Would Len Bias or Reggie Lewis Have Changed Michael Jordan's Legacy?

[WillyJakkz]

Both of these guys would've been (Bias) or were (Lewis) Celtics who at the time mind you still had their core of Larry Bird Kevin McHale Robert Parrish and even Dennis Johnson.


Len Bias

Reggie Lewis

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Had they not passed away do you think Michael Jordan still has the same rise to fame as well as winning the titles he does? Keep in mind Bias was the "it" guy coming out of college while Lewis became a workhorse that became an All Star Player while taking the reigns from Bird and Co.

[dhsilv2]

Not really. The celtics still age out and I don't think either were more than allstar 2nd 3rd team all nba guys.

[SelfishPlayer]

Len Bias was overrated. He only averaged 20 or more points in college for a single season. It was his senior season as the #1 option.

[bisme37]

Very pleasant trip down memory lane, thanks OP.

[BenoUdrihFTL]

Bird was unfortunately pretty hobbled and on his last legs by the time MJ started winning rings so no, I don't imagine Bias or Lewis would've changed all that much

[Lalouie]

bias is all on paper and therefore the most overrated player in the history of basketball

he's right there with wayne estes except no one talks about estes

[jasonxxx102]

Probably not, but it's an impossible question with no real answer

[BostonCouchGM]

Absolutely. Bias was as good a pro prospect as there’s been. Right up there with MJ, Bird, Magic and Duncan. His energy and defense alone would have helped immensely but his ability to hit jumpers and finish in transition would have worked extremely well next to Bird and high BBIQ Celtics. The Pistons don’t win for sure. The Bulls run would be in serious jeopardy as well especially those first couple of championships as Bias would likely have been a top 5 player by then

[tbp82]

Yes it would have. What those two would have brought to The Celtics assuming they stayed healthy would've made a huge difference and more likely than not cut into Jordans 6 rings.

But, you can say that about a lot of things.
1.) What if Magic didn't get HIV
2.) What if Sam Bowie doesn't get injured.
3.) What if The 76ers hadnt traded Brad Daugherty

The list goes on and on.

[chrbal]

It would’ve helped the Celtics stay relevant longer. But not enough to affect MJ

[SelfishPlayer]

It would’ve helped the Celtics stay relevant longer. But not enough to affect MJ

That sounds about right. The Celtics would have experienced fewer losing seasons after Bird.

[Ambrose]

I think the talk of Bias being an ATG has been exaggerated. People act like he was destined to be in GOAT conversations but he didn't even go 1st in his draft. I know going #1 doesn't guarantee success but the hype with him does not seem to match reality. Reggie Lewis made one AS game by age 27. He was what he was.

[GSWFan1994]

That Boston team by then was running on fumes.

Bird, McHale and Parish were either old and/or had injuries.

Even if you add 2 borderline All-Star caliber players (Lewis was on that trajectory, IMO, and everything I saw and read of Bias lead me to believe he would follow as well), they could still contend for homecourt advantage in the East playoffs.

A good, above average team, yes. A contender? Not so sure.

[ropjhk]

Bird had already hurt his back and was already on the path of a shortened NBA career when Len Bias died. Bias wouldn't have changed that fate. I don't think the Celtics would have stopped the Bulls even with Len Bias. Maybe the Celtics take down the Pistons in 88 and win another championship giving Bird a tie with Magic in total and head to head championships.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Celtics don’t trade Ainge and LoHaus for Kleine and Pickney if they have a healthy Len Bias. The Ainge trade happened in a year Bird only played 6 games. I don’t think Celtics cut Gregg Kite for Artis Gilmore in hopes that aging Artis can help them beat the Lakers if Bias is on the team. With Bias on the team they know they are beating the Lakers and Keep Kite as the long term back up center.
I don’t the Brian Shaw nonsense happens with Bias on the team and tge team winning championships. I think Shaw just stays happy and stays with the Celtics.

Celtics probably take 2 of the championships in the first Jordan 3peat years if they have Bias and Ainge. They did have Lewis.

Lewis was still getting better when he died. Lewis and Bias battle the Rockets in Jordan’s baseball years.
Bird, Parish, MCHale did get too old too help Bias vs Jordan’s 2nd 3peat.

I figure Jordan would stay with the Bulls because where are you going to go to win a championship once you are already on tge 2nd best team?

Holy smokes, Celtics would be good with their 1986 staring 5 plus Bias, Lewis, Gamble, Shaw, LoHaus, Fox, Dee Brown, and Gregg Kite
. If the Expansion draft takes one of those guys then the Celtics have Mark Acres who was taken in the expansion draft. Rick Fox and Bird barely overlap and if Len Bias helps the Celtics win more games the Celtics might be drafting too late to draft Rick Fox.

The first Bulls championship happens in a year that Bird was still useful in the playoffs despite playing injured. After that the Real Bird did not contribute much in the playoffs but what if Bird got rest because of Bias could take his regular season minutes?

No Bulls team could Beat the 1986 Celtics plus Bias as a top 10 player in the league as he probably would have been and Lewis as he was in his last 2 playoff seasons plus Dee Brown giving Dennis Johnson a rest plus Ainge not traded. But Bulls don’t face 1986 Celtics, they face Bird MCHale and Parish getting older. Parrish declined the least.

