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I feel like the Mavericks would be such a better team if Luka dropped 20-30 pounds(Get closer to the shape he was in the bubble). All their guys on the roster would benefit from playing with more pace and Luka as the PG is holding them back on both ends of the floor with his current body type. He's already 7 seasons into the NBA and still hasn't changed in terms of personal fitness and whining towards the refs. I'm afraid this is who he is...

No.

He'll also never stop taking defensive possessions off to whine to the refs, or chucking up horrible shots for the fun of it.

He's a gigantic manbaby who succeeds on sheer talent.

I had to look back at Luka's rookie highlights to remember he could dunk. It's both amazing and disappointing how good he is when he's not even close to peak condition. He might honestly be the most out of shape player in the league.

Maybe it's a language barrier thing? Perhaps someone just needs to explain that by "in basketball shape" the training staff doesn't mean "in the shape of a basketball"

It’s embarrassing, I really want him to take it to the next level but his fitness is pathetic. Dude has the body that resembles a surf board at this point.

Also, his attitude, I feel bad for his fans. He just has terrible attitude, terrible personality, constantly whining to the refs, wanting EVERYTHING called in his favor, and those faces that he makes, just terrible. I’m not a fan of him and I always root against the Mavs for those very reasons.

famicommander wrote:No.

He'll also never stop taking defensive possessions off to whine to the refs, or chucking up horrible shots for the fun of it.

He's a gigantic manbaby who succeeds on sheer talent.

I remember he was once asked about playing with Porzingis, and is he willing to play more off ball and set screens, and he acted like he almost was insulted for even suggesting he should set screens for other players. He seem to only do things that he wants to do, play with the ball and thats it, he wont do anything that isn't fun to him. Being on diets is not fun, playing off ball is not fun, he wont do it. I get he is incredible talent, but he doesn't seem to be willing to go that extra mile to become a champion, in the NBA at least. Last time he won championships, it was in Europe, on stacked Real Madrid, or Slovenian NT where he was second in command. He yet to win a title where he is this heliocentric and egocentric.

Year 8 of asking if fat lazy guy will stop being fat and lazy. Or, in my case, year 40.

I don't think I ever recall so much complaining about the "shape" of a player and his performance that was pretty much dominant from day one in the league and never missed much time due to injuries. Not to mention that he was tied for 2nd in minutes per game last season and averaged 41 minutes in the playoffs while making it to the finals and playing hurt. I'd be more than happy to have "fat" Luka on the Knicks than one of those "hyperathletic" stars that are currently out for a few Months.

But maybe I'm wrong and the talk during the 80s and 90s was if fat Charles Barkley will get finally in shape and stop holding his team back^^.

guynumber45 wrote:I feel like the Mavericks would be such a better team if Luka dropped 20-30 pounds(Get closer to the shape he was in the bubble). All their guys on the roster would benefit from playing with more pace and Luka as the PG is holding them back on both ends of the floor with his current body type. He's already 7 seasons into the NBA and still hasn't changed in terms of personal fitness and whining towards the refs. I'm afraid this is who he is...

Only if you post your physique

Eightnineborn wrote:Also, his attitude, I feel bad for his fans. He just has terrible attitude, terrible personality, constantly whining to the refs, wanting EVERYTHING called in his favor, and those faces that he makes, just terrible. I’m not a fan of him and I always root against the Mavs for those very reasons.

He gives time to his fans like no other player in the league off the court...lol

If you have issues with how intense he is in the court that's fine but off the court of course fans love him.

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Doesn't look like it, but he might realize its value at some point. If you ask him he'd probably say he's getting buckets anyway, but it's on the defensive side where it makes a bigger difference. That's what Shaq would say when asked about it, he'd point to his unchanged offensive dominance even though his defensive impact paralelled his conditioning. There’s a clear gap between 2000 Shaq and 2002 Shaq because of this. Similar arguments are made by others, see an example below:

bkkrh wrote:I don't think I ever recall so much complaining about the "shape" of a player and his performance that was pretty much dominant from day one in the league and never missed much time due to injuries. Not to mention that he was tied for 2nd in minutes per game last season and averaged 41 minutes in the playoffs while making it to the finals and playing hurt. I'd be more than happy to have "fat" Luka on the Knicks than one of those "hyperathletic" stars that are currently out for a few Months.

