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Personally, I don't see the case for Giannis > Wemby. The gap will widen next season and pretty soon we're about to have yet another player wiping Giannis for peak, prime, and career. Could you help me out because I don't see why Wemby isn't already ahead of Giannis, and not top 5 player in the league.

Is this a joke?

He isn't particularly close at the moment.

3rd or 4th year is a good time to take a leap though.

Wemby would need to take a MASSIVE leap offensively to be better than Giannis this season. Wemby is still very unproven as an NBA player. Any convo about his rank amongst his peers is heavily based on potential since he just hasn't proven that he can be that guy yet.

Giannis has been elite for years & shown resiliency in the playoffs. This is easily Giannis.

Can't see Wembanyama ever reaching the level of today's Giannis, or any version of Giannis in the last 6 years whereby Giannis has averaged 29.9 points, 11.9 rebounds, 6.0 assists, .575 field, and been one of the very best defenders in the NBA.

And I don't think Wembanyama will ever duplicate Giannis 2021 NBA Finals = Giannis averaged 35.2 points, 13.2 rebounds, 5.0 assists, 1.8 blocks, 1.2 steals, 2.3 turnovers, .618 fielding and scored 50 in the championship-winning game on just 25 field goal attempts, also 14 rebounds and
5 blocks!

And Giannis playoff averages from 2019 to 2025 = 28.8 points, 13.2 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 1.3 blocks, .537 field

Wemby played 46 games last season. Curious to see how he comes back and if it'll take him time to acclimate. This comp is getting closer due to Wemby's shooting improving, and I actually think Wemby's defensive value is much higher than Giannis'. It's Kobe-LeBron to me circa 2008, in that I trust Giannis more right now but if trajectory holds Wemby will be better soon esp as Giannis ages.

Voted "Giannis clears" for now

You aren't doing yourself any favors by phrasing the title like that. The onus is on Wemby to prove he can rise to Giannis level, not the other way around

However, I do think it's close and health willing he has a good shot at surpassing Giannis down the line. Too early for that noise though

Giannis will always be good enough to defend Wembanyama, whereas I don't see any way for Wembanyama to defend Giannis.

Nope. There's no case for Giannis over Wemby. We're talking height right?

Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

Y'all know I'm the biggest Wemby homer on this board but this is obviously a silly take. Giannis was at worst the third best player in the league last year and Vic only played little more than half the season. He could overtake him this year but that's probably a stretch. Giannis has earned his place as an all time great. Victor will get there almost certainly but he isn't there yet

I think Giannis is comfortably ahead of Wemby, in fact "clearing" him, but due to the mid-season injury I think Wemby is being underrated.

Wemby was on track to lead the Spurs to a play-in position and likely would have been All-NBA second team and DPOY. He's a clear top 10 player in the league, and could easily be top 5 by this Christmas. It's arguable he already was top 5.

However, Giannis is consensus top 3. There's a good argument that he's #1. He just breaks the game.

Top10alltime wrote:Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

But Wembanyama only averaged 9.9 2-point attempts last season, so he's accurate because he's only attempting the easy 2-pointers.
Whereas Giannis averaged 18.7 2-point attempts last season.

As for playmaking, Giannis has averaged 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years.
Wembanyama averaged 3.7 assists in 2024-25 and 3.9 assists in his rookie season.
Will Wembanyama ever average 6.0 assists, even for one season?
Seems a long way off...

bonita_the_frog wrote:

Top10alltime wrote:Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

But Wembanyama only averaged 9.9 2-point attempts last season, so he's accurate because he's only attempting the easy 2-pointers.
Whereas Giannis averaged 18.7 2-point attempts last season.

As for playmaking, Giannis has averaged 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years.
Wembanyama averaged 3.7 assists in 2024-25 and 3.9 assists in his rookie season.
Will Wembanyama ever average 6.0 assists, even for one season?
Seems a long way off...

On the assists, I think he can. He probably would have averaged closer to 5 the last couple seasons if he wasn't surrounded by comically bad offensive players that can't shoot for crap. I think this season his assist numbers should tick up to 5+

OP, it is a bit confusing to use only one year in your phrasing, as seasons span two calendar years, so a modification to 25-26 would be more accurate.

24-25 still includes "2025", but isn't part of your focus, if I'm reading this correctly. Also, I locked your thread about 'eurofraud' Giannis last week, so this is a clever way around that, but not too clever if it devolves into that territory. Thank you!

bonita_the_frog wrote:

Top10alltime wrote:Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

But Wembanyama only averaged 9.9 2-point attempts last season, so he's accurate because he's only attempting the easy 2-pointers.
Whereas Giannis averaged 18.7 2-point attempts last season.

As for playmaking, Giannis has averaged 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years.
Wembanyama averaged 3.7 assists in 2024-25 and 3.9 assists in his rookie season.
Will Wembanyama ever average 6.0 assists, even for one season?
Seems a long way off...

Wemby still is more efficient across the floor, and similar in transition (Giannis strong point). Sure, Giannis volume makes him a better scorer, but it's still close. Plus Wemby has more counters than finishing only

And I wasn't talking about assists. (Although Giannis and Wemby both have same amount of rim AST so that's something). I was talking about Giannis passing counter on the basketball court. Giannis only has drive & kick. I don't think that will be good enough to make a significant gap.

And on the other end of the floor, Wembanyama absolutely clears Giannis. Giannis at best is still below Wemby.

Clav wrote:OP, it is a bit confusing to use only one year in your phrasing, as seasons span two calendar years, so a modification to 25-26 would be more accurate.