It might be the Celtics rather than the Pistons slapping the young Bulls down. Celtics would not be as dirty but the Celtics with Bias is too talented. Jordan does not get the first of his championships. Question is could the Celtics with Bias but without Bird take any championships from Jordan.

[Masigond]

Bird AND a more experienced Bias might not have happened anyway.

In retirement, Bird has repeatedly voiced that his final few campaigns were challenging to navigate through. During an interview on The B.S. Report podcast with Bill Simmons in February 2013, the Hall of Famer surprisingly revealed he would have stepped into retirement in 1988 if Len Bias had lived.

“I would have left in 1988,” Bird said “I would have retired in 1988. I was starting to have ankle problems, and they were going to have to detach my Achilles to get these [bone] spurs out. I knew I was going to miss the whole year. If he was there, I would have just shut it down.”

https://www.sportscasting.com/larry-bird-stunningly-revealed-would-have-retired-1988-if-len-bias-lived/

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[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

I think the talk of Bias being an ATG has been exaggerated. People act like he was destined to be in GOAT conversations but he didn't even go 1st in his draft. I know going #1 doesn't guarantee success but the hype with him does not seem to match reality. Reggie Lewis made one AS game by age 27. He was what he was.

Lewis as he waa going before his freak death was destined to make the All Star game the next 5 years.
All Star game makes players wait a year to get into the All Star game. The reputation must catch up to the player. But then the player gets gifted one undeserved all star appearance after they are no longer a top player. Again the reputation must catch up to the player.
Reggie did 4 years in college at a school, North Eastern in Boston that does not normally play in NCAA tournaments. Celtics coach KC Jones did not believe in playing young players. Reggie was late developer, but Lewis was already a stud in college but he was a local secret. I think the Celtics could have got Lewis with the last pick in the 1st round even though Kewis should have been a top 10 pick.

Bias was going to be a top 10 player in the league and maybe he would have been an all time great. He was going to be a 3-4 tweener.
Lewis, Gamble and Fox are 2-3 tweeners. Ainge stays because Celtics don’t get desperate for depth the first time Bird is out with injury.

[GSWFan1994]

I think the talk of Bias being an ATG has been exaggerated. People act like he was destined to be in GOAT conversations but he didn't even go 1st in his draft. I know going #1 doesn't guarantee success but the hype with him does not seem to match reality. Reggie Lewis made one AS game by age 27. He was what he was.

Lewis as he waa going before his freak death was destined to make the All Star game the next 5 years.

Bias was going to be a top 10 player in the league and maybe he would have been an all time great. He was going to be a 3-4 tweener.
Lewis, Gamble and Fox are 2-3 tweeners. Ainge stays because Celtics don’t get desperate for depth the first time Bird is out with injury.

Which modern player would you compare to Bias, regarding playing style?

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

I think the talk of Bias being an ATG has been exaggerated. People act like he was destined to be in GOAT conversations but he didn't even go 1st in his draft. I know going #1 doesn't guarantee success but the hype with him does not seem to match reality. Reggie Lewis made one AS game by age 27. He was what he was.

Lewis as he waa going before his freak death was destined to make the All Star game the next 5 years.

Bias was going to be a top 10 player in the league and maybe he would have been an all time great. He was going to be a 3-4 tweener.
Lewis, Gamble and Fox are 2-3 tweeners. Ainge stays because Celtics don’t get desperate for depth the first time Bird is out with injury.

Which modern player would you compare to Bias, regarding playing style?

Older Powerful LeBron minus a little bit of ball handling and with only normal court vision. So no point forward. The guy had pwer and quickness attacking the rim and enough ball handling to get around people. he was a good deep mid range shooter including with a hand in his face but he was not a great outside shooter; maybe a little better than LeBron but LeBron also is not a great outside shooter when he is not hot. Bias was not as mobile at going around people as young LeBron, but Bias could go through people better than young LeBron but not as good as older LeBron.

Bias wants the big shots even when he has been cold for a bit.

Bias was slick and complete for a young kid but would he stop getting better and what direction would his growth take.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

To really screw with Jordan’s legacy the Celtics need Bias and Lewis and they need Mchale to not break his foot in 1987 and they need Bird to not mess up his back shoveling gravel to build a driveway for his mom after the 1985 season.

Tall guys need to understand that their backs are not built right for lifting. Lift with you knees not your back. But you can’t shovel gravel with your knees. Put less gravel on each shovel load and shovel less hours per day.

Bird destroyed his back being a macho country boy.

With Lewis And Bias and with Bird and McHale declining as slowly as Parish did the Celtic dominate. Then they get Dee Brown for some playable back court speed and Brian Shaw. I don’t completely remember what the problem was between Shaw and Celtics management but whatever went wrong should have been fixed. Ainge had a lot of good years left and Shaw and Dee Brown could have taken the point guard load as Dennis Johnson declined.

Bird and McHale peaked at mid season 1987 on a team with no depth with a coach who overplayed his starters rather than build depth.