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Per Statmuse:

With Davis: 116.2 DRtg (42 games)
Without Davis: 110.2 DRtg (13 games)

LA has had the #1 defense (107.5 DRtg) over the last 15 games according to NBA.com

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/defense?LastNGames=15&dir=A&sort=DEF_RATING

AD played the first five of those games. DFS was acquired 20 games ago and Vanderbilt returned from long-term injury 11 games ago. Gabe Vincent has also gotten healthier and is playing better.

So there are multiple factors at play but you'd think LA would fall off without Davis but that hasn't been the case. To my eye, the Lakers are rebounding and defending in transition way better. They play faster and with more energy sans AD.

What's your take?

I've talked about how I think AD's defense is overrated before in this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2401339#p114699016

As great as he can be on one possession, I think Davis' defensive motor sucks. His effort over an entire game, in ALL facets of defensive play. He's always falling over on offense and it kills his team's transition defense.

This is just another piece of evidence to add to the pile that includes subpar New Orleans team defenses and LA's best defense occurring during the season that AD was injured and out of shape. I'm not saying he's a bad defender. Just an overrated one.

Nico.

It's cos the Lakers no longer have the safety blanket that AD was.

Everyone has to have effort and do all the fundamental things like getting back in transition, switching on a string and boxing out

Dr Aki wrote:It's cos the Lakers no longer have the safety blanket that AD was.

Everyone has to have effort and do all the fundamental things like getting back in transition, switching on a string and boxing out

I don't know, that's a real bad reason to play weaker on defense unless your defense is really good. Their defense wasn't really good with him, so they shouldn't be saying, "oh we can just fall back on AD".

og15 wrote:

Dr Aki wrote:It's cos the Lakers no longer have the safety blanket that AD was.

Everyone has to have effort and do all the fundamental things like getting back in transition, switching on a string and boxing out

I don't know, that's a real bad reason to play weaker on defense unless your defense is really good. Their defense wasn't really good with him, so they shouldn't be saying, "oh we can just fall back on AD".

Well OP did mention Vincent, and Vando coming back from injury, as well as the acquisiton of DFS, so getting back an army of switchable wings fundamentally changed the way the Lakers had to defend.

But prior to that, the Lakers would routinely get burned on the perimeter too often and AD would simply erase a shot, only to lose the rebound afterwards

Luka's presence probably gave them more energy to shore up the D... but they don't have an anchor esp. with Lebron turning 40.

Honestly looks like they’re just hustling harder.

Edit: how can I forget they got rid of D’Angelo

FrodoBaggins wrote:Per Statmuse:

With Davis: 116.2 DRtg (42 games)
Without Davis: 110.2 DRtg (13 games)

LA has had the #1 defense (107.5 DRtg) over the last 15 games according to NBA.com

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/defense?LastNGames=15&dir=A&sort=DEF_RATING

AD played the first five of those games. DFS was acquired 20 games ago and Vanderbilt returned from long-term injury 11 games ago. Gabe Vincent has also gotten healthier and is playing better.

So there are multiple factors at play but you'd think LA would fall off without Davis but that hasn't been the case. To my eye, the Lakers are rebounding and defending in transition way better. They play faster and with more energy sans AD.

What's your take?

I've talked about how I think AD's defense is overrated before in this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2401339#p114699016

As great as he can be on one possession, I think Davis' defensive motor sucks. His effort over an entire game, in ALL facets of defensive play. He's always falling over on offense and it kills his team's transition defense.

This is just another piece of evidence to add to the pile that includes subpar New Orleans team defenses and LA's best defense occurring during the season that AD was injured and out of shape. I'm not saying he's a bad defender. Just an overrated one.

Its mostly replacing Dlo with DFS!

Plus sprinkle some JJ

From the Lakers subReddit:

Over the last 10 games, LA's defense has faced a frequency of transition that'd rank 2nd highest among full-season numbers this year. But have given up an efficiency lower than any team in the past 5+ seasons. Lots of fast breaks but few buckets. An uncomfortable recipe!

Cranjis on twitter.
LOWEST IN 5+ SEASONS BY ANY TEAM

I mean logically speaking it makes sense. AD as good as he was would never get back, how many times we see him like miss or a make a layup and get stuck behind the play. Without him we’re much better in transition, we also score more leading to us being able to set our defense more as well

Vando and Vincent came back. They also traded for DFS. They had a top 10 rating before AD got hurt. It's only gotten better though.

