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Petergrifindor wrote:LOL what a demented take.

Without Kyrie Cavs would have won **** that year.

The Cavs were better with Delladova the year before than Kyrie. If they had Love that year, they woulda won a title too.

Kyrie outplayed Steph in those Finals a guy at his own position. Maybe had Kyrie been averaging 18 ppg and getting outplayed then yeah. But Kyrie was outplaying the other teams best player as well at his position.

HypeMode wrote:

Petergrifindor wrote:LOL what a demented take.

Without Kyrie Cavs would have won **** that year.

The Cavs were better with Delladova the year before than Kyrie. If they had Love that year, they woulda won a title too.

LOL

BlackNoir wrote:Weak take, you realize that Kyrie won him that ring right? He played lights out that finals and was clutch with Lebum was mediocre.
Also helps to have Curry hurt and DPOY out with a bogus suspension.

LOL. Apparently we watched two different series, because from what I remember... LeBron was far from mediocre and played better than Kyrie did.

OP,

you mean Kyrie, the future HOF'er who nailed a dagger 3 in a game 7 of an NBA finals to seal the win for his team?


That Kyrie?

He does get credit, that 2016 finals run was the greatest of all time or at least one of

donnieme wrote:

G35 wrote:

HypeMode wrote:So many people give an asterisk to LeBron's Cleveland title because he played with 2* All-stars. In reality, he should get extra credit for being the only player or team who has been able to win with Kyrie. Cleveland pre-LeBron couldn't win with Kyrie. Boston couldn't win Kyrie. Brooklyn can't win with Kyrie. LeBron is the only one has been able to figure out how to at least temporarily turn Kyrie into a winning basketball team.

We never heard a peep about Kyrie being disgruntled with LeBron because he wouldn't tolerate that crap. He leaves Cleveland and all of a sudden he is a problem child again. It can't be a coincidence that Boston made 3 conference finals without Kyrie and we never heard a word about locker room issues during those years. Kyrie plays one year and its the worst locker room and they win less games than normal.

Watch this video of the last 3:39 of the G7. These are the relevant elements:

- Lebron makes ZERO field goals and goes 1-2 from the FT line
- Curry is just as bad fouling Lebron on a rebound and he cannot shake Kevin Love's perimeter defense and the worst was the bad pass he gave Iguodola allowing for Lebron to make his one good contribution and block the shot
- Draymond did nothing in those last 3:39
- Kyrie hit the ONLY shot in the last 3:39 of the game a one on one vs Curry for the dagger 3

What is also interesting to note is how Lebron deferred to Kyrie on offense. Lebron got two chances to run the offense and missed a a layup, passed the ball down to Kevin Love on the block and other than that Lebron disappeared on offense.

Lebron gave the ball up to Kyrie and let him run the offense for the most important CLUTCH moments of that season. It was not just the last five seconds or ten seconds. It was the last three minutes and Lebron pretty much did nothing on offense and barely made one free throw. Watch the game not your feelings

Watch on YouTube

Interestingly you also seem to have watched it with some bias. No doubt they were all awful but that included Kyrie. He airballed a floater so bad that the Warriors had the breakaway that would lead to the Lebron Iggy block, on the possession Lebron got those freethrows Kyrie almost throws away the game trying to force a fastbreak when he foolishly pushes ahead into no man's land and almost throws the ball away. Also one of Lebron's bricks is a blatant missed call where Iggy pulls his hand (you definitely saw it). They were all terrible, Kyrie included but You definitely didn't watch the clip free of bias if you came away with Kyrie as the only one without flaw

I didn't say Kyrie was without flaw.

I saw the foul on Lebron's wrist by Iguodola and not even concerned because if you have watched the NBA long enough you know that the officials start swallowing whistles in the playoffs and in the last five minutes of a tight game in the finals you are not getting that call. If you also notice at 1:31 of that clip they show in slow motion how Lebron grabbed Curry's jersey on the way to the basket...so lets see how unbiased you can be.

Just about everyone sucked in that last 3 minutes...there was only one clutch basket made in that entire clip and it was made by Kyrie. But that 3pt shot is not what I noticed most.

