RealGM

i just looked it up, and he hasnt. even when he was the 3rd player and only noncenter player to average 2 block 2 steal he didnt make the team. the hell is wrong with the nba...

Unless your in the playoffs nobody cares.

First off, averaging a lot of blocks and steals doesn't necessarily mean you're a great defender. Wallace is a good defensive player, but arguing that he should make it out of steals and blocks is pointless. If so, Josh Smith is a bigger omission than Wallace ever was if he doesn't make it this season.

The main thing here is that the Bobcats have never been good defensively as a team, and the competition for spots on the defensive team at the forward spots is pretty stiff.

Out of curiosity, which one would you leave off in 05-06 (the year Wallace averaged 2+ in both)?

Ron Artest (4th for DPOY)
Bruce Bowen (2nd for DPOY)
Andrei Kirilenko (3rd for DPOY)
Tim Duncan (6th for DPOY)
Kevin Garnett (t-13th for DPOY)
Tayshaun Prince (t-13th for DPOY)

If anything, Shawn Marion who finished 7th in the DPOY voting was a bigger omission that season.

i'd put him in over bowen seeing as bowen doesn't play defense, he hacks. also, he should at least make 3rd team.

3rd team has never existed for defensive teams...

And still, Marion should've easily made it before Wallace that season.

Well I think being in a smaller market, not really established yet (compared to as it's become since) as a defender, being on a lottery team, and missing a bunch of games (in 05-06) is why he didn't get recognized for any defensive-related ranks at the end of the year. Relating to both the media and coaches. With the media being significantly stat, flash, and name bias, too, so it shows how the other factors play in for him.

Not sure but ..

If the same people who havent voted kobe for MVP Once in his career are the ones who vote the all 1st defensive team and all 2nd .. then there is your answer

Fools should not be allowed to run this and year after year biased media ruin it ... they dont look at how you actually did and if your ARE actually good at defense or if you are the best player in the league ..

They look at your team Wins and if your not putting up good Stats on a winning team ... then i guess you dont deserve an award or an Honor

its not like this every Neither .. check Baseball

Showtime:Part2 wrote:i'd put him in over bowen seeing as bowen doesn't play defense, he hacks. also, he should at least make 3rd team.

bowen is not about stats, his not known to be a player that gets steals, or blocks

his main arsenal is containing the other person, force them to shoot bad percentages and at times he can make them have bad nights or runs where they dont score on him....

Griever24 wrote:Not sure but ..

If the same people who havent voted kobe for MVP Once in his career are the ones who vote the all 1st defensive team and all 2nd .. then there is your answer

Fools should not be allowed to run this and year after year biased media ruin it ... they dont look at how you actually did and if your ARE actually good at defense or if you are the best player in the league ..

They look at your team Wins and if your not putting up good Stats on a winning team ... then i guess you dont deserve an award or an Honor

its not like this every Neither .. check Baseball

Yeah, the coaches do the all-defensive teams, while the media do the DPOY, MIP, COY, and MVP awards.

I'm not sure on the all-nba teams.

I do think Kobe not winning the MVP is justified, though. There have just been high-quality players on superior basketball teams the last 2 seasons. Kobe can only do so much, and that wasn't getting those teams to 50 wins (or even 49).

Ballings7 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Yeah, the coaches do the all-defensive teams, while the media do the DPOY, MIP, COY, and MVP awards.

I'm not sure on the all-nba teams.

I do think Kobe not winning the MVP is justified, though. There have just been high-quality players on superior basketball teams the last 2 seasons. Kobe can only do so much, and that wasn't getting those teams to 50 wins (or even 49).

yeah thats true .. not discredit Steve nash or dirk nowitski they played amazing the past 3 seasons as well ..

But at the same time i remember hearing something crazy like 05-06 was i think maybe kobes greatest season and he didnt even make it top 3 .. they almost upset the league mvp that year too Steve Nash .. went 7 games but 1 rebound away game 6

also 02-03 was a season i believe he really deserved it for how he stepped up when Shaq went down and went for stretch of 40 points i dont remember how many games in a row but it was a lot ..

