HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years)

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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#101 » by hippesthippo » Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:07 pm

The_Hater wrote:
Yuri Vaultin wrote:
The_Hater wrote:I think Poku is skilled and has solid upside, but I think MVP is way to high a ceiling for him.

Yes he’s skinny and weak and needs to get a lot stronger, but didn’t people say the same things about KD as a rookie? But he still averaged 20 ppg and looked like he belonged. Maybe he’s more Jonathan Bender than KD. And most likely he’s somewhere in between the 2.

People seem to forget that Poku is the youngest player in the NBA.

Durant as a rookie was a whole 4 months older!!!

8-)


I worry about how much weight and strength he can actually add to that frame. He has really narrow shoulders and his Center or gravity feels like it’s 6 feet from the floor. He plays with no knee bend to help his own spend, quickness and core strength.

Need to fast forward 2 years and see what happens though.


I was trying to figure out what looked so off when I watched him [besides being skinny]. That's it right there. Well put.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#102 » by Ryoga Hibiki » Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:34 pm

Harry Garris wrote:
dirkforpres wrote:He won’t even be in the NBA in 10 years. No way this guy lasts longer than Andrea Bargnani


Why wouldn't he? He's way more skilled than Bargnani is
I really don't think so.
Andrea wasted his (perceived) potential, but he was not a #1 just because Colangelo was drunk.

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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#103 » by Harry Garris » Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:37 pm

Ryoga Hibiki wrote:
Harry Garris wrote:
dirkforpres wrote:He won’t even be in the NBA in 10 years. No way this guy lasts longer than Andrea Bargnani


Why wouldn't he? He's way more skilled than Bargnani is
I really don't think so.
Andrea wasted his (perceived) potential, but he was not a #1 just because Colangelo was drunk.

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Barg could score but he couldn't pass or make plays for others at all and he didn't have much of a handle. Poku is already way ahead of him in terms of his all around offensive game.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#104 » by Hroz » Wed Mar 31, 2021 10:42 pm

Some players can put on muscle some can't.

If he puts on muscle then he can be good.
Great takes a lot more. (top 20 player in the league)
Sometimes when putting on muscle it affects a players athleticism or movement.
Maybe his shooting doesn't develop.
Maybe he has injuries.
Players at his age are rarely that skinny.
Giannis wasn't that skinny comeon.
Plus Giannis has a better frame for adding muscle.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#106 » by johanliebert » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:06 pm

Harry Garris wrote:
Ryoga Hibiki wrote:
Harry Garris wrote:
Why wouldn't he? He's way more skilled than Bargnani is
I really don't think so.
Andrea wasted his (perceived) potential, but he was not a #1 just because Colangelo was drunk.

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Barg could score but he couldn't pass or make plays for others at all and he didn't have much of a handle. Poku is already way ahead of him in terms of his all around offensive game.

Bargnani was a very skilled player this kid isn’t there right now.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#107 » by Goudelock » Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:51 pm

UcanUwill wrote:NBA is so stupid sometimes, great Euroleague players bust, meanwhile Aleksey freaking Pokusevski putting 20 point games in his rookie season, how does that make any sense lol


Has he done enough to be considered a better player than Spannoulis tho?
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#108 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Apr 1, 2021 12:58 am

Bargnani was a very skilled player this kid isn’t there right now.


Bargs was 2 years older as a rookie and as a 19 year old twig Poku is posting a better TRB% (11) than Bargs ever posted his entire career (High was 10.4) and near the same AST% (11.4) as Bargs career high (11.6).

Poku has more skill in every facet outside shooting, which generally is an area where players without totally broken shots can improve.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#110 » by GYK » Thu Apr 1, 2021 8:19 am

I love the idea of out of nowhere’s being MVP caliber like Giannis Joker and Kawhi. I’m all for it. Don’t see it in the least but all for the possibility. If I was better on a Thunder player reaching MVP caliber it’s SGA and would bank on his finesse load carrying ability getting him there.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#111 » by NO-KG-AI » Thu Apr 1, 2021 1:27 pm

Poku has some fire and actually looks like he is competitive and cares about basketball too.

Remember that psyche eval they had done on Bargs that basically said he was lazy and didn't care, and the Raps tried to spin it as if he was some Larry Bird esque killer, or it was like he was a basketball sociopath that was going to murk the league? lmao.