FrodoBaggins wrote:From the Lakers subReddit:

Over the last 10 games, LA's defense has faced a frequency of transition that'd rank 2nd highest among full-season numbers this year. But have given up an efficiency lower than any team in the past 5+ seasons. Lots of fast breaks but few buckets. An uncomfortable recipe!

Cranjis on twitter.
LOWEST IN 5+ SEASONS BY ANY TEAM

I mean logically speaking it makes sense. AD as good as he was would never get back, how many times we see him like miss or a make a layup and get stuck behind the play. Without him we’re much better in transition, we also score more leading to us being able to set our defense more as well

He's obviously an amazing player but probably my biggest beef with him, besides the injuries and frequent mid-game departures, is that he's got almost zero motor. If he ever hit the floor, you were guaranteed playing 4 on 5 with many possessions where he wouldn't even get back past halfcourt. Dallas is playing well even without him and I think he's going to fit great with Kyrie. But at 32 I can't believe we were able to flip him for Doncic.

- Davis is an overrated defender (just check out his 6y-sample in on/off data with Lakers), his transition D was terrible
- Lakers improved their roster (Vanderbilt coming back, DFS for Russell, Vincent coming back to life) in December/January
- LeBron finding 2nd breath since mid-December, also defensively
- Hayes turning out to be a playable rotational center
- Lakers have great size (Luka-LeBron-Rui are huge for 2-4 spots) on this team
- Redick being an amazing coach so far in adjusting to what Lakers need on both ends of the floor

More or less that's why.

You can't under estimate the impact of Vando on our defense.

Dangerous to check the lakers season long stats when they had dlo in the lineup versus now with Vando and dfs. a lot more changed than just AD.

Vando/Vincent come back, DFS started out being a little ****, and has really upto the level the lakers wanted. They are playing harder too

Small sample sizes are **** and never tell a story in terms of "Without this player advanced stats go up!" when there are hundreds of variables, D'lo Traded, They played Utah twice and had a fairly softer run for the last 10 games then you will as a team in the west over like 40

Yeah AD is good at anchoring the defence but he also had like 3 months of D'lo turnstyle which dragged overall average numbers down

dockingsched wrote:Dangerous to check the lakers season long stats when they had dlo in the lineup versus now with Vando and dfs. a lot more changed than just AD.

Yeah, but we have 6-season long sample size of AD not being that much impactful defensively for the Lakers overall.



AD is obviously a very good defender with some DPOTY moments in the playoffs, but at the end of the day the whole narrative of AD being the defensive anchor keeping Lakers' defense upright was non-factual. And to be honest, I lean towards opinion that he was getting benefit of a doubt because at some point no one considered Lakers a serious team, so this season no one besides Lakers fans cared about e.g. his transition D. You should take on/off stats with a grain of salt (6 seasons though...), but again, what Lakers have been showing defensively since December (top8 defense in the league) is kind of in line with what we've seen for years, statistically speaking: AD is a net positive defender, but not necessarily a defensive player people believe that he is.

Especially since the 2nd best big man that Lakers have had in these 6 seasons is probably 35yo Dwight, and Davis had multiple seasons when he missed many games - so it actually should be beneficial for his on/off stats. It wasn't a case though.

You're right that Lakers would've been a better defensive team with this defensive lineup and AD, but Lakers' defense not falling apart as many people believed is still very much telling.

FrodoBaggins wrote:From the Lakers subReddit:

Over the last 10 games, LA's defense has faced a frequency of transition that'd rank 2nd highest among full-season numbers this year. But have given up an efficiency lower than any team in the past 5+ seasons. Lots of fast breaks but few buckets. An uncomfortable recipe!

Cranjis on twitter.
LOWEST IN 5+ SEASONS BY ANY TEAM

I mean logically speaking it makes sense. AD as good as he was would never get back, how many times we see him like miss or a make a layup and get stuck behind the play. Without him we’re much better in transition, we also score more leading to us being able to set our defense more as well

This is exactly why. Davis was poor in transition defense and Lakers never focused on it, Lakers without Davis have realised that they can make most impact on transition defense.

Also Vando and DFS have made a big impact in transition defense.

This defense worked against who they played but I don't think it will work with everyone.

Temporary bump due to players getting an increased role on that end.

Because he was preparing to fit into Nico Harrison's hospital culture

AD was propped up by LeBron trolls. Fact of the matter is dude is overrated on both sides of the ball (especially on offense).