GWall's a great defender but like others said he's going against Bowen, Prince, Duncan, Rasheed, and KG who do it on teams that are consitantly elite defensive teams that win games, while GWallace is on a poor defensive team that doesn't have the best record. Besides those guys AK47, and Artest are pretty solid defensive players in the same running.
Hard lineup to crack.

Griever24 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



yeah thats true .. not discredit Steve nash or dirk nowitski they played amazing the past 3 seasons as well ..

But at the same time i remember hearing something crazy like 05-06 was i think maybe kobes greatest season and he didnt even make it top 3 .. they almost upset the league mvp that year too Steve Nash .. went 7 games but 1 rebound away game 6

also 02-03 was a season i believe he really deserved it for how he stepped up when Shaq went down and went for stretch of 40 points i dont remember how many games in a row but it was a lot ..

Every year the award goes to a team that finishes 1st or 2nd. The only year that was different was when MJ got it on a 3rd place team and had 35 ppg, 6apg, 6rpg, 3spg, 2bpg. The Lakers finished 7th which is why Kobe wasn'tin the top 3. The playoffs have nothing to do with the regular season MVP.

Hendrix wrote:GWall's a great defender but like others said he's going against Bowen, Prince, Duncan, Rasheed, and KG who do it on teams that are consitantly elite defensive teams that win games, while GWallace is on a poor defensive team that doesn't have the best record. Besides those guys AK47, and Artest are pretty solid defensive players in the same running.
Hard lineup to crack.

-= original quote snipped =-



Every year the award goes to a team that finishes 1st or 2nd. The only year that was different was when MJ got it on a 3rd place team and had 35 ppg, 6apg, 6rpg, 3spg, 2bpg. The Lakers finished 7th which is why Kobe wasn'tin the top 3. The playoffs have nothing to do with the regular season MVP.

i know that playoffs have nothing to do with playoffs .. was just saying that was his best year but your right you must have a team with the record of 1st or 2nd (or 3rd if your Jordan) and you must be the best player on that team ... But man those seasons he really carried his team ...

lets stay on subject though this is Geralds thread and i believe he should at the LEAST get 2nd all team ... but then again there is so many great sf Defenders

Gerald is better than some of the guys ranked ahead of him whom get their reputation by numbers. I still can't believe Camby won DPOY last season over Duncan.

Better question: how did Ben Wallace beat out Tim Duncan for all of those DPOY awards?

tkb wrote:First off, averaging a lot of blocks and steals doesn't necessarily

2004-2005, Larry Hughes, FIRST team All-Defense, 1st in steals.........mediocre - if not poor - defender

If Larry Hughes could have made it that year, just by leading the league in steals, then Wallace should have made it for his remarkable 2/2 season.

Possibly, but I didn't think Hughes deserved it, so him making it wouldn't influence my opinion one way or the other.

And you left out the part where I said Wallace is a good defender. It's the argument that he averaged a lot of steals and blocks I don't stand by.

And still I think there were other players playing better than him that season, including Marion who didn't make it either.

But the voters had already shown the season before that they were willing to reward a player based on his defensive stats alone (in Hughes' case, steals alone), so they should have done the same the following season, when Wallace did what few players had done before.

If Hughes leading the league in steals was worthy enough to get him voted 1st Team All-Defense, then Wallace leading the league in steals, ON TOP of averaging 2+ blocks, should have earned him a lot more recognition than he got.

Two wrongs don't make a right, though Wallace did have a case that year, but due to forward competition he shouldn't have made it IMO.

wallace is good defensively but not good enough to knock off a major star from the team

W_HAMILTON wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



2004-2005, Larry Hughes, FIRST team All-Defense, 1st in steals.........mediocre - if not poor - defender

If Larry Hughes could have made it that year, just by leading the league in steals, then Wallace should have made it for his remarkable 2/2 season.

Some points:

1) He made it as a guard. Gerald's got much tougher competition at the forward.

2) The majority of coaches didn't vote Hughes on either 1st or 2nd team. Hughes made 1st team because there was no consensus and so the few that voted for him won out.

3) I still want to smack the few coaches who voted for him.