It's crazy how amazing the Raps front office is compared to how hilariously awful it was before that.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#112 » by Mirotic12 » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:15 pm

UcanUwill wrote:NBA is so stupid sometimes, great Euroleague players bust, meanwhile Aleksey freaking Pokusevski putting 20 point games in his rookie season, how does that make any sense lol


It makes sense when you consider that there is no tanking ever in EuroLeague. Also, due to the amount of games in the season (34), and the amount of teams that make the playoffs (8), there are no teams taking off games in EuroLeague either. There is no load management in EuroLeague, there is no taking off defensive possessions in EuroLeague....

In EuroLeague, if a coach starts losing a bunch of games, he is rewarded with being quickly fired, not with good draft positioning. In EuroLeague, teams and players can't choose when to take certain games, or certain defensive possessions off. Taking games off, will quickly lead to players being cut, even the best players, and pacing on defense will almost always get you benched.

In the NBA, there are lots of open rotation places for players on teams that are purposely tanking for draft positioning. So the NBA actually rewards NBA teams for playing guys that are going to help their teams lose games. It's two completely different worlds, in terms of the competitive philosophy.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#113 » by Mirotic12 » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:20 pm

DroseReturnChi wrote:hes a poor man's giannis. dont see mvp with that many mistakes.


draftnightsuit wrote:He moves like a SF. He’s even handling the ball in the PnR like a guard. They should keep him on the perimeter and model him after Durant.

He’s definitely no big man.


yannisk wrote:There are some parallels with Giannis, both tall, lanky with guard skills coming to the nba from the Greek a2 division

Giannis had the work ethic and the genes. Let's see if Poku is the same. But he looks very talented from the highlights i've seen and more in control than rookie Giannis.


MrGrim wrote:Seriously though he reminds me more of a young Dirk (before you go crazy, go back and look at clips of [b]young[b] Dirk: he was much more fluid in his first few years in the league than even the 2011 championship version) or even an even more raw young Durant. Obviously that's no guarantee he'll reach the level of those players, but he's already got the most important physical tool in basketball: height.


Ryoga Hibiki wrote:Jonathan Bender? A guy with similar build and skills to Poku.


BlazersBroncos wrote:I think that Kukoc is really the comparison that should be spread around. Both had/have insane hand-eye coordination for their size and move so well with the ball for being tall AF.

I think Poku has the potential to be better as a scorer though.


I think the correct comparison for a European NBA player is Pau Gasol. Not exactly the same type of players or anything. But young Pau Gasol is by far and away the closest comparison for Poku. That doesn't mean that Poku will end up as the same type of player that Pau was going forward.

The NBA changed Pau's playing style quite a bit, from what he was in Europe. But that was when the NBA valued different things in big men, than it does now. Still, young Pau was clearly the most similar player to current Poku.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#114 » by Ryoga Hibiki » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:45 pm

m
Mirotic12 wrote:I think the correct comparison for a European NBA player is Pau Gasol. Not exactly the same type of players or anything. But young Pau Gasol is by far and away the closest comparison for Poku. That doesn't mean that Poku will end up as the same type of player that Pau was going forward.

The NBA changed Pau's playing style quite a bit, from what he was in Europe. But that was when the NBA valued different things in big men, than it does now. Still, young Pau was clearly the most similar player to current Poku.

well, the "young" Pau Gasol I remember was actually a couple of years older than Poku, but he was also on another planet as a player.
That had european goat potential written all over himself, during his last season with Barcelona
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#115 » by UcanUwill » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:49 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:
UcanUwill wrote:NBA is so stupid sometimes, great Euroleague players bust, meanwhile Aleksey freaking Pokusevski putting 20 point games in his rookie season, how does that make any sense lol


I makes sense when you consider that there is no tanking ever in EuroLeague. Also, due to the amount of games in the season (34), and the amount of teams that make the playoffs (8), there are no teams taking off games in EuroLeague either. There is no load management in EuroLeague, there is no taking off defensive possessions in EuroLeague....