@2:43 who has the ball for the Cavs for this possession...Kyrie does...where is Lebron...in the right corner staying out of the way...for the whole possession...GOAT level stuff. Lebron does not even make it inside the 3pt line for the whole possession.

@3:11 with a minute and 43 seconds left JR Smith gives Lebron the ball with about 17 seconds left on the shot clock. Lebron stands near the half court line and lets the shot clock run down and decides to back down Iguodola into the paint and throws up some half ass hook shot that comes up short. Van Gundy even calls out the CLE team for not getting into their offense sooner and that was all on Lebron.

@3:40 this is where I notice Lebron and his passivity and lack of confidence. Curry shoots a brick that does not hit the rim, Love rebounds it and Lebron is right next to him...does Lebron get the ball? Nope and he doesn't even ask for it. Kyrie is outside the 3pt line and runs back to get the ball and start running the offense.

@3:53 you can see Lebron's frustration and then you can see Kyrie walking to the bench is frustrated. So what do you think Tyronn Lue the coach is going to do? I mean this is the GOAT right? This is Lebron winning a championship for the city of Cleveland. The Cavs need a high percentage look, they need someone who is going to give them the best chance at making a basket. So who do you think is going to get the ball coming out of that time out?

Lebron is the inbounder, which takes all the pressure off him to get the ball and initiate the offense. So what happens? Does Lebron inbound the ball and demand it back like the guy who won a championship for Cleveland despite his teammates? Despite playing with Kyrie?

No, Lebron inbounds the ball to Kyrie and you know what he does? He runs his ass into the corner and stays there. Like he is some great 3pt shooter that is spacing the floor. In fact, you can say Lebron was there to help Kyrie win the championship instead of the other way around.

This is the possession that wins the Cavaliers the title. It is a tie game. Cleveland has the ball and the ball is in Kyrie's hands...not Lebron's. Lebron is not even an option. He is basically getting out of the way.

Watch the game without bias.

Kyrie is on an island with Klay Thompson on him and then they switch Curry on to him. Kyrie does not really even make some spectacular move...he goes between his legs a couple of times and then does a slight hesitation to his right and rises up.

At this point it is a make or miss game. Either he makes it and the Cavs win or he doesn't. Lebron is an afterthought at this point. If you watch Lebron, he doesn't even go back door to get in position for the rebound. He sits there and watches the shot just like the fans in the stands.

So you tell me, how did Lebron win them the title, when if Kyrie had missed that shot, Kyrie would have gotten all the blame.

What I think is Lebron was not confident enough to take charge in that situation because he had problems with Iguodola defensively and he did not want the media scrutiny if he ran a play and ended up passing to someone like JR or Kevin Love for the shot and if they missed it would have been the same old narrative. Lebron made the right play but they lost the game.

It was better for Lebron that Kyrie took that shot......

i'm going to take the opposite approach just for the fun of it.

i BLAME lebron for kyrie today!!

kyrie reminds me a whole lot like sharon stone. sharon stone was hot-looking star known for showing it all in "basic instinct". then she got cast in a scorsese movie called "casino" and from then on she thought she was a hot sh** actress and became insufferable, and for that i blame scorsese

Kyrie was good. It’s his mentality and off court stuff that makes him hard to manage. Cavs actually did fairly well keeping him check looking back. Especially since Kyrie and his dad hated the cavs organisation

The difference was that Kyrie was more protected by the media as LeBron's teammate, they've been going at him since he left the Cavs. He is also crazier now than he was back then, not really as focused and hungry.

LBJ should get the credit for keeping Irving's ego in check.

Nobody wins alone.
Kyrie was excellent for the Cavs. A team that made zero “go for it” before Lebron came back. Actually LeGM takes undervalue his skills as one. I mean he certainly overpays players but he makes sure to bring in a winning caliber roster, something the Cavs did not do before him.
No Kyrie no 2016 championship. But no Lebron and he might have been missing the playoffs. Not his talent but the belief in him that the team would make the necessary moves.

Dumb take.

Kyrie averaged 27/4/4/2. Put up 40 with lebron kn a crucial game 5, and hit one of the biggest shots in finals history while outplaying the unanimous MVP.

Had Kyrie got hurt that year, Chances are those 73 win warriors would have whooped lebron just like they did the year previously when Kyrie and love were hurt.

