Remember the great debate a few years ago?

DynastySS · Post #1 » by **DynastySS** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:00 am

Were Wade or Carmelo ever better than Lebron? It was always a heated argument on these boards up to maybe last year. Maybe it is because I got to see him live tonight, but I think Lebron is on a whole other stratosphere at this point. He clearly still has flaws, ft shooting and defense being some of them, but his game is evolving and growing daily. I understand that Wade is hurt and all that cute stuff, but regardless, I think it is interesting how quickly the once tight race has separated to unreachable lengths.

GJense4181 · Post #2 » by **GJense4181** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:03 am

All three were All-Star game starters, for what it's worth. However, only Lebron is guaranteed of a First-Team All-NBA spot, ahead of Carmelo, and Wade might not make any All-NBA team.
He is clearly the best player from that draft class, and nearly all teams would prefer to have him than the other two.

Buckeye-NBAFan · Post #3 » by **Buckeye-NBAFan** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:08 am

LeBron could hold Kobe to 0 points in a 7 game series and still get that bad defense stigma. Honestly, his defense is better than most. Perimeter shooting and FTs are still his biggest flaws. Which is funny, that his two biggest flaws are part of his offensive game, and he's still leading the league in scoring.

DynastySS · Post #4 » by **DynastySS** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:16 am

Buckeye-NBAFan wrote:LeBron could hold Kobe to 0 points in a 7 game series and still get that bad defense stigma. Honestly, his defense is better than most. Perimeter shooting and FTs are still his biggest flaws. Which is funny, that his two biggest flaws are part of his offensive game, and he's still leading the league in scoring.

His defense is definitely improved but it is not on a Kobe level, and I may even say not on a T-mac level. Other than that, I agree with you. His FT% really kills me, he could be oh so much better. His jumper is coming and will emerge one day.

RobertGlory · Post #5 » by **RobertGlory** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:22 am

remember wade does have the ring though

JellosJigglin · Post #6 » by **JellosJigglin** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:23 am

Buckeye-NBAFan wrote:LeBron could hold Kobe to 0 points in a 7 game series and still get that bad defense stigma. Honestly, his defense is better than most. Perimeter shooting and FTs are still his biggest flaws. Which is funny, that his two biggest flaws are part of his offensive game, and he's still leading the league in scoring.

You have to understand when people bring up his defense, they're comparing him with the elite. His defense is not bad in general. At worst it's average. But to a lot of people, in order to make that leap to the best player in the league, he has to become a shutdown defender. Not necessarily for 48 minutes, but consistently over an entire season.

Kobe goes through spurts, weeks at a time, when he looks like the DPOY. When he wants to be, he can be the best perimeter defender in the league. But Kobe earned his defensive reputation in the playoffs. Lebron hasn't had enough playoff experience to earn that reputation. He has time on his side.

prekazi · Post #7 » by **prekazi** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:27 am

DynastySS wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

His defense is definitely improved but it is not on a Kobe level, and I may even say not on a T-mac level. Other than that, I agree with you. His FT% really kills me, he could be oh so much better. His jumper is coming and will emerge one day.

T-Mac Level?

DynastySS · Post #8 » by **DynastySS** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:28 am

prekazi wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

T-Mac Level?

He plays pretty solid defense actually. At least when he is motivated.

Buckeye-NBAFan · Post #9 » by **Buckeye-NBAFan** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:29 am

DynastySS wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

His defense is definitely improved but it is not on a Kobe level, and I may even say not on a T-mac level. Other than that, I agree with you. His FT% really kills me, he could be oh so much better. His jumper is coming and will emerge one day.

!@#$ I guess I should have specified, when I said LeBron's defense is better than most, I didn't mean LeBron's defense was better than Kobe's. I'd have thought it was pretty straight forward.

Just because LeBron isn't the best defender in the game doesn't mean it's the weakest link in his game.

