TMACFORMVP wrote:Big time win by the Suns, Shaq was terrific in the 4th quarter.
I take it T-Mac was resting up for the matchup?
Wednesday 04/09/08 Game Thread
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JDawg
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SeattleSun
is out of it if he thinks that the Suns beat the lakers with Bynum back.
Bottom line is this
Bynum and Pau vs. Shaq and Amare
its a tossup. Its tough. Its out there.
But, here's the kicker. Lakers got Kobe.
NO ONE, not Bell, not anyoen on the suns can deal with Kobe on oen one. Its that simple.
The lakers biggest weakness is DP form multiple positions at all times.
PG, SG, SF.
The Suns dont have that.
Nash isn't a blow by PG liek Paul or TP so he wont dominate Fisher/Farmar in that way. HE'll still do well, but there's a difference in breaking down the entire D by blowing by your man.
Nash cant do it anymore. He's good of pick and roll.
Bell doenst penetrate
Barbosa does, but not the way you think he does.
Hill not as much as he used to either.
Without the mutliple penetrating threats, and Kobe not being able to be defended by ANYONE ont he Suns, and its advantage Lakers.
Sorry pal.
is out of it if he thinks that the Suns beat the lakers with Bynum back.
Bottom line is this
Bynum and Pau vs. Shaq and Amare
its a tossup. Its tough. Its out there.
But, here's the kicker. Lakers got Kobe.
NO ONE, not Bell, not anyoen on the suns can deal with Kobe on oen one. Its that simple.
The lakers biggest weakness is DP form multiple positions at all times.
PG, SG, SF.
The Suns dont have that.
Nash isn't a blow by PG liek Paul or TP so he wont dominate Fisher/Farmar in that way. HE'll still do well, but there's a difference in breaking down the entire D by blowing by your man.
Nash cant do it anymore. He's good of pick and roll.
Bell doenst penetrate
Barbosa does, but not the way you think he does.
Hill not as much as he used to either.
Without the mutliple penetrating threats, and Kobe not being able to be defended by ANYONE ont he Suns, and its advantage Lakers.
Sorry pal.
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Seattlesun
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JDawg wrote:^^^ WCF???
Suns wont get past the lakers if they meet pal....take it easy there.
The lakers achillees heel is mutliple position DP. You gusy dont have that.
i watched last night, lakers are back to all kobe all the time. straight up schooled by a non playoff team following up losses to teams like the bobcats. lakers had a fun run for awhile but they are very ordinary
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NO-KG-AI
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NetsForce
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Seattlesun wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
i watched last night, lakers are back to all kobe all the time. straight up schooled by a non playoff team following up losses to teams like the bobcats. lakers had a fun run for awhile but they are very ordinary
Which is more than enough to beat the Suns.
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NetsForce
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NO-KG-AI wrote:SHaq/Amare>>>Pau/Bynum, and that's assuming Bynum is healthy and they mesh well.
You know I'm actually not going to argue with that statement (because it's true), but how much better are they? I think that's a good question / topic to discuss... Pau doesn't put up the gaudy numbers Amare does but he really opens things up for everyone on the Lakers, his passing from the high post is top-notch.
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enigmatics
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NetsForce wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
You know I'm actually not going to argue with that statement (because it's true), but how much better are they? I think that's a good question / topic to discuss... Pau doesn't put up the gaudy numbers Amare does but he really opens things up for everyone on the Lakers, his passing from the high post is top-notch.
What's there to compare with Amare and Gasol. Amare is a better FT shooter, better FG %, and plenty more explosive, especially off the dribble. The only thing Gasol has on Amare is height. Both are sh*t for defense with Amare being a smidge better on the weakside help with blocks.
Gasol's a great player to have in that offense, but he's still not a game dominator.
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JDawg
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SeattleSun,
You dont understand the nuances of different mathcups.
Portland has the goods to make our life hell. Phoenix does not.
Portland has
1) DP attack from multiple positions and backups
2) Bigs who can step outside and shoot form center AND pf
3) Better team defense to try and stop Kobe with cheating over to help etc.
The Suns dont have #1 outside of Nash, Barbosa and Hill and Hill is somehwat limited in that respect now. Nash doenst blow by Fisher and Farmar on his own like a TP or Paul or even Jarret Jack was doign last night to the lakers.
And as soon as its Barbosa, Nash, Hill, WHO ON EARTH defends Kobe.
In addition, Shaq is terrible in a pick and roll situaion guardign Kobe AND in addition to that, he cant shoot from outside to stretch the D.
His first game wiht the Suns he had 15 and 9, I beleive and they scored 124 points...but still lost.
Bottom line is Amare will score 30 and 15 for the series and it STILL wont be enough ESPECIALLY if Bynum is back, because that gaem was actually WIHTOUT Bynum at all, let alone at 80%.
The matchups are just simply different.
Its liek Utah.
Utah would CLOCK THE CRAP out of Portland right?
But their chances agaisnt the Lakers???? Not very good right.
And why??? becuase THYE ALSO DONT HAVE multiple DP from multipe positions outside of Deron Williams.
Brewer
CJ Miles
AK
Korver
NONE is a great dp player like what Portland has, so it doenst expose the lakers dp defense.
IF you DO NOT have multiple DP from multiple positions, it is INFINITLEY MORE difficult to beat the lakers.
Thats a fact.
GO look at the types of teams taht beat the lakers.
The mavericks were a tougher matchup before when Harris was on the team because he woudl DP the crap out of the lakers guards.
DP meaning DRIBBLE PENETRATION.
