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Please refrain from using hindsight.

1. Orlando choosing to extend Jonathan Isaac for 69 Million after this guy failed to play for the same team for 235 games in 3 years and last season he rewarded this team with his whopping 5pts and 4 rebs per game.
2. Bulls guaranteeing MORE $ like 31.2 Million dollars to Lonzo Ball, He also missed 211 games the past 3 years. He also rewarded the FO with his remarkable 7pts 3 rebs/3 assists.
3. Orlando Magic deciding not to sign any legit PG last summer.
4. Lakers opting to not sign a decent center Last offseason.
5. Portland extending the contract of Chauncey Billups.
6. Blazers failing to trade their remaining assets for more picks.

Luka for Davis.

Don't need hindsight to tell me that Dolan becoming more involved in the day-to-day management of the Knicks is a bad idea. Apparently, it was Dolan, not Leon, who conducted the exit interviews this year, and that the decision to fire Thibs without a replacement in hand is also on Dolan:



Which makes sense, given that the recent, very public fumbling to "steal" Kidd away from Dallas also kind of stinks of Dolan.

Patrick Williams 5 / $90M

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2391064&hilit=patrick+williams

Most people were questioning this deal. Are Bulls fans happy?

Phoenix Suns.

Need I really say any more?

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tamaraw08 wrote:Please refrain from using hindsight.

1. Orlando choosing to extend Jonathan Isaac for 69 Million after this guy failed to play for the same team for 235 games in 3 years and last season he rewarded this team with his whopping 5pts and 4 rebs per game.
2. Bulls guaranteeing MORE $ like 31.2 Million dollars to Lonzo Ball, He also missed 211 games the past 3 years. He also rewarded the FO with his remarkable 7pts 3 rebs/3 assists.
3. Orlando Magic deciding not to sign any legit PG last summer.
4. Lakers opting to not sign a decent center Last offseason.
5. Portland extending the contract of Chauncey Billups.
6. Blazers failing to trade their remaining assets for more picks.

Related to 3: First off, who where they supposed to sign? Besides Chris Paul the best available options were probably Tyus Jones, Kyle Lowry and Russell Westbrook, or resigning Fultz. Highly doubt Jones, Lowry or Westbrook would have picked Orlando over the team they wound up with and they cleary moved on from Fultz. So that leaves Chris Paul, who would have been a good short term solution, but they had Anthony in the last year of his Rookie contract and Black in his 2nd year as a former 6th pick. So pretty understandable that they want to see if one of them can be their long-term solution.

Related to 4: Kind of the same thing. Who were the Lakers supposed to sign, they only could offer vet minimum deals. Far as I remember it wasn't clear that Wood would be out the whole season, so on paper they had a pretty solid rotation of AD, Hayes, Wood and Koloko as 2 Way at the start of the season.

For me the De'Andre Hunter trade from Atlanta's perspective. You are trading a really good 27 year old player that is having a career year and has a really good contract for the next 3 seasons for 2 good players in their early 30s, one with an expiring contract. It doesn't really help them long term and if there was no better trade, he would have definitely been a player a lot of teams would have had interest in during the offseason. Think they could have easily gotten something like two 1sts in return.

The Lakers always said, even when they made the Luka trade, that they would attempt to sign a temporary centre at the deadline and if that didn't work out, go for a long-term fit in the offseason.

People just get impatient.

GSW trying to add an aging Butler to aging Steph and aging Dray. Yes it improved the team this year. No it did not make them contenders. And they are down a draft pick.

I would have shipped all the vets out for other team’s crap and extra draft picks, embraced the tank, and rebuilt. Sign JK and make him tank commander. Most tank commanders are tradable (see Russell, DeAngelo), so the risk of the signing isnt very high.

Not hindsight as i was advocating this before the trade.

bkkrh wrote:

tamaraw08 wrote:Please refrain from using hindsight.

