RealGM

Who currently ranks higher all time?

Allen Iverson

1x MVP
1x Conf. Champion
4x Scoring Champion
3x Steals Champion
11x All Star
7x All NBA
Rookie of the Year

James Harden

1x MVP
1x Conf. Champion
3x Scoring Champion
2x Assists Champion
9x All Star
7x All NBA
6th Man of the Year


I think I have to go with AI. Harden's numbers are a little better but he also plays in an era of inflated stats. Iverson spent his prime in an era of suppressed stats and was still able to put up historically high numbers. Despite Hardens gaudy scoring avg's Iverson still has more scoring titles than him. He led his team to the finals as the number one option while Harden got there as a 6th man. And finally Harden is defined by repeatedly folding in the playoffs while Iverson's is defined by his playoff heroics.

James is still building up his resume but for now Iverson is remains the king of the inefficient, high volume, ISO scorers that dominate the league but will never win you a championship.

And he did it without even practicing.



For future reference, please use the Player Comparison Forum for topics like these.
-js21

Is this a joke?

Iverson can't touch Harden. Literary worse in every single aspect of basketball...

Iverson:

24.4k points, 3.4k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 2k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
11× NBA All-Star
2× NBA All-Star Game MVP
3× All-NBA First Team
3× All-NBA Second Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
NBA Rookie of the Year
4× NBA scoring champion
3× NBA steals leader

Harden:

21.7k points, 4.8k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 1.3k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
9× NBA All-Star
6× All-NBA First Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
1x NBA Sixth Man of the Year
3× NBA scoring champion
1x NBA assists leader


It is close. You can make point either player being ahead of other. Iverson having more all-star selections and raw statistics but Harden having more all-first team selections and he still has good 5 productive years in him. So no matter what one thinks as of now its pretty clear that Harden eventually clearly passes Iverson in everything. But for most of us Harden was ahead of Iverson already so. I have Harden about 15 to 20 spots ahead of Iverson on the all-time rankings.

JN61 wrote:Iverson:

24.4k points, 3.4k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 2k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
11× NBA All-Star
2× NBA All-Star Game MVP
3× All-NBA First Team
3× All-NBA Second Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
NBA Rookie of the Year
4× NBA scoring champion
3× NBA steals leader

Harden:

21.7k points, 4.8k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 1.3k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
9× NBA All-Star
6× All-NBA First Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
1x NBA Sixth Man of the Year
3× NBA scoring champion
1x NBA assists leader


It is close. You can make point either player being ahead of other. Iverson having more all-star selections and raw statistics but Harden having more all-first team selections and he still has good 5 productive years in him. So no matter what one thinks as of now its pretty clear that Harden eventually clearly passes Iverson in everything. But for most of us Harden was ahead of Iverson already so. I have Harden about 15 to 20 spots ahead of Iverson on the all-time rankings.

You said for alot if you Harden already passed him up. At what point did Harden pass up Iverson in your opinion and based on what?

Harden for me and I don't see it being close.
They have similar scoring numbers in term of volume but Harden gets them in a much more efficient way. He's also a bit better in every other category.

AI is a global icon and one of the most exciting players I enjoyed watching in the 90s, but I gotta go with Harden on this one. Career-wise, the Beard already surpassed the Answer...

limbo wrote:Is this a joke?

Iverson can't touch Harden. Literary worse in every single aspect of basketball...

The only aspect Harden is clearly better is rebounding and shooting 3s. When you adjust for era Iverson matches his numbers just fine.

GhosDini wrote:

limbo wrote:Is this a joke?

Iverson can't touch Harden. Literary worse in every single aspect of basketball...

The only aspect Harden is clearly better is rebounding and shooting 3s. When you adjust for era Iverson matches his numbers just fine.

Driving, finishing at the rim, drawing fouls, short mid-range area, shooting 3s, passing, defense...

limbo wrote:

GhosDini wrote:

limbo wrote:Is this a joke?

Iverson can't touch Harden. Literary worse in every single aspect of basketball...

The only aspect Harden is clearly better is rebounding and shooting 3s. When you adjust for era Iverson matches his numbers just fine.

Driving, finishing at the rim, drawing fouls, short mid-range area, shooting 3s, passing, defense...

I disagree. Iverson did this as good as anyone throughout history, while going up against better bigs in the paint. I don't see Harden having his way if he tried running up in the paint against the guys A.I dealt with.

limbo wrote:

GhosDini wrote:

limbo wrote:Is this a joke?

Iverson can't touch Harden. Literary worse in every single aspect of basketball...

