Rapinoe vs Green... who you got?

[Wallace_Wallace]

Women want equal pay? Well maybe start bringing a similar performance as men and not lose to U15 boys as a national team. Stuff is plain embarassing. Or tennis were the women play somewhere around half the time men play.

If as much money was thrown at girl's sports as boy's, and if girls could see themselves making a sustainable living as professional athletes (why would any girl want to become a professional athlete when the pay is so meagre?), perhaps there would be more skilled female athletes.

That kind of money was not there from the beginning. Most sports started very humble with athletes often having to work alongside and grew over many decades, in football it took almost a century. Most money is gained through revenue and sponsorship now. The last football world cup the men teams generated a combined 6 billion, the woman over 110 million. Relatively speaking Men earned got less than 10% of that revenue while women got almost 25%. Wanting the same amount than men is ridiculous, the football organizations would have to pump in far more money than the women generate.
Oh and let us not forget that women get a basic income of 100k while men get nothing yet women like Rapinoe also want all the bonuses men make while retaining the basic income. Double standards nothing more.

I knew it was a big difference, but I didn't know it was this much

[MrPerfect1]

-By contrast, anything you see in the WNBA is stuff everyone here can do and has done. Layups- Check. Bounce Passes-Check. 3 Pointers from less than NBA distance-Check.

Because this is a basketball forum...

Go on a tennis forum, and everyone can do and has done everything women's tennis players do.

That isn't true at all. Even at state level Boys High School Tournaments, the number of players who can consistently place 100 mph serves is very low.

When I attended the Boys Division 2 State Tennis Tournament, almost nobody was serving consistently at the 100 mph range. There was the #4 Overall Seed who was destroying opponents with like a 120 mph serve and he was the anomoly.

Now yes, WI tennis probably is nothing compared to CA or FL, but still these were Top HS players, not random people in a forum. Most players on a Tennis Forum couldn't either. Whereas everyone here can make layups and sometimes hit 3's from less rhan NBA distance.

[Optms]

If as much money was thrown at girl's sports as boy's, and if girls could see themselves making a sustainable living as professional athletes, perhaps there would be more skilled female athletes.

And there is a good reason not nearly as much money is invested into female sports. Its because little girls (generally) aren't keen on competitive competition as much as boys are. This isn't some evil conspiracy plan perpetrated over centuries of human civilization. Boys and girls are just different. Not just from a physical perspective but also a characteristic point of view.

Wow. This is some CLASSIC neanderthal right here. Congratulations.

I guess you also think that girls aren't well represented in areas like investments and engineering...because, you know, girls aren't that good with "math and science" stuff - right?

There are times I read posts on the GB and laugh at the stupidity...and then there are times where I read takes like this and have real concern for the world that my two daughters will enter - because of the prehistoric thinking of posts like this.

No, I actually think topics such as science and math are subjects both genders equally have a contest/love for. Not sure why you're jumping to conclusions about me based on one observation I made of girls and boys but its good to know we can discuss things here without attacking one another. Nice civil discussions.

[Doctor MJ]

Women's tennis is about as far from finesse as you can get. They just hit it back as hard as they can and hope the other player is the first one to sail one 20 feet beyond the baseline.
There's nothing except stereotypes supporting the notion that men's tennis is about power and women's tennis is about skill and touch. It's the opposite.

Hmm, there's a discussion to be had here but you're oversimplifying.

About 20 years ago the men's game was getting crippled by power and the women's game was more interesting. This was caused by racket technology which made women more powerful but made men too powerful. You were seeing guys win on grass who couldn't do anything except serve.

2 things changed that as I see it: 1) They changed the surfaces to slow down the game (except on clay, which was already slow as molasses), and 2) the next generation of players learned to be able to react fast enough to return those super-fast shots.

The result then is that while power in real ways still rules the men's game, the issues of "I only serve" dominance went away.

At that point the fact that there are just more top level male players than female players allowed greater physical dominance at the top by someone like Serena than we've seen from someone on the men's side.

Women's tennis 20 years ago was just hit it back hard while grunting like pigs. Meanwhile, here's the year end top 16 of 2001 for the ATP:
1 Lleyton Hewitt AUS 4,365 1 8 Increase 6
2 Gustavo Kuerten BRA 3,855 1 2 Decrease 1
3 Andre Agassi USA 3,520 2 6 Increase 3
4 Yevgeny Kafelnikov RUS 3,090 4 7 Increase 1
5 Juan Carlos Ferrero ESP 3,040 4 16 Increase 7
6 Sébastien Grosjean FRA 2,790 6 19 Increase 13
7 Patrick Rafter AUS 2,785 4 15 Increase 8
8 Tommy Haas GER 2,285 8 24 Increase 15
9 Tim Henman GBR 2,100 8 12 Increase 1
10 Pete Sampras USA 1,940 3 12 Decrease 7
11 Marat Safin RUS 1,920 1 11 Decrease 9
12 Goran Ivanišević CRO 1,761 12 132 Increase 117
13 Roger Federer SUI 1,745 12 30 Increase 16
14 Andy Roddick USA 1,573 14 156 Increase 142
15 Guillermo Cañas ARG 1,572 15 231 Increase 216
16 Àlex Corretja ESP 1,525 7 17 Decrease 8

No serve-only guys, except maybe Roddick.

