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The all-time should be compared to the greats they played against. So who were the best players, centers Wilt Chamberlain played against?

Bill Russell for one.
Kareem for two.

louc1970 wrote:The all-time should be compared to the greats they played against. So who were the best players, centers Wilt Chamberlain played against?

Well in the post season.

Russell (8 times)
Thurmond (3)
Reed (2)
Kareem (2)
Bellamy (2)
Lucas (1)

Seems pretty solid to me.

Wilt's obscene level of athleticism is well-documented, but Russell may be at a similar level athletically given that he was able to defend him despite being 3 inches shorter and a lot slimmer. They may be the 2 most athletic centers in NBA history.

ben10simmons wrote:Wilt's obscene level of athleticism is well-documented, but Russell may be at a similar level athletically given that he was able to defend him despite being 3 inches shorter and a lot slimmer. They may be the 2 most athletic centers in NBA history.

I saw Nate and Kareem battle, live. Nate would also shut down many modern slashers who try to attack the paint. The idea that modern centers would 'out athelete' Russell, Wilt, Kareem and Thurmond is absurd. These guys were also superbly coached in the fundamentals of body positioning, footwork, rebounding, defending without fouling. KAJ had years of absolutely dominating in finals of tournaments college ranks, against others who would today be NBA sophmores. So much so that rules were changed to try to make it competitive.

Many form their opinions based on video of these centers way past their prime, when they were still absurdly good, but not at their peak athletically.

On the radio I heard the other day stupidity about milkmen players again until the 80s or something, Very annoying. Would love to see a Jokic v Thurmond or Wilt in the paint.

Wilt was generational talent in any era

We still talking about plumbers and firemen?

dhsilv2 wrote:

louc1970 wrote:The all-time should be compared to the greats they played against. So who were the best players, centers Wilt Chamberlain played against?

Well in the post season.

Russell (8 times)
Thurmond (3)
Reed (2)
Kareem (2)
Bellamy (2)
Lucas (1)

Seems pretty solid to me.

Also, forever underrated Zelmo Beaty twice.

PizzaSteve wrote:

ben10simmons wrote:Wilt's obscene level of athleticism is well-documented, but Russell may be at a similar level athletically given that he was able to defend him despite being 3 inches shorter and a lot slimmer. They may be the 2 most athletic centers in NBA history.

I saw Nate and Kareem battle, live. Nate would also shut down many modern slashers who try to attack the paint. The idea that modern centers would 'out athelete' Russell, Wilt, Kareem and Thurmond is absurd. These guys were also superbly coached in the fundamentals of body positioning, footwork, rebounding, defending without fouling. KAJ had years of absolutely dominating in finals of tournaments college ranks, against others who would today be NBA sophmores. So much so that rules were changed to try to make it competitive.

Many form their opinions based on video of these centers way past their prime, when they were still absurdly good, but not at their peak athletically.

On the radio I heard the other day stupidity about milkmen players again until the 80s or something, Very annoying. Would love to see a Jokic v Thurmond or Wilt in the paint.

The taller greats aren't in question athletically imo, it's the perimeter guys who get the short end of the stick

Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

Balls Deep wrote:

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

Take step back, read some books and articles, watch some games, analyze the available data and then come back with an apology for Mr Russell.

ben10simmons wrote:Wilt's obscene level of athleticism is well-documented, but Russell may be at a similar level athletically given that he was able to defend him despite being 3 inches shorter and a lot slimmer. They may be the 2 most athletic centers in NBA history.

Also worth noting that wilt couldn't use his physical features as well as he could now under modern rules. How centers are allowed to play on offense with brutal backing down and such would be offensive foul 10/10 times in Wilts era. So wilt had actually very nifty fast finesse moves like his very underrated jumpshot.

We can't overstate rules differences ever too much when talking about this era. And it's never a reach to say all time greats from that era would be even better now than back then. Sure wilt might not average 8-10 blocks or 50 points per game but his overall impact would be far greater.

Balls Deep wrote:

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

People that watched him live thought he was the best player in the league and the player of his generation. To this day no one has come close to his level of total impact imo when you look at just how beyond everyone else he was defensively

That era of big man play was incredible, I didn't see it but watching clips and looking at stats, the gap from then to the modern era is smaller for bigs than for guards. and Wilt, Russ, Kareem are about as elite as it gets.

Heej wrote:

Balls Deep wrote:

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

People that watched him live thought he was the best player in the league and the player of his generation. To this day no one has come close to his level of total impact imo when you look at just how beyond everyone else he was defensively

I'm old enough to have watched that era, and never thought he was ever the player of his generation. Wilt was.

Wilt avergaed 29.9 against Russell head to head in an era when there was no defensive 3 seconds. UNder modern rules Wilt would've dominated even more. Russell was obviously an elite defender in his day. I wonder how defensive 3 seconds would've impacted his game.

Balls Deep wrote:

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

His college career was so overrated that he only won two NCAA championships. His win streak was capped off at 55 wins? What a turd! Everyone knows that the San Francisco Dons would've won without him, given their legendary history before and after Russell. I'm sure that his Olympic gold medal was a sham, too.

Seriously, Bill Russell probably makes the Naismith HOF without an NBA career.

Balls Deep wrote:

jstross wrote:Chamberlain averaged 29.9 a game vs Russell head to head, Russell 14.9. That's a plus 15. Enough said.

Russell is arguably the most overrated athlete in the history of sports. He gets carried by the dominant teams he was on and what he accomplished off the court (I.e., civil rights movement).

You should retire your screen name in embarrassment and start over after this take.