The only aspect Harden is clearly better is rebounding and shooting 3s. When you adjust for era Iverson matches his numbers just fine.

Driving, finishing at the rim, drawing fouls, short mid-range area, shooting 3s, passing, defense...

If Iverson played in this era you would see his numbers go up across the board. If Harden played in the early 00s you'd see his numbers drop across the board. In this era its easier to drive, finish at the rim, draw fouls, pick up assists, get open shots.

Iverson has better intangibles also. He has more heart and is more clutch.

GhosDini wrote:

limbo wrote:

GhosDini wrote:
The only aspect Harden is clearly better is rebounding and shooting 3s. When you adjust for era Iverson matches his numbers just fine.

Driving, finishing at the rim, drawing fouls, short mid-range area, shooting 3s, passing, defense...

If Iverson played in this era you would see his numbers go up across the board. If Harden played in the early 00s you'd see his numbers drop across the board. In this era its easier to drive, finish at the rim, draw fouls, pick up assists, get open shots.

Iverson has better intangibles also. He has more heart and is more clutch.

Ah yes the best metric for Basketball 'more heart' lol

Is there statistical evidence that iverson was more clutch than harden?

So far, Iverson.
In a couple of seasons it will be Harden.

GhosDini wrote:If Iverson played in this era you would see his numbers go up across the board. If Harden played in the early 00s you'd see his numbers drop across the board. In this era its easier to drive, finish at the rim, draw fouls, pick up assists, get open shots.

Iverson has better intangibles also. He has more heart and is more clutch.

It's not really a 'numbers' thing, Harden is just better...

Harden separates himself from the average NBA player offensively now to a far larger degree than Iverson did in his own era...

Iverson wasn't even better than young Kobe, T-Mac, Vince Carter, Ray Allen and Baron Davis in his own era... How do you expect him to compete with a guy like Harden who's been one of the best offensive players in the league in the last 6 seasons, with far greater competition for that mantle?

lol

Harden is super disrespected around these parts lol

Iverson for his impact on the culture

But as a basketball player there’s a fair margin there.

The man is currently still having one of the greatest offensive rs runs of all time. And still in his prime.
Can’t believe someone mentioned inflated stats. The dude drops 10+ assists on the regular and gives you 40 whenever he feels like it. Absurd talent


Top 5 SG of all time.

2 words: Western Conference

Love AI, but Harden 7 days a week. Also, Harden played in the West his entire career until now. AI was in a weak East his entire prime.

Iverson was probably not a top-5 player at his peak in his own era and probably wouldn't be a top-10 player today. His efficiency would go up a little bit with more space to operate, and his defense would be less bad, but I'm not sure he's even as good as Dame.

What AI needed was a really good jump shot to capitalize on those handles and all those teams that went under on screens against him. If AI could shoot like Harden everything would be different. He'd be one of best offensive players ever.

GhosDini wrote:

JN61 wrote:Iverson:

24.4k points, 3.4k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 2k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
11× NBA All-Star
2× NBA All-Star Game MVP
3× All-NBA First Team
3× All-NBA Second Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
NBA Rookie of the Year
4× NBA scoring champion
3× NBA steals leader

Harden:

21.7k points, 4.8k rebounds, 5.6k assists, 1.3k steals

1x NBA Most Valuable Player
9× NBA All-Star
6× All-NBA First Team
1x All-NBA Third Team
1x NBA Sixth Man of the Year
3× NBA scoring champion
1x NBA assists leader


It is close. You can make point either player being ahead of other. Iverson having more all-star selections and raw statistics but Harden having more all-first team selections and he still has good 5 productive years in him. So no matter what one thinks as of now its pretty clear that Harden eventually clearly passes Iverson in everything. But for most of us Harden was ahead of Iverson already so. I have Harden about 15 to 20 spots ahead of Iverson on the all-time rankings.

You said for alot if you Harden already passed him up. At what point did Harden pass up Iverson in your opinion and based on what?

As I wrote they are very similar in terms of career accolades. What puts Harden ahead of Iverson in my books is the playmaking (he has been top 5 playmaker for long time now) combined by being the by far the best shooting guard in the league for a long time now. We know Iverson had to battle it out vs likes of Kobe and few years of Jordan but still.

A lot of people would also bring up shooting numbers being in favour of Harden (massively so) but to me the playmaking and willingness of it is the difference maker. When he passed Iverson would be around after his MVP year. He really needed that MVP to be put in the same conversation and now that he has it, Harden is also more well rounded player.

Easily James Harden and it's not even close