There's so much context here you're not talking about:

1. Hewitt being #1 was always known as a sign that no one was actually good. He was never someone to be taken seriously as a top tier tennis talent.

2. Various women's players were more popular than Hewitt because everyone knew that Hewitt was going to get shoved to the side when someone with real talent got their s**t together.

3. Kuerten & Spaniards. Clay courters. Not to be taken seriously on real surfaces until they changed the real surfaces to be more like clay. (I should be clear that I have a lot of respect for those who can thrive on clay, but the play on clay is drastically different from the other surfaces and for many years you were either a clay guy or an "everything else" guy. Since the sport got its start on lawn rather than clay, to me this always made clay tennis a bit like playing basketball with trampolines.)

4. Agassi. Past prime, and still by far the best American because America hasn't produced a male player worth talking about since his generation other than Andy "I'd be the best in the world if the sport was just serving" Roddick.

5. Roddick was not even the most serve-only guy on that list. That was very clearly Ivanisevic.

6. All of the excitement at this point in time was on the women's side of things. Go look back at any of the media of the time.

[BK_2020]

The fact that you think clay is not a "real surface" tells me enough. Please stop.
Ivanisevic had enough of an all-court game to make to the FINALS of the French Open.
Not going to bother trying to look up attendance and revenue numbers for 2001. There's a reason why ATP events had prize purses of $400k while women's events with similar points value had $100k - $150k prize purses.

[shakes0]

Equal investment and return should be made at all levels that utilize public funds, beginning with public athletic programs for toddlers all the way on up to professional sports.

The fallacy that men’s sports are better or more entertaining is something we have all been indoctrinated into by sexist stereotypes present throughout our education.

fallacy?

[granger05]

I didn't see this posted yet:

LINK

[FNQ]

Remember when Steven Adams told us we shouldn't take political advice from pro athletes and everybody on here praised him? You guys cannot be so hypocritical

People praised that? That's stupid. Your job doesn't dictate how politically literate you are. He's just pandering

[Pharmcat]

Women want equal pay? Well maybe start bringing a similar performance as men and not lose to U15 boys as a national team. Stuff is plain embarassing. Or tennis were the women play somewhere around half the time men play.

If as much money was thrown at girl's sports as boy's, and if girls could see themselves making a sustainable living as professional athletes (why would any girl want to become a professional athlete when the pay is so meagre?), perhaps there would be more skilled female athletes.

USA women soccer is much better than USA men’s soccer which is a joke team that can’t even beat Honduras

[Dick Tate]

Men and women's Bball will always have a fundamental difference imposed by biology. Doen't necessarily mean one is better than the other.

sorry, but yes it does. that's the entire point of physical sports. and in basketball especially that difference is really glaring.

Bball is not only physical. It is also technical.

True, and it's that combination that draws the viewer.

[Raps in 4]

Women want equal pay? Well maybe start bringing a similar performance as men and not lose to U15 boys as a national team. Stuff is plain embarassing. Or tennis were the women play somewhere around half the time men play.

If as much money was thrown at girl's sports as boy's, and if girls could see themselves making a sustainable living as professional athletes (why would any girl want to become a professional athlete when the pay is so meagre?), perhaps there would be more skilled female athletes.

USA women soccer is much better than USA men’s soccer which is a joke team that can’t even beat Honduras

Because men's soccer isn't a priority in the US. Most athletic youth are funnelled into other sports.

[Beethoven]

I dislike rapinoe in that stupid Postmates commercial they kept playing on youtube last year.

"support your local restaurants and order..IN!"
"im missing my favorite local spots"

stfu

[bebopdeluxe]

And there is a good reason not nearly as much money is invested into female sports. Its because little girls (generally) aren't keen on competitive competition as much as boys are. This isn't some evil conspiracy plan perpetrated over centuries of human civilization. Boys and girls are just different. Not just from a physical perspective but also a characteristic point of view.

Wow. This is some CLASSIC neanderthal right here. Congratulations.

I guess you also think that girls aren't well represented in areas like investments and engineering...because, you know, girls aren't that good with "math and science" stuff - right?

There are times I read posts on the GB and laugh at the stupidity...and then there are times where I read takes like this and have real concern for the world that my two daughters will enter - because of the prehistoric thinking of posts like this.

No, I actually think topics such as science and math are subjects both genders equally have a contest/love for. Not sure why you're jumping to conclusions about me based on one observation I made of girls and boys but its good to know we can discuss things here without attacking one another. Nice civil discussions.

Maybe before you make some blanket statement about girls not being as keen on "competitive competition" as boys (I found that particularly rich given that I will be be driving my daughter to her U12 travel softball practice later today), you provide research data that backs up the assertion that girls aren't as competitive as boys. Now, if you want to say that girls are raised in a different way - by parents, teachers and society at large - to not be as "competitive" as boys, I am all ears. But there is no "compitition chromosome" that boys have that girls don't.

