Who popularized flopping in the NBA?

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Flopping

Manu Ginobili
38
26%
Derek Fisher
7
5%
Chris Paul
7
5%
Vlade Divac
46
32%
Dwyane Wade
3
2%
Lebron James
21
15%
Reggie Miller
7
5%
Other (comment)
8
6%
*see results*
7
5%
 
Total votes: 144

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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#21 » by Marrrcuss » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:46 pm

scrabbarista wrote:
MoMan24 wrote:
scrabbarista wrote:As a child of the 90's, Divac, Stockton, Reggie Miller, and Rodman come to mind first. Karl Malone also flopped.

It's been around for a long time, but I don't think guys were making it an essential part of their game in a widespread way until maybe Harden.

Also, shout out to that period when "LeBronning" was a thing.

So, yeah. I remember a bunch of dudes from the 90's who flopped a lot. If you're saying Manu, then you're either too young, weren't paying attention, or have forgotten.

And I only started watching in like 1991, so for all I know, there were some famous floppers before the names I listed.

What is "LeBronning"?


https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=lebronning


Thought i had a good sense of humor but that video and the term are corny af. Some wack azz suburb born bullshyt, lol
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#22 » by og15 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:47 pm

RapZilla wrote:The Refs

True in a sense. Flopping is bred out of a couple things, one trying to decieve refs into making calls that aren't really there, two, trying to get refs to call minimal contact that is a foul, but can be let go, but also players who feel they aren't getting calls against excessive contact have also resorted to flopping to make the refs aware of the contact that is happening.

So one is refs getting fooled, the other is refs missing calls or swallowing their whistle because the player doesn't react enough even though it is a foul which then inadvertently teaches players, "the more you react, the more likely you are to get the call".
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#23 » by The4thHorseman » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:48 pm

The Pistons Bill Laimbeer was a master of the flop. Then taught teammate Rodman the art of embellishing little to no contact.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#24 » by snaquille oatmeal » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:48 pm

The question is who popularized flopping, Vlade was definitely there first, but he didn’t make it popular, Manu I think started the the movement and had some disciples so gets my vote.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#25 » by AdagioPace » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:51 pm

og15 wrote:Who popularized it for the modern day? I'd say the Spurs, Manu most prominently and this is not said in n a derogatory way, but the Spurs had one of the more recent (last 20 years) teams that won a lot while having some contact embelishers on their team (Manu, Oberto, Bowen, Parker a bit too). Guys on teams losing to them look at that and say, "hmm, it seems to work out".

Then other guys moved it on of course, and while it's always hard to pin point something like that to just one source, I'd say they were the catalyst.

Of course it's been a build up, guys were flopping since the inception of the game, we also previously had less immediately accessible media to watch every flopping clip and compile them like we have in our YouTube era. Frank Ramsey was making a living out of it and "wrote the book" literally on the art of ref deception, and there have always been floppers, more than many realized or noticed with less media exposure.

I would say the Spurs helped to "popularize" it for the current generation of players though, because they were the ones winning with noticeable floppers, and some guys took that as "this works".


you make it sound like a corporate goal by the spurs which is quite offensive and hyperbolic..come on. :-?
If anything, Spurs won games and titles while employing a heavy-contact defensive strategy,....basically the opposite.

as Scabbarista pointed out, you had plenty of american floppers in the 90s but the usual foreign-flopper stereotype is hard to erase
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#26 » by Statlanta » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:52 pm

Vlade . He was the reaction to all the tough bully ball of the 90’s.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#27 » by jamaalstar21 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:58 pm

Laimbeer and Rodman for sure. Vlade came after, and he flopped with the best of him. I think the "euro's introduced flopping to the NBA" is an overstated thing. People attribute it to soccer, and much of Europe has more of a soccer culture than the States. People point to Vlade and Manu because they were quite artful about it, but the Bad Boys were no slouches in this department.

By the late 2000s, players were getting pretty sophisticated with baiting the refs. The Bad Boys, Reggie, Vlade, alll the people who are getting mentions are the pioneers.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#28 » by hongdayuan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:04 pm

refs should be an option. players wont flop if they dont make the call.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#29 » by og15 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:13 pm

The4thHorseman wrote:The Pistons Bill Laimbeer was a master of the flop. Then taught teammate Rodman the art of embellishing little to no contact.

Laimbeer was a well established flopper. Rodman also for sure. They are perceived as tougher guys though, and they are as far as I know, but just a reminder that flopping isn't really about being tough or strong or not.