1. Orlando choosing to extend Jonathan Isaac for 69 Million after this guy failed to play for the same team for 235 games in 3 years and last season he rewarded this team with his whopping 5pts and 4 rebs per game.
2. Bulls guaranteeing MORE $ like 31.2 Million dollars to Lonzo Ball, He also missed 211 games the past 3 years. He also rewarded the FO with his remarkable 7pts 3 rebs/3 assists.
3. Orlando Magic deciding not to sign any legit PG last summer.
4. Lakers opting to not sign a decent center Last offseason.
5. Portland extending the contract of Chauncey Billups.
6. Blazers failing to trade their remaining assets for more picks.

Related to 3: First off, who where they supposed to sign? Besides Chris Paul the best available options were probably Tyus Jones, Kyle Lowry and Russell Westbrook, or resigning Fultz. Highly doubt Jones, Lowry or Westbrook would have picked Orlando over the team they wound up with and they cleary moved on from Fultz. So that leaves Chris Paul, who would have been a good short term solution, but they had Anthony in the last year of his Rookie contract and Black in his 2nd year as a former 6th pick. So pretty understandable that they want to see if one of them can be their long-term solution.

Related to 4: Kind of the same thing. Who were the Lakers supposed to sign, they only could offer vet minimum deals. Far as I remember it wasn't clear that Wood would be out the whole season, so on paper they had a pretty solid rotation of AD, Hayes, Wood and Koloko as 2 Way at the start of the season.

For me the De'Andre Hunter trade from Atlanta's perspective. You are trading a really good 27 year old player that is having a career year and has a really good contract for the next 3 seasons for 2 good players in their early 30s, one with an expiring contract. It doesn't really help them long term and if there was no better trade, he would have definitely been a player a lot of teams would have had interest in during the offseason. Think they could have easily gotten something like two 1sts in return.

Tyus Jones signed the Vet Minimum contract and I thought Magic could have offered a bit more over a team with very volatile and unstable superstars in Phoenix.
re: the Lakers, Yes, slim pickings out there, I must admit was trying too hard to add to the list...
But yes Hawks trading Hunter just didn't made sense at at all.
Pelicans trading a really good defender for a guard who is not known for his perimeter shooting/floor spacing also lacked logic IMO.

azcatz11 wrote:Patrick Williams 5 / $90M

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2391064&hilit=patrick+williams

Most people were questioning this deal. Are Bulls fans happy?

Billy Donovan got a secret contract extension.

The Bulls work in ways regular folks like you and me don't understand.

meekrab wrote:

azcatz11 wrote:Patrick Williams 5 / $90M

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2391064&hilit=patrick+williams

Most people were questioning this deal. Are Bulls fans happy?

Billy Donovan got a secret contract extension.

The Bulls work in ways regular folks like you and me don't understand.

The Owner/s had to ask this question to his Front Office staff.
If the coach is NOT the main reason why this Bulls team has failed miserably, then whose fault is it?

tamaraw08 wrote:

bkkrh wrote:

tamaraw08 wrote:Please refrain from using hindsight.

1. Orlando choosing to extend Jonathan Isaac for 69 Million after this guy failed to play for the same team for 235 games in 3 years and last season he rewarded this team with his whopping 5pts and 4 rebs per game.
2. Bulls guaranteeing MORE $ like 31.2 Million dollars to Lonzo Ball, He also missed 211 games the past 3 years. He also rewarded the FO with his remarkable 7pts 3 rebs/3 assists.
3. Orlando Magic deciding not to sign any legit PG last summer.
4. Lakers opting to not sign a decent center Last offseason.
5. Portland extending the contract of Chauncey Billups.
6. Blazers failing to trade their remaining assets for more picks.

Related to 3: First off, who where they supposed to sign? Besides Chris Paul the best available options were probably Tyus Jones, Kyle Lowry and Russell Westbrook, or resigning Fultz. Highly doubt Jones, Lowry or Westbrook would have picked Orlando over the team they wound up with and they cleary moved on from Fultz. So that leaves Chris Paul, who would have been a good short term solution, but they had Anthony in the last year of his Rookie contract and Black in his 2nd year as a former 6th pick. So pretty understandable that they want to see if one of them can be their long-term solution.