MalReyn · Post #10 » by **MalReyn** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:31 am

DynastySS wrote:Were Wade or Carmelo ever better than Lebron? It was always a heated argument on these boards up to maybe last year. Maybe it is because I got to see him live tonight, but I think Lebron is on a whole other stratosphere at this point. He clearly still has flaws, ft shooting and defense being some of them, but his game is evolving and growing daily. I understand that Wade is hurt and all that cute stuff, but regardless, I think it is interesting how quickly the once tight race has separated to unreachable lengths.

What's truly scary is that Darko was chosen ahead of Wade/Melo/Bosh, and many people thought it was a great pick at the time.

Anyway, clearly Lebron is at another level. It's amazing to watch. It'll really be scary if Ferry gets his act together and gets him a good supporting cast.

LakerFanMan · Post #11 » by **LakerFanMan** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:34 am

His D probably is his weakest link. His game is just that good. He's a slightly above average defender and its still his weakest link. Well maybe you could argue his mid range jumper and/or his free throw shooting is.

DynastySS · Post #12 » by **DynastySS** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:37 am

Buckeye-NBAFan wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

!@#$ I guess I should have specified, when I said LeBron's defense is better than most, I didn't mean LeBron's defense was better than Kobe's. I'd have thought it was pretty straight forward.

Just because LeBron isn't the best defender in the game doesn't mean it's the weakest link in his game.

If it isn't the weakest link, than it is tied for the weakest. There is no doubt he could improve greatly in that respect. Not saying he is horrible now, just he has head room. Nothing wrong with that, he is young.

Egg Nog · Post #13 » by **Egg Nog** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 6:44 am

RobertGlory wrote:remember wade does have the ring though

Which has effectively zero impact on how well he plays basketball.

Rings are awesome and something to be proud of, but people take them to mean more than they do.

Buckeye-NBAFan · Post #14 » by **Buckeye-NBAFan** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 8:48 pm

Egg Nog wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Which has effectively zero impact on how well he plays basketball.

Rings are awesome and something to be proud of, but people take them to mean more than they do.

Nonsense. Wade > Barkley + Malone + Nique combined.

hermes · Post #15 » by **hermes** » Thu Mar 6, 2008 10:02 pm

RobertGlory wrote:remember wade does have the ring though

so he's better than lebron?

East_Coast · Post #16 » by **East_Coast** » Fri Mar 7, 2008 12:18 am

Remember the great debate a few years ago about who should be drafted #1, DHo or Okafor?

jefe · Post #17 » by **jefe** » Fri Mar 7, 2008 12:32 am

RobertGlory wrote:remember wade does have the ring though

remember darko got his first though

Alex_De_Large · Post #18 » by **Alex_De_Large** » Fri Mar 7, 2008 1:00 am

Yeah i remember, i even thought Wade was going to be better, i was very wrong, Carmelo Anthony and also Wade are a bit overrated and can't lead a good team being the franchise players.

Chubby Chaser · Post #19 » by **Chubby Chaser** » Fri Mar 7, 2008 1:20 am

Wade has more rings than Lebron. It's not the end all /thread of the argument. Although it's not fair, when it's all said and done people judge a player by championships. Statistical records are nice, but rings turn super star players into legends. Lebron's career won't be validated until he reaches that accomplishment.

Wade2k6 · Post #20 » by **Wade2k6** » Fri Mar 7, 2008 1:56 am

You people are ridiculous sometimes. This is all coming because of the fact that Wade is currently physically not able to play at the top of his game. Two years ago he had a historic playoff run, and LeBron was sort of forgotten about for a while over that summer. Last year Wade lead the league in per and was putting up possibly the best numbers in the game until he hurt his shoulder. Now, he just isn't physically able to perform at that level this year.

Now obviously LeBron is still incredible. I'm not taking anything away from him. But, I think this comparison will be much closer come next year, after he has his full year to recover from the surgery, like the doctors said.

This year Ill take LeBron over Wade, and possibly Melo. Next year, I'll take LeBron and Wade at 1A and 1B, with Melo at 3rd.