In EuroLeague, if a coach starts losing a bunch of games, he is rewarded with being quickly fired, not with good draft positioning. In EuroLeague, teams and players can't choose when to take certain games, or certain defensive possessions off. Taking games off, will quickly lead to players being cut, even the best players, and pacing on defense will almost always get you benched.

In the NBA, there are lots of open rotation places for players on teams that are purposely tanking for draft positioning. So the NBA actually rewards NBA teams for playing guys that are going to help their teams lose games. It's two completely different worlds, in terms of the competitive philosophy.


Yeah, those are good points, but still NBA is so hard to grasp sometimes. Like we see great Euroleague players come to the NBA sometimes, and they often struggle to be relevant at all, and it make it seem like NBA is so much better than any other league, I mean it is, but it makes it seem even more so that way, but then they will bring young Euro scrubs and they will play very well in the NBA very quickly. So is NBA this good, or is it not, which one is it.

I guess NBA is just very reliant on natural talent, like Pokusevski is more talented than Campazzo one would probably say, I mean Campazzo at 19 years old was a nobody, he just grinded for a decade to become good, were Pokusevski is just naturally more talented, he can show flashes of brilliance already, and if you give these players minutes and when they have a chance to practice with NBA players and coaches, these players improve rapidly, more rapid that these Euro stars who grinded for years to reach this level. Of course tanking and the fact that some of the NBA teams arent't really playing for wins, so they always have more of the intend to play young guys, but as I said sometimes it is just so hard to grasp NBA talent level, NBA loves drafting Euro scrubs with high picks and fans love those picks, but when you bring a posibility to sign Euroleague star, fans and NBA itself always act like these players are garbage, it is a conundrum.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#116 » by Mirotic12 » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:54 pm

UcanUwill wrote:Yeah, those are good points, but still NBA is so hard to grasp sometimes. Like we see great Euroleague players come to the NBA sometimes, and they often struggle to be relevant at all, and it make it seem like NBA is so much better than any other league, I mean it is, but it makes it seem even more so that way, but then they will bring young Euro scrubs and they will play very well in the NBA very quickly. So is NBA this good, or is it not, which one is it.

I guess NBA is just very reliant on natural talent, like Pokusevski is more talented than Campazzo one would probably say, I mean Campazzo at 19 years old was a nobody, he just grinded for a decade to become good, were Pokusevski is just naturally more talented, he can show flashes of brilliance already, and if you give these players minutes and when they have a chance to practice with NBA players and coaches, these players improve rapidly, more rapid that these Euro stars who grinded for years to reach this level. Of course tanking and the fact that some of the NBA teams arent't really playing for wins, so they always have more of the intend to play young guys, but as I said sometimes it is just so hard to grasp NBA talent level, NBA loves drafting Euro scrubs with high picks and fans love those picks, but when you bring a posibility to sign Euroleague star, fans and NBA itself always act like these players are garbage, it is a conundrum.


It's actually very obvious why that is. It's because the NBA really, really, REALLY doesn't want a veteran EuroLeague star to succeed in the NBA. While on the other hand, the NBA really, really, REALLY wants young European "talents" to succeed in the NBA.

It's purely 100% about marketing the NBA as the world's best league, with all of the world's best players, and about squeezing every single dollar possible out of world basketball money into the NBA.

If basketball fans around the world started to think that veteran EuroLeague players can succeed in the NBA, then suddenly the NBA isn't the best league in the world, with all of the best players in the world anymore.

If basketball fans around the world started to see the NBA draft and NBA rookies as being all Americans again, then suddenly the NBA isn't a so-called world league with "all the best talent in the world" anymore.

As soon as this perception changes among fans, the NBA (meaning its owners), loses extremely enormous sums of money. Not to mention that the possible ultimate nightmare scenario of NBA owners could happen........the EuroLeague could start getting big TV deals in the USA, like European football (soccer) did.

That would be an ultimate financial doomsday scenario for NBA ownerships.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#117 » by jake_swivel » Fri Apr 2, 2021 3:57 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:I think the correct comparison for a European NBA player is Pau Gasol. Not exactly the same type of players or anything. But young Pau Gasol is by far and away the closest comparison for Poku. That doesn't mean that Poku will end up as the same type of player that Pau was going forward.

The NBA changed Pau's playing style quite a bit, from what he was in Europe. But that was when the NBA valued different things in big men, than it does now. Still, young Pau was clearly the most similar player to current Poku.


