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I understand this is kind of impossible to answer, but I still think it's worth thinking about. Could he have made a run at GOATness similarly to LeBron? Kawhi is the guy who is shooting 49% in the regular season, and 51% in the playoffs, absolutely unheard of among all-time greats, right? And all that with his body barely holding together for a series, never mind a whole playoff run. Just imagine the two-way greatness this guy could have shown, if he is an ironman.

Arguably a top 10 player.

He’d be above Steph curry and KD on the all time ranks, top 10.

Top 15-20 at least

We only managed to see flashes of peak Kawhi. The guy who was putting the fear of god to the KD Warriors before Zaza "injured" him.

After that he was never the same. Even Toronto Kawhi wasn't on that level especially on defense.

So yes we are looking at a top 20 player at minimum maybe even top 10.

Odds are we'd see him as a much worse player than we do now. So much of his hype is based on that run with the raptors that his abilities are simply overstated. This always happens when we don't get to see enough of a player. We create this over inflated hype. Don't get me wrong, he's a great player. I think he should have won the MVP over Westbrook in the triple double season. But no, he's not a top 10 level guy. He doesn't have the passing skills and he'd dropped off as a defender on the spurs when he started being an MVP level offensive guy.

top-7 all time

Woodsanity wrote:We only managed to see flashes of peak Kawhi. The guy who was putting the fear of god to the KD Warriors before Zaza "injured" him.

After that he was never the same. Even Toronto Kawhi wasn't on that level especially on defense.

So yes we are looking at a top 20 player at minimum maybe even top 10.

Toronto Kawhi was too busy having the best playoffs ever, by any player.

And Toronto Kawhi shut down Giannis. Best version of him till this day. But the Clippers game 1 Kawhi is a continuation I’d say.

Durability became an issue for Kawhi after 2017. Imo they still lose that series to the dubs in 2017. It's kind of hard to tell if he wanted out of Spurs because of how they handled his quad issue or if he was on his way out anyway. Imo that 2018 spurs team wouldn't have been strong enough to win a ring even with a healthy Kawhi.

However, afterwards he'd still have that 2019 ring in TOR with a possible season MVP too. Add another MVP in 2021 imo with another ring. Not sure how the rest plays out, but he probably wins another 1 or 2 DPOYs too. So his resume would be something like:
4 rings, 2 MVPs, 3DPOY.

I think the lack of MVPs hurt him in the GOAT debate because he wasn't that dominant early on, but apart from that he'd be a lock for anything between top 7 and 15. And some guys would have arguments for putting him over LBJ, KAJ etc.

He would arguably be a Top 10 all time player.

Kawhi hit the luckiest shot of all time. If one of those 8 bounces goes the wrong way then Jimmy Butler and Embiid take out the KD-less warriors and stay together.

Kawhi is a monster, you forget sometimes this guy actually went at Lebron in his prime in Miami and won one of those series.

He is the only one I've seen with the combo of size and athleticism to actually match him, maybe outside of prime Indiana Artest who was physically big enough. Kawhi's shooting skill is also amazing, he plays like Jordan in the mid range.

Might be the best player in the game right now above KD/Giannis too.

Rafael122 wrote:Arguably a top 10 player.

I def think this is the case, but I wonder... LeBron play's with a lot of injuries and I think that has to do with durability.

Does Kawhi dominate because he sits out quickly with any injury that would hamper his efficiency.

So if he had LeBron's durability would he yes play, but would he still have the same NBA leading efficiency we see at times like we're seeing right now when he plays? Or would have low points and be more like a normal MVPish level player who gets hampered by nagging injuries and it hurts his effectiveness on the court.

dhsilv2 wrote:Odds are we'd see him as a much worse player than we do now. So much of his hype is based on that run with the raptors that his abilities are simply overstated. This always happens when we don't get to see enough of a player. We create this over inflated hype. Don't get me wrong, he's a great player. I think he should have won the MVP over Westbrook in the triple double season. But no, he's not a top 10 level guy. He doesn't have the passing skills and he'd dropped off as a defender on the spurs when he started being an MVP level offensive guy.

There's no way Kawhi is seen as much worse if he averages like 75 games a season until he is 33 years old and doesn't miss any playoff games. I'm not sure how that is giving him a much worse perception when it gives him to ability to accumulate more numbers, have teams that are better in the regular season, be in MVP races and increase his chance at a championship each year.

Kingdibs19 wrote:Kawhi hit the luckiest shot of all time. If one of those 8 bounces goes the wrong way then Jimmy Butler and Embiid take out the KD-less warriors and stay together.

Or the Raptors could have won in overtime

Leonard is one of my top 5 players in the past decade. I love how he approaches the game, rarely complains or challenges the officials. He just goes to work.

He is not exceptionally fast, strong, or smooth. He just does what it takes, brings his lunchpail and does not get every benefit on plays - like James does.

Impossible to say because you'd have to think consistently being there would affect the peaks he reaches. Right now he gets bubble-wrapped and plays 45% of his regular season games just to have a great series or two.

og15 wrote:

dhsilv2 wrote:Odds are we'd see him as a much worse player than we do now. So much of his hype is based on that run with the raptors that his abilities are simply overstated. This always happens when we don't get to see enough of a player. We create this over inflated hype. Don't get me wrong, he's a great player. I think he should have won the MVP over Westbrook in the triple double season. But no, he's not a top 10 level guy. He doesn't have the passing skills and he'd dropped off as a defender on the spurs when he started being an MVP level offensive guy.

There's no way Kawhi is seen as much worse if he averages like 75 games a season until he is 33 years old and doesn't miss any playoff games. I'm not sure how that is giving him a much worse perception when it gives him to ability to accumulate more numbers, have teams that are better in the regular season, be in MVP races and increase his chance at a championship each year.

People think he's a top 10 talent, we see it right here. IMO he was nowhere close to that. Many rate him as a top 40-50 career as it stands. IMO that's a lot closer to what he'd have been if he'd played 75 games a year. If we had a full career we'd have him losing in the playoffs. Instead we seem to see his playoff losses as always injury related and he's not correctly adjusted down. Instead it's like his raptors run is how he always played, and we can ignore he wasn't great in the finals because...well they won.

Which LeBron? He hasn’t been durable for at least a few years.

But if you mean, what if Kawhi played 75+ games per season…

And assuming he could maintain his highest level of play… then yeah top 15 all time..

But could we say the same about a number of other players (tmac, Brandon Roy, etc)?

He would be a lot closer if he didn't hire his own medical team.