But maybe I'm wrong and the talk during the 80s and 90s was if fat Charles Barkley will get finally in shape and stop holding his team back^^.

Shedding some weight turned Jokic from a great player into an all-time great player. As I said above, it's the defensive side where conditioning makes a huge difference. Jokic went from a weak defender to a decent one after his mobility improved. Could well be the case for Doncic.

I understand he's still injured, not 100%

Sure he should/could lose some weight but there is another problem and its his behavior.
Just stop bitching and moaning every single time you feel someone touched you and then leave your team 4 on 5 on D while you keep talking to the refs. Or my favorite when he keeps blaming his mates for crap D as if they didnt do something when Luka is at fault

why Curry isn't mentioned? Doncic defended him in those last plays.

Dude, what happened? Luka came in non-fat but was injured so he did not get a training camp. He has been using these games to get into game shape as planned. He played the most minutes and took the most shots. You can't fault him for being tired. By the way, good luck finding a player who has played more minutes than Luka in the last 5 years. Regular season, playoffs plus international games. I think this is the first season with the Mavs where he only played like 2 non-NBA games.

edit. also, who plays through injuries more than Luka? You guys just hate players.

UcanUwill wrote:

famicommander wrote:No.

He'll also never stop taking defensive possessions off to whine to the refs, or chucking up horrible shots for the fun of it.

He's a gigantic manbaby who succeeds on sheer talent.

Last time he won championships, it was in Europe, on stacked Real Madrid, or Slovenian NT where he was second in command. He yet to win a title where he is this heliocentric and egocentric.

You forgot to mention that this specific Real Madrid team wouldn't even sniff the playoffs at that time. 5-6 potential starters were out due to injuries (Lull included) and everyone thought it's over. Then Luka took over the team for few months until everyone got back and they won.

Prior to that, he was still a baby with NT at 18yo and the team hasn't lost a single game in that tournament.

He was also able to carry guys like Powell, Bullock, Wood, etc.. plus at least 3 Gleague guys to 4th standings in a tough Western conference before Mavs blew it up with the Kyrie trade. Dude had worse talented teams in the past than Jokic has right now.

Mavs record with Luka is close to 60% and record without is 40%. He's also most responsible for 1/3 of all western conference finals in Mavs history.

His start of this season is a huge puzzle, i'll admit that, but it's like you just erased what he's done in previous years. He literally single handedly put Mavs back on the map when their only hope for the future was DSJ lol...

bkkrh wrote:I don't think I ever recall so much complaining about the "shape" of a player and his performance that was pretty much dominant from day one in the league and never missed much time due to injuries. Not to mention that he was tied for 2nd in minutes per game last season and averaged 41 minutes in the playoffs while making it to the finals and playing hurt. I'd be more than happy to have "fat" Luka on the Knicks than one of those "hyperathletic" stars that are currently out for a few Months.

But maybe I'm wrong and the talk during the 80s and 90s was if fat Charles Barkley will get finally in shape and stop holding his team back^^.

Frustration and ''hating'' from us fans, comes from the fact we all know he can be even better. Very few humans possessed natural talent Luka has and we want all timers to be best version of themselves, for the most part. Also, great players always were and will be criticized if they carried extra pounds, I remember Carmelo had the same thing, and Carmelo wasn't even overweight really, he just had round face more than anything. Players do get criticized over this all the time, especially when they are great regardless, no one is saying he sucks or anything.

Archx wrote:

UcanUwill wrote:

famicommander wrote:No.

He'll also never stop taking defensive possessions off to whine to the refs, or chucking up horrible shots for the fun of it.

He's a gigantic manbaby who succeeds on sheer talent.