24-25 still includes "2025", but isn't part of your focus, if I'm reading this correctly. Also, I locked your thread about 'eurofraud' Giannis last week, so this is a clever way around that, but not too clever if it devolves into that territory. Thank you!

I never said anything about Giannis being a eurofraud. So you're confusing me with someone else.

Also I meant 2024-25 (you should've gotten that, everyone else does). And no one has been able to give me a good argument for Giannis, so I assume this is all just Giannis FC coming out.

bonita_the_frog wrote:Can't see Wembanyama ever reaching the level of today's Giannis, or any version of Giannis in the last 6 years whereby Giannis has averaged 29.9 points, 11.9 rebounds, 6.0 assists, .575 field, and been one of the very best defenders in the NBA.

And I don't think Wembanyama will ever duplicate Giannis 2021 NBA Finals = Giannis averaged 35.2 points, 13.2 rebounds, 5.0 assists, 1.8 blocks, 1.2 steals, 2.3 turnovers, .618 fielding and scored 50 in the championship-winning game on just 25 field goal attempts, also 14 rebounds and
5 blocks!

And Giannis playoff averages from 2019 to 2025 = 28.8 points, 13.2 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 1.3 blocks, .537 field

Wemby?

The same Wemby who was a top 10 talent half way through year 2 before the blood clot? Not only can Wemby reach Giannis' current level, his ceiling is that of the GOAT. We are talking about a 7'3 Kevin Durant player with DPOY annually written all over him. This league will belong to Wemby if he wants it. Giannis or anyone else can compare.

Top10alltime wrote:

bonita_the_frog wrote:

Top10alltime wrote:Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

But Wembanyama only averaged 9.9 2-point attempts last season, so he's accurate because he's only attempting the easy 2-pointers.
Whereas Giannis averaged 18.7 2-point attempts last season.

As for playmaking, Giannis has averaged 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years.
Wembanyama averaged 3.7 assists in 2024-25 and 3.9 assists in his rookie season.
Will Wembanyama ever average 6.0 assists, even for one season?
Seems a long way off...

Wemby still is more efficient across the floor, and similar in transition (Giannis strong point). Sure, Giannis volume makes him a better scorer, but it's still close. Plus Wemby has more counters than finishing only

And I wasn't talking about assists. (Although Giannis and Wemby both have same amount of rim AST so that's something). I was talking about Giannis passing counter on the basketball court. Giannis only has drive & kick. I don't think that will be good enough to make a significant gap.

And on the other end of the floor, Wembanyama absolutely clears Giannis. Giannis at best is still below Wemby.

Giannis made .620 of his 2-pointers last season, and has shot over .640 twice in his career.
Wembanyama made .586 of his 2-pointers last season.

If Wembanyama has more counters why is he settling for juvenile 3-pointers always?
The proof is in the pudding, so either he starts playing manly like Giannis or he stays on the perimeter...

I get the impression Wembanyama is afraid of contact, and he knows his body won't survive the paint.
That's why I never expect much from the tallest players in the NBA, and why I don't expect much of a career for Wembanyama.

Drive and kick is the most important pass in the NBA, and that's why Giannis is averaging 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years, while Wembanyama averaged 3.9 in his rookie season and 3.7 last season.

Top10alltime wrote:

bonita_the_frog wrote:

Top10alltime wrote:Interesting stats I found -

Giannis 2025 - 74.9 rim FG%, 41.2 SMR FG%, 45.2 LMR FG%, 22.2 3PT FG%
Wemby 2025 - 76.0 rim FG%, 47.8 SMR FG%, 40.5 LMR FG%, 35.2 3PT FG%

Even though Giannis is all-time transition wise (it's his greatest strength on offense after all), Wemby still has 1.19 PPP and 71.2 TS% in transition.

(Sources: nbarapm.com)

The gap isn't that big on offense.... oh yeah, and as a playmaker, it should be close at this point. Giannis' only counter as a playmaker is drive & kick.

So, again, what is the case for Giannis over Wemby in 2025, when it's already close on offense?

But Wembanyama only averaged 9.9 2-point attempts last season, so he's accurate because he's only attempting the easy 2-pointers.
Whereas Giannis averaged 18.7 2-point attempts last season.

As for playmaking, Giannis has averaged 6.0 assists per game for the last SIX years.
Wembanyama averaged 3.7 assists in 2024-25 and 3.9 assists in his rookie season.
Will Wembanyama ever average 6.0 assists, even for one season?
Seems a long way off...

Wemby still is more efficient across the floor, and similar in transition (Giannis strong point). Sure, Giannis volume makes him a better scorer, but it's still close. Plus Wemby has more counters than finishing only

And I wasn't talking about assists. (Although Giannis and Wemby both have same amount of rim AST so that's something). I was talking about Giannis passing counter on the basketball court. Giannis only has drive & kick. I don't think that will be good enough to make a significant gap.

And on the other end of the floor, Wembanyama absolutely clears Giannis. Giannis at best is still below Wemby.

Giannis scores at a significantly higher volume while also being more efficient and a significantly better playmaker. He also does this while playing more games and more mpg. I don't see how Wemby is close to Giannis offensively.

You seem to be making the "bag" argument but that's a shortsighted way to look at the game. Kyrie has the GOAT bag but he's nowhere near discussions for GOAT offensive players. Giannis doesn't need 10 moves & 5 counters because his primary weapon is unstoppable without warping the entire defense. And ones the defense rotates, he's great at consistently finding the open man. Wemby hasn't shown the capability of consistently warping the defense and finding the open man.