I don’t see that at all. Poku is a straight up guard on offense. His strength is ball handling (and passing) and looks to lead the break. He hasn’t shown that he looks to consistently score. Pau was a post up threat and spot up shooter. Pau was a scorer from the jump. Good passer too, but he did so in a radically different manner than Poku.

Defensively, Poku’s a weak side shot blocker who can disrupt passing lanes with his length, but has zero post defense and currently doesn’t have great man to man defense. Pau was a post defender with a good concept of team defense.

I don’t think there is a good comparison for Poku. Closest I’ve seen is maybe Kukoc, but that doesn’t really fit either. He’s too raw to have a comparison at the moment. He doesn’t look like an NBA player outside of brief flashes (jaw dropping as they can be).
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#118 » by Mirotic12 » Fri Apr 2, 2021 4:01 pm

jake_swivel wrote:I don’t see that at all. Poku is a straight up guard on offense. His strength is ball handling (and passing) and looks to lead the break. He hasn’t shown that he looks to consistently score. Pau was a post up threat and spot up shooter. Pau was a scorer from the jump. Good passer too, but he did so in a radically different manner than Poku.

Defensively, he’s a weak side shot blocker who can disrupt passing lanes with his length, but has zero post defense and currently doesn’t have great man to man defense. Pau was a post defender with a good concept of team defense.

I don’t think there is a good comparison for Poku. Closest I’ve seen is maybe Kukoc, but that doesn’t really fit either. He’s too raw to have a comparison at the moment. He doesn’t look like an NBA player outside of brief flashes (jaw dropping as they can be).


I watched Pau Gasol when he was a young player in Spain's youth teams and with Barca. He was basically the exact same player Poku is now, only he was bigger, I would say by about 2 inches and 20 pounds, and he was also noticeably more athletic.

As I said, the NBA changed what kind of player Pau was a lot, because back in that time there was still that ridiculous untrue stereotype and false myth that if a 7 footer played that style they were "soft" and a team "couldn't win" with such a big man.
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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#119 » by jake_swivel » Fri Apr 2, 2021 4:30 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:I watched Pau Gasol when he was a young player in Spain's youth teams and with Barca. He was basically the exact same player Poku is now, only he was bigger, I would say by about 2 inches and 20 pounds, and he was also noticeably more athletic.

As I said, the NBA changed what kind of player Pau was a lot, because back in that time there was still that ridiculous untrue stereotype and false myth that if a 7 footer played that style they were "soft" and a team "couldn't win" with such a big man.


Guess i’ll have to take your word on it. From the highlight reel from before he got to the nba, his post game looks very well developed. Poku has no postgame whatsoever. Pau was definitely WAY more athletic than Poku, though. He’s authoritative in the lane. He’s not all finesse, which Poku is. Pau also averaged no less than 57% FG shooting for FC Barcelona and Poku is at 30% right now for the thunder.

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Re: HOT TAKE: Aleksej Pokusevski will win the NBA MVP (Within the Next 10 Years) 

Post#120 » by UcanUwill » Fri Apr 2, 2021 4:41 pm

jake_swivel wrote:
Mirotic12 wrote:I watched Pau Gasol when he was a young player in Spain's youth teams and with Barca. He was basically the exact same player Poku is now, only he was bigger, I would say by about 2 inches and 20 pounds, and he was also noticeably more athletic.

As I said, the NBA changed what kind of player Pau was a lot, because back in that time there was still that ridiculous untrue stereotype and false myth that if a 7 footer played that style they were "soft" and a team "couldn't win" with such a big man.


Guess i’ll have to take your word on it. From the highlight reel from before he got to the nba, his post game looks very well developed. Poku has no postgame whatsoever. Pau was definitely WAY more athletic than Poku, though. He’s authoritative in the lane. He’s not all finesse, which Poku is. Pau also averaged no less than 57% FG shooting for FC Barcelona and Poku is at 30% right now for the thunder.



Pau was just a world class tier 1 prospect, the fact he wasnt picked number one is just as much of the joke as Doncic not being picked number one. Pau was insane, overall amazing career, yet he is still very underrated IMO. I would rank Pau way above Pokusevski.

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