Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors?

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Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors?

'06 Lakers - Lamar Odom (26ys), Smush Parker, Kwame Brown, Chris Mihm
26
21%
'21 Warriors - Draymond Green (30yrs), Wiggins, Oubre Jr., Wiseman
96
79%
 
Total votes: 122

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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#21 » by Onus » Tue May 4, 2021 6:37 pm

The thing is that Kerr was in development mode rather than winning as many games as possible. He said countless times this year winning games wasn’t a priority.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#22 » by Mujahydeen » Tue May 4, 2021 6:47 pm

When you throw out everyone's best player, there were at least 10 worse rosters than Lakers in 2006, probably more. Bottom 8 of the East was pure, uncut garbage, Wolves and Blazers were also horrible. Those Laker teams were bad when you compare them to other installments from Kobe's career, but they were nothing unusual for a middling team of that era.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#23 » by TinmanZBoy » Tue May 4, 2021 6:49 pm

The thing is Kobe made his teammates look worse than they are, Curry is the opposite... so not sure
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#24 » by Asianiac_24 » Tue May 4, 2021 6:59 pm

TinmanZBoy wrote:The thing is Kobe made his teammates look worse than they are, Curry is the opposite... so not sure


This is not true at all. Contrary to Kobe's reputation, he actually elevates his teammates a lot, especially bigs.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#25 » by levon » Tue May 4, 2021 7:04 pm

Draymond even now is a more valuable player than Odom was then. Odom had higher upside but was a wildly variable performer. Then you have Wiggins, who can at least score sometimes when Curry is on the bench, and has actually turned into a good defender. Looney is a sort of solid big. And you have Oubre who in theory is a solid 3nD wing.

fwiw, if you took Kobe and Curry off their respective teams and had them play each other in a horrible seven game series, I'd expect the Warriors to win more than half of those in 100 simulations.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#26 » by Trey24 » Tue May 4, 2021 7:05 pm

Anyone that votes for that Lakers team outside of Kobe is a hater. SMUSH PARKER, BRIAN COOK, CHRIS MIHM! Just to give you a sense of how bad that roster was, we thought Mihm was a solid prospect (in fairness, he was before injury). It was Kobe, Lamar, and then 8th-9th guy off the bench players. Luke Walton was the best distributor on the team outside of Kobe.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#27 » by SF_Warriors » Tue May 4, 2021 7:22 pm

Man that Lakers supporitng cast was truly terrible. It was Kobe, Odom, and a bunch of guys I would not take over current day kent bazemore.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#28 » by nikster » Tue May 4, 2021 7:27 pm

levon wrote:Draymond even now is a more valuable player than Odom was then. Odom had higher upside but was a wildly variable performer. Then you have Wiggins, who can at least score sometimes when Curry is on the bench, and has actually turned into a good defender. Looney is a sort of solid big. And you have Oubre who in theory is a solid 3nD wing.

fwiw, if you took Kobe and Curry off their respective teams and had them play each other in a horrible seven game series, I'd expect the Warriors to win more than half of those in 100 simulations.

it has to be relative to the league tho. Better question is if you took Kobe and Curry off and had them replay their respective seasons a 100 time who would have the better record
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#29 » by Ckay » Tue May 4, 2021 7:29 pm

levon wrote:Draymond even now is a more valuable player than Odom was then. Odom had higher upside but was a wildly variable performer. Then you have Wiggins, who can at least score sometimes when Curry is on the bench, and has actually turned into a good defender. Looney is a sort of solid big. And you have Oubre who in theory is a solid 3nD wing.

fwiw, if you took Kobe and Curry off their respective teams and had them play each other in a horrible seven game series, I'd expect the Warriors to win more than half of those in 100 simulations.

Former All Star Draymond Green too.

Kobe doesn't have any of that.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#30 » by BoatsNZones » Tue May 4, 2021 7:32 pm

cpower wrote:06 Lakers is so much better...they are better than today's mavs

06 Lakers: 2.53 SRS
Kobe: 7.6 BPM
Odom: 2.7 BPM
Parker: 0.1 BPM
George: -0.8 BPM
Mihm: -1.9 BPM
Cook: -0.1 BPM

21 Warriors: 0.006 SRS
Curry: 8.1 BPM
Green: 1.1 BPM
Wiggins: -0.8 BPM
Oubre: -2.1 BPM
Wiseman: -5.4 BPM
Looney: -1.4 BPM

lakers had 4 players that higher than 15 PER. Warriors : only Stephen.

Worth mentioning the Warriors are 32-25 with Curry (56%), 1-7 without (12.5%).

That said, I don’t agree that the Lakers are “so much better”. There are other metrics and considerations that paint those Lakers to be as terrible as I remember. Both are certainly bottom 2 teams in the league without either.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#31 » by art_tatum » Tue May 4, 2021 8:11 pm

Considering all warriors have -bpm except curry and dray, and the fact that oubre and wiseman (two people u listed) haven't been playing And when they did it negatively affected the warriors
It's the warriors.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#32 » by Doranku » Tue May 4, 2021 8:56 pm

Mujahydeen wrote:When you throw out everyone's best player, there were at least 10 worse rosters than Lakers in 2006, probably more. Bottom 8 of the East was pure, uncut garbage, Wolves and Blazers were also horrible. Those Laker teams were bad when you compare them to other installments from Kobe's career, but they were nothing unusual for a middling team of that era.