AdagioPace wrote:
og15 wrote:Who popularized it for the modern day? I'd say the Spurs, Manu most prominently and this is not said in n a derogatory way, but the Spurs had one of the more recent (last 20 years) teams that won a lot while having some contact embelishers on their team (Manu, Oberto, Bowen, Parker a bit too). Guys on teams losing to them look at that and say, "hmm, it seems to work out".

Then other guys moved it on of course, and while it's always hard to pin point something like that to just one source, I'd say they were the catalyst.

Of course it's been a build up, guys were flopping since the inception of the game, we also previously had less immediately accessible media to watch every flopping clip and compile them like we have in our YouTube era. Frank Ramsey was making a living out of it and "wrote the book" literally on the art of ref deception, and there have always been floppers, more than many realized or noticed with less media exposure.

I would say the Spurs helped to "popularize" it for the current generation of players though, because they were the ones winning with noticeable floppers, and some guys took that as "this works".


you make it sound like a corporate goal by the spurs which is quite offensive and hyperbolic..come on. :-?
If anything, Spurs won games and titles while employing a heavy-contact defensive strategy,....basically the opposite.

as Scabbarista pointed out, you had plenty of american floppers in the 90s but the usual foreign-flopper stereotype is hard to erase

I understand that it can be triggering because everyone wants to dissociate their favorite team and players from flopping. I didn't make it sound like a goal, I specifically said they popularized it because they were the team that won a lot. I specifically mentioned that flopping has a long history basically to the first decade of the sport. Nothing there suggest some cooperate agenda. If they had won less, they wouldn't be as influencial in flopping for the modern era, but they won...a lot.

Things get more popular the more it is seen as tied to winning. Just like the 3PT shooting expansion moved forward as people saw it tied more to winning. The question being who "popularized" flopping and not who "started" flopping or who was the most egregious, popularized is the key word in the question.

Toughness and flopping are not mutually exclusive, actually my reply just above this is the perfect example. What are the Bad Boy Pistons known for? Toughness, hard hitting, heavy contact, hard nosed defense and two of their guys were pretty blatant floppers.

So no, heavy contact defensive strategy is not the opposite of flopping, in fact many times they can go well hand in hand. You beat on the other team, but if they beat you back on either end, you embellish here and there and make it harder for them to do the same thing.

It's a double whammy that can frustrate opponents even further.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#30 » by LeMasta » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:15 pm

the spurs
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#31 » by maradro » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:38 pm

From 1954 to 1964, shooting guard Frank Ramsey played an integral role in seven Celtics championship teams, averaging 13.4 points and 5.5 rebounds in 24 minutes a game. He played with Russell, Cousy, Heinsohn, KC … all the greats. His coach was Auerbach. He also, quite literally, wrote the book on flopping. In the December 9, 1963, issue of Sports Illustrated, Ramsey, with Frank Deford, penned an article titled “Smart Moves By A Master Of Deception.” All the dark sorcery is in there, described in professorial detail, complete with “Teach Yourself Karate”–style illustrations.


https://grantland.com/the-triangle/flopping-in-the-nba-a-history-of-nonviolence/
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#32 » by Lockdown504090 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:40 pm

This needs to be in here, the passing of the torch.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#33 » by maradro » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:46 pm

Iirc in 04 or 05 when manu first came to the league, the league had an instructional video for players to show how to draw charges and they used several clips of him to show proper technique. manu drew a lot of charges and attacked the basket wildly, that drew a reputation that isn't really warranted IMO..
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#34 » by predators » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:47 pm

Embellishing contact/flopping has always been a thing. I guess who ever invented replay made it popular.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#35 » by BoatsNZones » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:48 pm

Soulyss wrote:
Lord Eder wrote:Divac came first to mind, but I’m sure it goes further than that


Divac popularized it, Manu perfected it.

Manu merely adopted the flop. Vlade was born in it, molded by it.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#36 » by KingDavid » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:01 pm

Fixed the names of these players. Sheesh man. Proofread.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#37 » by LakersLegacy » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:09 pm



CP3 is the greatest American flopper

Man is the greatest international flopper
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#38 » by gst8 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:15 pm

Divac with an honorable mention to his protege Brad Miller.

Karl Malone stands out more for the rip through foul.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#39 » by Bergmaniac » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:17 pm

Obviously some foreign player, we all know that the US players are too honest and noble for this.
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Re: Who popularized flopping in the NBA? 

Post#40 » by D.Brasco » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:03 pm

Lockdown504090 wrote:This needs to be in here, the passing of the torch.
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Obligatory.

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