impressive he can change his career projection from bust to mitchell.
but im highly doubtful like 90% odds against. i think this is his streaky great month or 2 and not a 82 game thing.
plenty of rookies like coby white avged 25/4/4 on 40% deep post all star and yet i knew he was a bust.


You sound like you haven't watched Edwards. Coby is an undersized combo guard, Edwards is probably the most athletic guy in the league after Zion and Giannis, maybe Gobert depending on how you define athleticism. Probably the best 1st step in the league, he gets to the rim at will, which is the best predictor of stardom. He's also got high IQ on the offensive end. There is zero reason to believe Edwards is not gonna be at least a top 30 guy in the league, let alone a bust. I know it hurts that your boy PWill is struggling, but there's no reason to hate on his competition like this.


Ant is not Coby White. He has shown such flashes, there is no doubt he’ll be a scorer in this league and at least on decent efficiency at some point. The question is more will that lead to winning. Will he figure out how to maximize other players vs going one on one too much? His defensive and rebounding (boxing his man out) are simply atrocious; and for some reason, he refuses to get back on defense. He’s only 19 so a lot of reasons to think he’ll improve. I think he’s the clear cut #2 player in this draft class.

All that said, LaMelo has been far more impactful this season. To me, even if he didn’t come back, he’s the ROY. What he did as a 19 year old PG is pretty historic.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1597 » by TheZachAttack » Thu Apr 22, 2021 6:20 pm

jpatrick wrote:
FinnTheHuman wrote:
DroseReturnChi wrote:
if he can maintain until end of season, its is quite impressive he can change his career projection from bust to mitchell.
but im highly doubtful like 90% odds against. i think this is his streaky great month or 2 and not a 82 game thing.
plenty of rookies like coby white avged 25/4/4 on 40% deep post all star and yet i knew he was a bust.


You sound like you haven't watched Edwards. Coby is an undersized combo guard, Edwards is probably the most athletic guy in the league after Zion and Giannis, maybe Gobert depending on how you define athleticism. Probably the best 1st step in the league, he gets to the rim at will, which is the best predictor of stardom. He's also got high IQ on the offensive end. There is zero reason to believe Edwards is not gonna be at least a top 30 guy in the league, let alone a bust. I know it hurts that your boy PWill is struggling, but there's no reason to hate on his competition like this.


Ant is not Coby White. He has shown such flashes, there is no doubt he’ll be a scorer in this league and at least on decent efficiency at some point. The question is more will that lead to winning. Will he figure out how to maximize other players vs going one on one too much? His defensive and rebounding (boxing his man out) are simply atrocious; and for some reason, he refuses to get back on defense. He’s only 19 so a lot of reasons to think he’ll improve. I think he’s the clear cut #2 player in this draft class.

All that said, LaMelo has been far more impactful this season. To me, even if he didn’t come back, he’s the ROY. What he did as a 19 year old PG is pretty historic.


Has Lamelo made a big impact though? The Hornets immediately post-Lamelo injury went 7-3 (and are in total 8-8) during the games that Lamelo has missed since his injury. So, the Hornets with Lamelo on the floor are 21-22 and with him out are essentially the same level of team.

Obviously Lamelo was really good, but is he really a difference maker yet? He doesn't seem to raise the overall level of play of Charlotte. It seems like he's a good rookie, but on a surprisingly good team for a team that picked #3 overall last year.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1598 » by Klomp » Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:14 pm

TheZachAttack wrote:Has Lamelo made a big impact though? The Hornets immediately post-Lamelo injury went 7-3 (and are in total 8-8) during the games that Lamelo has missed since his injury. So, the Hornets with Lamelo on the floor are 21-22 and with him out are essentially the same level of team.

Obviously Lamelo was really good, but is he really a difference maker yet? He doesn't seem to raise the overall level of play of Charlotte. It seems like he's a good rookie, but on a surprisingly good team for a team that picked #3 overall last year.

Conversely, the same could be said of Edwards. He's been a constant on the roster. It hasn't been until other guys return or the coaching change that we've seen overall play elevated.
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1599 » by TheZachAttack » Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:26 pm

Klomp wrote:
TheZachAttack wrote:Has Lamelo made a big impact though? The Hornets immediately post-Lamelo injury went 7-3 (and are in total 8-8) during the games that Lamelo has missed since his injury. So, the Hornets with Lamelo on the floor are 21-22 and with him out are essentially the same level of team.

Obviously Lamelo was really good, but is he really a difference maker yet? He doesn't seem to raise the overall level of play of Charlotte. It seems like he's a good rookie, but on a surprisingly good team for a team that picked #3 overall last year.

Conversely, the same could be said of Edwards. He's been a constant on the roster. It hasn't been until other guys return or the coaching change that we've seen overall play elevated.


That's my overall point though. People penalize Edwards for being on a bad team and thus write off his stats as something you can write off until the Wolves record improves as not-impactful. Edwards may need to continue to improve his efficiency and make more of an impact at the defensive end, but the differences in records are really about supporting cast and subsequent health.

The Wolves are 9-15 in their last 24 games post-all-star-break. They are .500 with D Lo and Towns in the lineup. I'm not sure they sustain that level of play without Edwards providing consistent volume scoring because the Wolves don't have the scoring depth that Charlotte has. Charlotte can rely on any of Rozier, Hayward, Lamelo, Graham, etc. and no player HAS to be the guy on any given night as long as a couple are performing.

The main point I am trying to make is that if you want to make the argument that Edwards play doesn't elevate his team yet, I think you would have to also point out that the Hornets had a better winning percentage without Lamelo than with him. If Lamelo has reached a different tier than Edwards because his impact elevates his teams play and Edwards doesn't, how come his team's record hasn't changed?
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Re: Rookie of The Year Thread 

Post#1600 » by Quentin » Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:58 pm

The Hornets are .500 without ball these past 16 games. They were less than .500 with him. So please don't go trying to say Ball is the reason for their winning.

The Wolves couldn't win a game with or without Edwards. He's been put in a terrible situation and is already on his second coach.

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