This ties PERFECTLY into what Rapinoe is saying, by the way. A thought process that starts with an assumption that girls are not as "competitive" as boys is exactly what allows NCAA administrators to book 2nd-tier workout facilities for the womens' tournament teams...hell - why do they need excellent fitness facilities, anyway? There are a couple of ellipticals, some free weights - that should be enough for THEM, right?

I worked in the investment industry for over 30 years. I would say the percentage of women in the investment field - for much of my time was, at best, 10 percent. And let me ask you something - do you think that an aggressive, hard-charging 25-year old woman was viewed EXACTLY the same as a 25-year old man? Huh?

The man was "driven"...the woman could "be a bit of a bitch" (especially if it was "that time of the month"). The world of investments was as as competitive as sports - which is a lot of athletes go into the field. But the perception of the two sexes just drip with the kind of condescending ideas about the sexes that you had in your comment. Women in these fields deal with the stereotypes that you threw out in your post EVERY day in some of these male-dominated fields. The issue is NOT their ability to be competitive - it is the gender stereotypes that are driven into them from birth. Fortunately, my daughter isn't buying that ish...although she did have to finally make the switch from baseball to softball this past year (she played travel baseball until U11, when the speed of the game really started to be too much).

She has made the transition pretty well, with a bonus - she really likes her teammates, as opposed to some of the guys she played with - who never seemed to fully "accept" her (despite the efforts of the coaches). What a surprise...guys were unaccepting of a girl in their world - who would have expected THAT?

If you have some really good research that substantiates your position that girls are innately incapable of thriving in competitive environments, please post them. I would love to read them.

[chrisab123]

Women want equal pay? Well maybe start bringing a similar performance as men and not lose to U15 boys as a national team. Stuff is plain embarassing. Or tennis were the women play somewhere around half the time men play.

If as much money was thrown at girl's sports as boy's, and if girls could see themselves making a sustainable living as professional athletes (why would any girl want to become a professional athlete when the pay is so meagre?), perhaps there would be more skilled female athletes.

USA women soccer is much better than USA men’s soccer which is a joke team that can’t even beat Honduras

I'd put money on the U15 team against either

[eminence]

3. Kuerten & Spaniards. Clay courters. Not to be taken seriously on real surfaces until they changed the real surfaces to be more like clay. (I should be clear that I have a lot of respect for those who can thrive on clay, but the play on clay is drastically different from the other surfaces and for many years you were either a clay guy or an "everything else" guy. Since the sport got its start on lawn rather than clay, to me this always made clay tennis a bit like playing basketball with trampolines.)

I think tennis was born as an indoor sport, mainly on stone/wooden courts prior to moving out to the lawn.

[ReasonablySober]

So I see a majority of people voting here didn't bother to see what Rapinoe actually said.

[Pharmcat]

Green was talking specifically about the WNBA anyway, has nothing to do with USWNT, so not sure why Rapinoe interjected here

Because draymond interjected and also tagged people to his tweets who had not said anything on the issue. Megan mentions this, not sure if you read her whole comments

[bebopdeluxe]

So I see a majority of people voting here didn't bother to see what Rapinoe actually said.

Does that surprise you? It's the GB on RealGM. That is how things roll.

Someone with a sense of nuance (NOT DRAYMOND GREEN) - as well as someone who grew up hopefully understanding what it is like to be a member of a marginalized group in society - would understand that the point is not equal pay for the athletes - it is about resources, support, media coverage, development dollars...all of the things that provide opportunity to those in society who have perhaps seen their desires be marginalized.

I assume that Draymond also hates Title IX (if he even understands what Title IX is and why it was important). In a truly egalitarian society, we should have the resources to help those who have suffered because of issues like racism and sexism (ummm....the GB does agree that our society has had DEEP roots in sexism...right? Right? OK - everybody nod your head...right...). There will always be tons of money for elite male athletes...just like there is always tons of money for elite male EVERYTHING (hedge fund managers, CEO's and so on). Rapinoe - who by the way has been WAY out in front on the Black Lives Matter movement (probably more than Dray, but I digress) - understands that as a gay female athlete, she needs to use her voice and platform to speak out about racial injustice...which is why she was probably so disappointed that Dray chose to so openly drag female athletes like he did. Rapinoe didn't have to be so open about Black Lives Matter - but she understood the importance of calling out systemic injustice based of 400 years of racism in our country (as well as 400 years of sexism).

It is in that light that she is calling Dray out. Good for her.

[BK_2020]

Yeah Draymond **** Green doesn't know what it's like to be a member of a marginalized group in a society.
Seriously read the dumb takes you are about to post.

[Lalouie]

Women should get paid a percentage of the generated revenue, just like the men.

Well said!

wnba loses $10,000,000 per year and have for 24yrs
-$10,000,000 ÷ 140 players = you owe us money