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Drew Gooden with Cleveland this year:

51 games
30.7 mpg
11.3 ppg
44.4 FG%

Drew Gooden with Chicago:

16 games
32.3 mpg
15.1 ppg
47.5 FG%


Larry Hughes with Cleveland this year:

40 games
30.3 mpg
12.3 ppg
37.7 FG%
34.1 3PT%

Larry Hughes with Chicago:

16 games
31.9 mpg
14.1 ppg
38.9 FG%
37.0 3PT%


Wally Szczerbiak with Seattle this year:

50 games
23.6 mpg
13.1 ppg
46.0 FG%
42.8 3PT%

Wally Szczerbiak with Cleveland:

15 games
23.2 mpg
9.1 ppg
35.1 FG%
37.0 3PT%


Delonte West with Seattle this year:

35 games
20.8 mpg
6.8 ppg
38.8 FG%
33.9 3PT%

Delonte West with Cleveland:

16 games
31.2 mpg
9.2 ppg
41.3 FG%
33.3 3PT%


Three out of the four players have significantly better ppg averages and high shooting percentages without LeBron.

The one player (Szczerbiak) that was expected to benefit the most from playing with LeBron has the biggest dropoff in numbers playing with him as opposed to playing without him.


I find this very interesting when you consider how people like to toot LeBron's horn on how much he "makes the players around him better."

It's all a bunch of garbage.

All true.

A little over a dozen games played is not a big enough sample size to be making these conclusions. Also, the differences between the stats are not significant enough to mean anything. A few percentage points means nothing and there's a lot of other factors that need to be taken into consideration.

Plays well with the fact that nearly every player who has ever played with Kobe after the Shaq era had/have career highs across most categories.

LeBron clearly sucks and is D-League material

We'll give you Jerome James for him

I'd be interested to see FGA/usage rates etc, but regardless no one makes anyone else better... that is one of the dumbest and most moronically accepted catch phrases in sports history. Example:

Nash dishes the ball out to Raja Bell who hits a three

Nash dishes the ball out to Raja Bell who misses a three

Only one thing is constant in those examples. Nash (I'm not picking on him but he is the one most people say is "making people better") or any other PG don't "make their teammates better"... the most he or anyone can do is make good decisions to put his teammates in better positions/situations to score.

Is that him making them better? No, because the onus is still on them to make the shots. Does he make their life easier by giving them the ball in more ideal situations for them to shoot? Yeah definitely, but they are different things entirely.

So LeBron James must be a God because he made the Nba finals with 0 stars and a very limited coach. Oh, If you consider Drew Gooden and Larry Hughes as a star with those stats, enjoy watching basketball.

I've said this before but I'm called a hater then they'll present Lebrons stats lol

What do you want him to do? He's playing with a big pile of

Anybody care to guess how many titles the Lakers would have won if they had LeBron playing with Shaq instead of Kobe?? 5, 6, 7 with 75 win seasons???

OMG, LEbRoN stAT-PaDS aND dOeSn'T MaKE hIs TeAmmAtES bEtTEr.

I wouldn't put too much stock on the stats of the players that went to the Bulls.

For one thing, Chicago is/was near the bottom of the league in offense. Drew now has role in Chi-town where he can be the man in the paint and is actually looked to to produce. In Cleveland he was behind LBJ of course and even Big Z down low. He made a comment shortly after his arrival to the effect that he really didn't have to prepare much in Cleveland to 'go out and grab 8 rebounds in 28 minutes'. Not something Cavs fans would want to hear, but he is obviously a little more excited about getting to show more what he can do on offense now. However, he still makes very questionable plays on defense of course.

Hughes is similar. Despite his minorly improved statistics, he still can't shoot from outside, has trouble finishing even when he does get to the rim, and seems to drift in and out of competing hard on defense vs simply gambling. I don't think these guys are any different players just perhaps getting a few more opportunities.

Now if we look at the Bulls players that went to Cleveland are they now doing significantly worse? I think they look about the same as they were on Chicago.

Sometimes players changing scenery is more about a better fit or getting into a new system. Not everything should be shoehorned or reduced into a all encompassing cause and effect directly related to playing with a certain superstar or not.

tha_rock220 wrote:Anybody care to guess how many titles the Lakers would have won if they had LeBron playing with Shaq instead of Kobe?? 5, 6, 7 with 75 win seasons???

12 and half with the best season being a 79-3.

I don't think these stats can be used to make such a radical statement that. LeBron makes his teammates better, imo; just because they're not having career highs doesn't mean they don't benefit from playing with him.

I fail to see why Bryant was brought into this discussion, though.

well that proves it

Big Bird wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



12 and half with the best season being a 79-3.

I don't think these stats can be used to make such a radical statement that. LeBron makes his teammates better, imo; just because they're not having career highs doesn't mean they don't benefit from playing with him.

I fail to see why Bryant was brought into this discussion, though.

probably because that stats were either brought in by a kobe or wade fan and if I had to guess if would be the former one

if u dont see that lebron makes his teammates better just by watching them play (the cavs are on national tv at least once a week!), then i dont think u know basketball... not only does he take defensive attention by being a top 2 scorer in the league, but his court vision is world class... he gets them open shots, after that its up to them to make it in.. he can only do so much

Lebrons overrated.

not only does he take defensive attention by being a top 2 scorer in the league, but his court vision is world class... he gets them open shots, after that its up to them to make it in.. he can only do so much

How does that make his teammates better? He can get them all the open shots he likes but they still have to make the shots.

Eh there was a good article or maybe it was post not too long ago which expanded upon this idea and showed how just about all the players who have played with Lebron have seen their stats go down and not up.

When you think about it, it does make sense though. Lebron doesn't really move without the ball and is prone to killing ball movement by relentlessly pounding the ball away as the shot clock winds down.