Because the bottom 8 of the east this year are such world beaters, right? :roll: Not to mention the Lakers played in the West, and I guarantee you the absolute garbage that the Thunder and Rockets throw out on the floor every night are much worse than those Wolves and Blazers teams. The Wolves had prime Garnett along with Wally and Ricky Davis dropping 20 a game ffs.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#33 » by dennythedino » Tue May 4, 2021 9:25 pm

Mihm and Kwame were at least serviceable backups, although they shouldn't have been starting.

Odom is probably the best non-Kobe/Steph player between the two teams (at least better than current Draymond, not prime Draymond)

I also wouldn't be surprised if most of GSW's bench is playing overseas next year.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#34 » by Young gun 6 » Tue May 4, 2021 10:13 pm

It’s easily Lakers.

Poll rightfully reflects that.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#35 » by WarriorGM » Tue May 4, 2021 10:14 pm

Draymond derives a lot of his worth being next to Steph. Without Steph the Warrior were the last place team even with Draymond. Cannot be sure what the Lakers 2006 would be without Kobe. Saying the 2006 Lakers would have been worse is based on very little.

Half the 2021 Warriors or 7 players have been in the NBA for less than 2 years. Only 3 players on the 2006 Lakers were that green.

Don't know why the 2006 Lakers are the comparison when the 2005 Lakers had a worse record.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#36 » by DCasey91 » Tue May 4, 2021 10:37 pm

Peregrine01 wrote:Looking at how bad the rest of the Warriors are, it's rather criminal that Curry's usage rate isn't higher than it is. Check it out, compared to his teammates with >800 minutes played:

Curry: 34%
Poole: 25%
Wiseman: 23%
Wiggins: 22%
Bazemore: 17%

Here's the 06 Lakers (>1500 mins played):

Kobe: 39%
Odom: 18%
Smush: 17%
Mihm: 19%
Cook: 18%
Kwame: 14%

The Warriors are probably too egalitarian (and Curry probably too unselfish) in a way that hurts their overall team success while Kobe wasn't passing to guys like Smush or Mihm.


I 100% agree on the egalitarian thing, the majority of the shots should go to Curry and Wiggins, Wiggins is inefficient and inconsistent but with Curry’s gravity at least he can score 20+ a night.
When he sits the offense should run through him, it was too much motion which makes the warriors offense look worse when Curry sits. Their defense is solid though just needs a secondary option, Wiggins can provide that albeit average he should take 20+ shots a night.

Difference between shooting and scoring at a heavy volume. Kobe had no conscious to take 30+ shots.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#37 » by levon » Tue May 4, 2021 10:46 pm

nikster wrote:
levon wrote:Draymond even now is a more valuable player than Odom was then. Odom had higher upside but was a wildly variable performer. Then you have Wiggins, who can at least score sometimes when Curry is on the bench, and has actually turned into a good defender. Looney is a sort of solid big. And you have Oubre who in theory is a solid 3nD wing.

fwiw, if you took Kobe and Curry off their respective teams and had them play each other in a horrible seven game series, I'd expect the Warriors to win more than half of those in 100 simulations.

it has to be relative to the league tho. Better question is if you took Kobe and Curry off and had them replay their respective seasons a 100 time who would have the better record

That's fair. I think Kevin Pelton actually has a model that does this, that's how he does the preseason predictions. Maybe it can be done somewhat reliably in 2K. I also think it depends on Kerr and his usage of the motion offense, his drive to win games vs develop, etc. I think a Wiggins/Draymond/Oubre/Wiseman team playing with intention is bad, but not Houston Rockets bad. Maybe even close to this year's Pelicans. I think Odom/Walton/Smush/Mihm is Houston Rockets bad and maybe even OKC bad.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#38 » by Liam_Gallagher » Wed May 5, 2021 1:47 pm

TinmanZBoy wrote:The thing is Kobe made his teammates look worse than they are, Curry is the opposite... so not sure


Yeah Kwame, Smush and Devean George looked so good after they stopped playing with Kobe. Oh wait.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#39 » by Liam_Gallagher » Wed May 5, 2021 1:51 pm

Doranku wrote:
Mujahydeen wrote:When you throw out everyone's best player, there were at least 10 worse rosters than Lakers in 2006, probably more. Bottom 8 of the East was pure, uncut garbage, Wolves and Blazers were also horrible. Those Laker teams were bad when you compare them to other installments from Kobe's career, but they were nothing unusual for a middling team of that era.


Because the bottom 8 of the east this year are such world beaters, right? :roll: Not to mention the Lakers played in the West, and I guarantee you the absolute garbage that the Thunder and Rockets throw out on the floor every night are much worse than those Wolves and Blazers teams. The Wolves had prime Garnett along with Wally and Ricky Davis dropping 20 a game ffs.


Yeah people are underrating tha talent from '06 and completely overrating the current talent. We might have more stars now, but teams were deeper back then. Plus the worst teams today (Thunder, Wolves, Pistons, etc.) are horrifically worse than the worst teams in '06. You have teams now that are straight up starting 2-way contract dudes to lose on purpose.
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Re: Better Supprting Cast - Kobe's '06 Lakers or Curry's '21 Warriors? 

Post#40 » by Jadoogar » Wed May 5, 2021 1:57 pm

Curry has the better team but Wiseman shouldn't be listed as a positive player

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