Related to 4: Kind of the same thing. Who were the Lakers supposed to sign, they only could offer vet minimum deals. Far as I remember it wasn't clear that Wood would be out the whole season, so on paper they had a pretty solid rotation of AD, Hayes, Wood and Koloko as 2 Way at the start of the season.

For me the De'Andre Hunter trade from Atlanta's perspective. You are trading a really good 27 year old player that is having a career year and has a really good contract for the next 3 seasons for 2 good players in their early 30s, one with an expiring contract. It doesn't really help them long term and if there was no better trade, he would have definitely been a player a lot of teams would have had interest in during the offseason. Think they could have easily gotten something like two 1sts in return.

Tyus Jones signed the Vet Minimum contract and I thought Magic could have offered a bit more over a team with very volatile and unstable superstars in Phoenix.
re: the Lakers, Yes, slim pickings out there, I must admit was trying too hard to add to the list...
But yes Hawks trading Hunter just didn't made sense at at all.
Pelicans trading a really good defender for a guard who is not known for his perimeter shooting/floor spacing also lacked logic IMO.

It's tricky to say with Tyus Jones, from what I understood it was his priority to be a starter and Phoenix was viewed as a contender before the season. I saw this as a kind of betting on himself season for him, getting a big contract next year after being a solid contributor on a contender. If Orlando could have gotten him, I agree with you.

Also thought about the Pelicans trade as well. It's definitely impacted as well by Murray being really underwhelming and constantly injured, while Daniels improved more than expected and now looks like he could be one of the best 2 way players in the league soon. Still felt like an overpay already when it happened, though.

In that sense actually kinda funny that Atlanta had the same season a trade that might turn out to be one of the best trades of the decade and one that might turn out to be as one of the worst.

tamaraw08 wrote:

meekrab wrote:

azcatz11 wrote:Patrick Williams 5 / $90M

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2391064&hilit=patrick+williams

Most people were questioning this deal. Are Bulls fans happy?

Billy Donovan got a secret contract extension.

The Bulls work in ways regular folks like you and me don't understand.

The Owner/s had to ask this question to his Front Office staff.
If the coach is NOT the main reason why this Bulls team has failed miserably, then whose fault is it?

If ever I get depressed about my team I always like to look at the list of Bulls seasons. A hard thing to comprehend for a marquee NBA franchise.

- Sacramento signing Demar Derozan. He just wasn't a fit with what they were trying to do offensively (run off De'Aron Fox in the full court, and have movement shooters run DHO with Sabonis) or defensively (Demar is a damagingly bad defender). It was a meaningless grab at an available name, and I think it really undid them. Now they're Chicago Bulls West with nowhere to go.

- New Orleans trading Dyson and 2 picks for Dejounte. There's no evidence Dejounte moves the needle. On offense, he's a pick & roll specialist who likes to take tough pull ups. New Orleans isn't a pick & roll team and they did not need another guy who wants the ball in his hands with Zion, Ingram, and CJ all there already and Trey Murphy wanting a bigger role. I wouldn't have traded Dyson for him straight up, but they actually gave up picks.

- The Luka trade, obviously. What a weird one.

- Terry Rozier to Miami. Another empty calorie scorer who wasn't going to move the needle. The ability to absorb scoring volume, without the ability to be a positive efficiency scorer, has to be the most overrated skill in the NBA. These guys almost never help you win, unless there's some very specific role they occupy in your offense that is vital.

Raptors trading Fred van vleet, OG, and Siakam at the last minute and getting less-than-optimal returns for them (Fred left at free agency for nothing). Overpaying Immanuel quickley without matching first. The Brandon Ingram trade remains to be seen but I don’t trust his durability especially since he didn’t play most (if not at all) of last season for both New Orleans and Toronto. Not all horrible but very questionable direction.

you're just now finding out NBA teams are owned and run by imbeciles? I swear the majority of bad signings are due to delusional attempts to have salary ballast in case of trades. But this almost never happens especially for the bad teams that tend to make these decisions. Small market and poorly run teams are always attempting to free up cap space for FAs that will never sign there too. Don't get me started on the draft. That's when you really see how stupid they are.

floppymoose wrote:GSW trying to add an aging Butler to aging Steph and aging Dray. Yes it improved the team this year. No it did not make them contenders. And they are down a draft pick.