This thread only makes sense if Kyrie was some bum averaging 7 points. Y’all need to stop making everything about lebron. The year Kyrie got hurt, Steph and em were popping champagne in the locker

HypeMode wrote:

Petergrifindor wrote:LOL what a demented take.

Without Kyrie Cavs would have won **** that year.

The Cavs were better with Delladova the year before than Kyrie. If they had Love that year, they woulda won a title too.

No the hell they wouldn’t have 2015 warriors were brand new to that stage. 73 win warriors were playing on a whole different level.

Lebron did not make that comeback by himself.

HypeMode wrote:

Petergrifindor wrote:LOL what a demented take.

Without Kyrie Cavs would have won **** that year.

The Cavs were better with Delladova the year before than Kyrie. If they had Love that year, they woulda won a title too.

Please don't compare kyrie to scrubadova

ThumbsUpBaby wrote:

BlackNoir wrote:Weak take, you realize that Kyrie won him that ring right? He played lights out that finals and was clutch with Lebum was mediocre.
Also helps to have Curry hurt and DPOY out with a bogus suspension.

LOL. Apparently we watched two different series, because from what I remember... LeBron was far from mediocre and played better than Kyrie did.

That's because you've got your LBJ blinders on..

Optms wrote:

BlackNoir wrote:Weak take, you realize that Kyrie won him that ring right? He played lights out that finals and was clutch with Lebum was mediocre.
Also helps to have Curry hurt and DPOY out with a bogus suspension.

If it wasn't for Lebron, Kyrie would still be selling meat out of truck in Minneapolis.

Lebron made 8 straight Finals. Pay your blessings and keep it moving.

Bravo on the Eric Bischoff/Hulk Hogan quote. Not sure anyone else got that but I enjoyed it a ton.

Bornstellar wrote:

Doranku wrote:

Bornstellar wrote:I've said it before: Kyrie Irving would be seen as just another selfish chucking loser if LeBron hadn't come back to Cleveland and brought them a ring. He's hit basically 1 clutch playoff shot in his entire career and somehow gets the same amount of credit for that 2016 ring as James. Without LeBron, Kyrie is just a smaller Antwan Jamison

This is just disingenuous. I understand not liking the guy, but boiling down his 2016 performance to "hitting basically 1 clutch shot" is completely unfair. The man thoroughly outplayed the unanimous, b2b MVP in a 7 game finals series.

Kyrie's game 5 in the finals is one of the best finals performances of all-time. 41 points on a ridiculous 17-24 shooting in a road elimination game.

He obviously wasn't as good or as important as LeBron, but he earned his respect for that run.

I never boiled his entire performance down to 1 shot. I said he has basically only HIT one clutch shot in his career and people act like he won the title for LeBron.

Irving could hit only one clutch shot and he could also win the title for LeBron. Both statement could be true. Without Irving LeBron likely wouldn't win the most important title for his legacy. He could win another 3 titles with the Lakers and the Cavs one would still be his most iconic one when we talk about his legacy.

BlackNoir wrote:

Bornstellar wrote:

BlackNoir wrote:Weak take, you realize that Kyrie won him that ring right? He played lights out that finals and was clutch with Lebum was mediocre.
Also helps to have Curry hurt and DPOY out with a bogus suspension.

See what I mean with this clownish take?

29.7/11/9/2.6/2.3 on 49% shooting (this is considered "mediocre?" LMAO)

vs

27/4/4/2/1 on 47% shooting


Yeah, Kyrie totally won LeBron that ring by underperforming him in every facet

You need to rewatch son, it was Kyrie with all the clutch and 4th qtr buckets/penetration.

You need to watch without Rose tinted glasses. Kyrie was great for one series and still worse than Lebron in every aspect even in the Finals

Kyrie without Lebron= John Wall

Grumpy Heat Fan wrote:OP,

you mean Kyrie, the future HOF'er who nailed a dagger 3 in a game 7 of an NBA finals to seal the win for his team?


That Kyrie?

No I mean the guy who led his team to the lottery every season before Lebron and self-destructed a great Boston team and is on his way to self-destruct a great Nets team too.

Sorry one great series doesn't make up for that.