Last time he won championships, it was in Europe, on stacked Real Madrid, or Slovenian NT where he was second in command. He yet to win a title where he is this heliocentric and egocentric.

You forgot to mention that this specific Real Madrid team wouldn't even sniff the playoffs at that time. 5-6 potential starters were out due to injuries (Lull included) and everyone thought it's over. Then Luka took over the team for few months until everyone got back and they won.

Prior to that, he was still a baby with NT at 18yo and the team hasn't lost a single game in that tournament.

He was also able to carry guys like Powell, Bullock, Wood, etc.. plus at least 3 Gleague guys to 4th standings in a tough Western conference before Mavs blew it up with the Kyrie trade. Dude had worse talented teams in the past than Jokic has right now.

Mavs record with Luka is close to 60% and record without is 40%. He's also most responsible for 1/3 of all western conference finals in Mavs history.

His start of this season is a huge puzzle, i'll admit that, but it's like you just erased what he's done in previous years. He literally single handedly put Mavs back on the map when their only hope for the future was DSJ lol...

He is great, I am not saying he isn't, but he doesn't carry himself as all time great worker, he only has the ego. Also, when he won MVP and Euroleague, he was Reals best player, but he still averaged 15.5 points per game, he wasn't who he is now.

I don't know, he was already very close to the championship, so maybe he is there as a leader and superstar player, but Harden always got critique for his style and lazy lifestyle and play on defense, and people dont have problem crapping on Harden because Harden is simply disliked by most. Luka is similar player and person, he i gettting there, but he is still international golden boy and people are too dismissal of his obvious flaws.
Jokic was also overweight, dude dedicated entire pandemic to get in best shape ever and now he is top 10 of all time.

UcanUwill wrote:

Archx wrote:

UcanUwill wrote:
Last time he won championships, it was in Europe, on stacked Real Madrid, or Slovenian NT where he was second in command. He yet to win a title where he is this heliocentric and egocentric.

You forgot to mention that this specific Real Madrid team wouldn't even sniff the playoffs at that time. 5-6 potential starters were out due to injuries (Lull included) and everyone thought it's over. Then Luka took over the team for few months until everyone got back and they won.

Prior to that, he was still a baby with NT at 18yo and the team hasn't lost a single game in that tournament.

He was also able to carry guys like Powell, Bullock, Wood, etc.. plus at least 3 Gleague guys to 4th standings in a tough Western conference before Mavs blew it up with the Kyrie trade. Dude had worse talented teams in the past than Jokic has right now.

Mavs record with Luka is close to 60% and record without is 40%. He's also most responsible for 1/3 of all western conference finals in Mavs history.

His start of this season is a huge puzzle, i'll admit that, but it's like you just erased what he's done in previous years. He literally single handedly put Mavs back on the map when their only hope for the future was DSJ lol...

He is great, I am not saying he isn't, but he doesn't carry himself as all time great worker, he only has the ego. Also, when he won MVP and Euroleague, he was Reals best player, but he still averaged 15.5 points per game, he wasn't who he is now.

I don't know, he was already very close to the championship, so maybe he is there as a leader and superstar player, but Harden always got critique for his style and lazy lifestyle and play on defense, and people dont have problem crapping on Harden because Harden is simply disliked by most. Luka is similar player and person, he i gettting there, but he is still international golden boy and people are too dismissal of his obvious flaws.
Jokic was also overweight, dude dedicated entire pandemic to get in best shape ever and now he is top 10 of all time.

He has his quirks, and can be a chore to watch with his complaining, but there is one simple fact about him, it is extremely rare for him to underachieve, in his 7 seasons, he always outperformed his roster's potential, same in Euroleague, Eurobasket and Olympics, with one exception, Eurobasket quarter finals against Poland, and both Giannis and Jokic underacheived in the very same tournament.
It shouldn't have been expected from him to perform any better than he did in any tournament.

He's playing his worst basketball right now, but it's 11 games into the season, let's give the guy the benefit of the doubt, he has never shown himself to not be up to task...