I would have shipped all the vets out for other team’s crap and extra draft picks, embraced the tank, and rebuilt. Sign JK and make him tank commander. Most tank commanders are tradable (see Russell, DeAngelo), so the risk of the signing isnt very high.

Not hindsight as i was advocating this before the trade.

I'm completely on the other side.

GSW not only got into the playoffs thanks to the Jimmy trade, they actually won a playoff series. That's not a negligible accomplishment. How many franchises haven't won a playoff series in this decade? And if Steph doesn't get hurt, there is a good chance they make the WCF. Plus the Steph/Jimmy/Dray Warriors aren't done yet, they might make another postseason. For Warriors fans, this is a lot more competitive Curry basketball they get to enjoy. One FRP is worth that.

I like Lonzo enough that I thought the re-signing was fine. I kind of advocated for Blazers trading for him for the sake of giving him a similar contract while others were just talking about him in terms of an expiring contract. They weren’t getting rid of him for any value so instead of cutting ties, they paid to a decent amount for one year to be able to extend him on a good extension. They now have him on a pretty cheap extension, owed $10M next season, then a $10M team option. That’s an easily trade-able contract, a bargain if he returns to form, and he can be waived that last year if he sucks or gets injured again. I liked it at the time, and I still do.

cupcakesnake wrote:-

- Terry Rozier to Miami. Another empty calorie scorer who wasn't going to move the needle. The ability to absorb scoring volume, without the ability to be a positive efficiency scorer, has to be the most overrated skill in the NBA. These guys almost never help you win, unless there's some very specific role they occupy in your offense that is vital.

Terry didn't really have a negative OPBM after his first 2 seasons in the league.
He was pretty decent from the perimeter esp his 3 years in Charlotte and Miami badly needed that extra scorer. Plus Spoelstra almost always find ways to maximize his players strengths like he did with Nunn, Gabe Vincent, Caleb Martin, Struss etc.
About specific roles, it worked with Jordan Poole, Jamaal Crawford too.

- New Orleans trading Dyson and 2 picks for Dejounte. There's no evidence Dejounte moves the needle. On offense, he's a pick & roll specialist who likes to take tough pull ups. New Orleans isn't a pick & roll team and they did not need another guy who wants the ball in his hands with Zion, Ingram, and CJ all there already and Trey Murphy wanting a bigger role. I wouldn't have traded Dyson for him straight up, but they actually gave up picks.

I happened to be in Orleans watching Pelicans vs Spurs and Murry pretty much torched David Griffin's team. I can't help but wonder if the former EVP just watch limited games and decided from there that he will trade for Murray no matter what.

Myth wrote:I like Lonzo enough that I thought the re-signing was fine. I kind of advocated for Blazers trading for him for the sake of giving him a similar contract while others were just talking about him in terms of an expiring contract. They weren’t getting rid of him for any value so instead of cutting ties, they paid to a decent amount for one year to be able to extend him on a good extension. They now have him on a pretty cheap extension, owed $10M next season, then a $10M team option. That’s an easily trade-able contract, a bargain if he returns to form, and he can be waived that last year if he sucks or gets injured again. I liked it at the time, and I still do.

Bulls resigning Lonzo was fine, really?
The guy had a really BAD injury and is currently using experimental treatment/procedures just to have a "chance" to play and you're giving him 20 million?
I understand the concept of not letting guys walk for nothing. Warriors found a way to get somebody instead of losing KD, they acquired DLo which later they flipped for Wiggins. Andrew then played a major part in defeating Boston in the finals so it worked out for them.
But there's also the Suns trying to copy that concept of not losing CP3 for nothing. So they made one of the biggest blunder ever, absorbing a huge contract of Bradley Beal.