Will we ever see an organic champion again?

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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#61 » by JRoy » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:39 pm

Will be interesting to see if owners for a “franchise player” provision
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#62 » by Sofia » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:39 pm

so_bored wrote:Lebron started this BS. It's really all his fault. Can't wait for this fraud to retire.

We just going to pretend Kobe didn’t demand a trade unless they got him some help?

Do we forget that he nearly went to Detroit and Chicago? Or that the Lakers nearly landed KG and Kidd?
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#63 » by Chanel Bomber » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:41 pm

Yeggo Poleggo wrote:Kobe Bryant was the very last one.

The 2015 Warriors.

I guess one can count the 2016 Cavaliers as well since LeBron returned to the team that drafted him to make amends. Kyrie was also a Cavaliers draft pick.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#64 » by donnieme » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:41 pm

BigDocta898 wrote:
Yeggo Poleggo wrote:Kobe Bryant was the very last one.



No the Spurs.

Kobe demanded trades out of Charlotte and LA

Plus the Gasol trade may have been justified in hindsight but back in 2008 that trade was far from organic

My guess is people don't even remember the circumstances around how most title teams were built and are talking from recency bias
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#65 » by jg77 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:43 pm

Maybe Atlanta can do it. They have a lot of young talent that can grow together.

Memphis too with Morant and JJ
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#66 » by Edrees » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:43 pm

We had a 100% organic champion in the 2015 Warriors. And nobody seems to give them extra respect for it. So I must conclude that there's no value in a a "Organic" champion.

Also 2016 was pretty organic, the two best players on the team were drafted by the Cavs.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#67 » by Magiclee » Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:44 pm

The bigger issue here is that all the super teams are coalescing in NY and LA. Why should the rest of the world tune into this? It's starting to look like it doesn't matter what your favorite team does outside of the current 3... and don't believe for a second the Knicks won't end up here before too long. There's nowhere left for Giannis, Griffin, and Paul to fit under the cap.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#68 » by Jack Dempsey » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:01 am

zimpy27 wrote:When was the last truly organic one? 30 years ago?

2015 Warriors traded Monta for Bogut.


Just in case that's not a sarcastic comment:

That's not the problem imo. Monta for Bogut was pretty much fair value, some even thought Milwaukee won the trade. And more importantly, Bogut didn't demand a trade nor did he make a list of teams he would go to. So, there was no forcing out, no teaming up, etc everything was fair.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#69 » by Tottery » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:13 am

donnieme wrote:
BigDocta898 wrote:
Yeggo Poleggo wrote:Kobe Bryant was the very last one.



No the Spurs.

Kobe demanded trades out of Charlotte and LA

Plus the Gasol trade may have been justified in hindsight but back in 2008 that trade was far from organic

My guess is people don't even remember the circumstances around how most title teams were built and are talking from recency bias


I came to say this.

There are players that stick with teams, but they almost always end up getting help from elsewhere. It's been like this since the beginning. The openly not trying and bashing your team to get traded is relatively new for modern basketball though.

Kobe threw a fit for help and they basically got Gasol for nothing lol.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#70 » by symbiotic » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:14 am

One year a team crafted like the Bucks & Celtics & Heat will win.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#71 » by MrPerfect1 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:20 am

The_Ghost_of_JB wrote:
MrPerfect1 wrote:Wait until the next CBA. I expect the owners to take extraordinary steps to reverse what has been going on.


Like what? Non guaranteed contracts? The players will never agree to that and even if by some miracle they did after the contract was terminated they just jump on and play with their friends.

The NBA has been trying to control player movement and the supermax really hasn't worked out too well. Players will just sign a supermax, be a complete head case, dictate where they want to be traded and they'll go there.

The NBA owners are completely powerless The players 100% run the NBA.


The owners have far more power with the CBA over the players who many live paycheck to paycheck.

No idea what they'll push for but the changes will be massive.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#72 » by GrandTheftRondo » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:34 am

Capn'O wrote:Splash Bros were both drafted by Ws.

Year before that - Spurs. All major players were drafted (or "drafted" in Kawhi's case) by Spurs.

So, if that's what you mean, yeah it'll probably happen again :dontknow:

That was before all this BS started with every second half decent player.

These days Curry would have probably demanded a trade in 2013

Star are no longer sticking with franchises to build anything. That is the point.

I do not find it entertaining when players are constantly teaming up build all star cores. There are zero rivalries, players have no ties to the teams and it makes the playoffs boring as ****.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#73 » by Coach Carter » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:35 am

Denver n boston are a chance
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#74 » by Jadoogar » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:38 am

Yeggo Poleggo wrote:Kobe Bryant was the very last one.

2015 Warriors?
and LOL, the team that traded for Pau?
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#75 » by Jadoogar » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:42 am

zimpy27 wrote:
chrisab123 wrote:
zimpy27 wrote:When was the last truly organic one? 30 years ago?


Warriors pre KD I'd say.


Bogut was the centrepiece of that defense in 2015.

I'd probably say one of the Spurs teams


Bogut was maybe the 4th best player on the team. are you asking for zero trades?
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#76 » by Yeggo Poleggo » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:45 am

Jadoogar wrote:
Yeggo Poleggo wrote:Kobe Bryant was the very last one.

2015 Warriors?
and LOL, the team that traded for Pau?


I thought the question meant about a player, winning championships and staying with said team.
World's biggest Kobe Bryant fan.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#77 » by Karate Diop » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:45 am

No player has ever won a championship on their own... Contracts are shorter nowadays so there is more player movement... Deal with it.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#78 » by Warriorfan » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:47 am

Warriors veteran core plus Wiseman development plus another good pick may be home grown champs again
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#79 » by donkeylips » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:51 am

it looks like some people are defining organic as teams that do not make trades or sign free agents. those are two things you need to do to win. if you define it as having drafted the core players then the warriors were the most recent once. Curry, Klay, Barnes and Green were all drafted by the warriors. Yes they traded for iguodala, lee and bogut and signed livingston, speights and barbosa as free agents. it just depends on how you define an organic championship.
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Re: Will we ever see an organic champion again? 

Post#80 » by IgorK » Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:59 am

Swish1906 wrote:
IgorK wrote:Define "organic".

Is signing free agents organic? Is trading for players organic? Is changing coaches organic? Are there degrees to everything?

In reality, nobody has the right to define this concept universally. We all have opinions about it and everybody is right and wrong at the same time.


Not forcing your way out while still under contract for more than a year, not tanking your trade value, not killing any trade to a team who could offer a better package and still compete for a title..

you know...like the A.Davis trade, huh


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