The Suns dont have multiple DP threats and are clogged inthe middle
Utah doesnt
SA has two guys
NOH has efffectively 1 and a couple other semi-ones.
The types of teams that give the lakers fits are IRONICALLY all bottom dwellers.
Teams like Charlotte with guys like Felton, Wallace, JRich, etc. Golden State, Memphis with their gaurds, Porltand, etc.
Go check it out.
Its weird but its the truth. The game is matchup driven and if you dont believe me now, you'll believe me come playoff time when the lakers D looks better than it has recently.
All of a sudden a guy like Vlad can play Korver because Korver wont roast him on DP. SEE HOW big a differnence that is.
Thats just one small example.
You dont understand the nuances of different mathcups.
Portland has the goods to make our life hell. Phoenix does not.
Portland has
1) DP attack from multiple positions and backups
2) Bigs who can step outside and shoot form center AND pf
3) Better team defense to try and stop Kobe with cheating over to help etc.
The Suns dont have #1 outside of Nash, Barbosa and Hill and Hill is somehwat limited in that respect now. Nash doenst blow by Fisher and Farmar on his own like a TP or Paul or even Jarret Jack was doign last night to the lakers.
And as soon as its Barbosa, Nash, Hill, WHO ON EARTH defends Kobe.
In addition, Shaq is terrible in a pick and roll situaion guardign Kobe AND in addition to that, he cant shoot from outside to stretch the D.
His first game wiht the Suns he had 15 and 9, I beleive and they scored 124 points...but still lost.
Bottom line is Amare will score 30 and 15 for the series and it STILL wont be enough ESPECIALLY if Bynum is back, because that gaem was actually WIHTOUT Bynum at all, let alone at 80%.
The matchups are just simply different.
Its liek Utah.
Utah would CLOCK THE CRAP out of Portland right?
But their chances agaisnt the Lakers???? Not very good right.
And why??? becuase THYE ALSO DONT HAVE multiple DP from multipe positions outside of Deron Williams.
Brewer
CJ Miles
AK
Korver
NONE is a great dp player like what Portland has, so it doenst expose the lakers dp defense.
IF you DO NOT have multiple DP from multiple positions, it is INFINITLEY MORE difficult to beat the lakers.
Thats a fact.
GO look at the types of teams taht beat the lakers.
The mavericks were a tougher matchup before when Harris was on the team because he woudl DP the crap out of the lakers guards.
DP meaning DRIBBLE PENETRATION.
The Suns dont have multiple DP threats and are clogged inthe middle
Utah doesnt
SA has two guys
NOH has efffectively 1 and a couple other semi-ones.
The types of teams that give the lakers fits are IRONICALLY all bottom dwellers.
Teams like Charlotte with guys like Felton, Wallace, JRich, etc. Golden State, Memphis with their gaurds, Porltand, etc.
Go check it out.
Its weird but its the truth. The game is matchup driven and if you dont believe me now, you'll believe me come playoff time when the lakers D looks better than it has recently.
All of a sudden a guy like Vlad can play Korver because Korver wont roast him on DP. SEE HOW big a differnence that is.
Thats just one small example.
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Seattlesun
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NetsForce wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
You know I'm actually not going to argue with that statement (because it's true), but how much better are they? I think that's a good question / topic to discuss... Pau doesn't put up the gaudy numbers Amare does but he really opens things up for everyone on the Lakers, his passing from the high post is top-notch.
suns dominate the spurs on a laker off night and the laker schlong suckin sheep still find a way to work in something about LA. hehe, some things will never change.
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enigmatics
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JDawg wrote:SeattleSun,
You dont understand the nuances of different mathcups.
Portland has the goods to make our life hell. Phoenix does not.
Portland has
1) DP attack from multiple positions and backups
2) Bigs who can step outside and shoot form center AND pf
3) Better team defense to try and stop Kobe with cheating over to help etc.
The Suns dont have #1 outside of Nash, Barbosa and Hill and Hill is somehwat limited in that respect now. Nash doenst blow by Fisher and Farmar on his own like a TP or Paul or even Jarret Jack was doign last night to the lakers.
And as soon as its Barbosa, Nash, Hill, WHO ON EARTH defends Kobe.
In addition, Shaq is terrible in a pick and roll situaion guardign Kobe AND in addition to that, he cant shoot from outside to stretch the D.
His first game wiht the Suns he had 15 and 9, I beleive and they scored 124 points...but still lost.
Bottom line is Amare will score 30 and 15 for the series and it STILL wont be enough ESPECIALLY if Bynum is back, because that gaem was actually WIHTOUT Bynum at all, let alone at 80%.
The matchups are just simply different.
Its liek Utah.
Utah would CLOCK THE CRAP out of Portland right?
But their chances agaisnt the Lakers???? Not very good right.
And why??? becuase THYE ALSO DONT HAVE multiple DP from multipe positions outside of Deron Williams.
Brewer
CJ Miles
AK
Korver
NONE is a great dp player like what Portland has, so it doenst expose the lakers dp defense.
IF you DO NOT have multiple DP from multiple positions, it is INFINITLEY MORE difficult to beat the lakers.
Thats a fact.
No.1, what in the world is "DP"
Secondly, nobody on this planet can actually guard Kobe. The question is, can you make him work hard to score or make him selfish. The Suns have two guys in Hill and Bell who have the length and hustle to make scoring harder on Kobe.
Third, the Suns don't have bigs who can shoot? Are you kidding? Boris Diaw and Amare Stoudemire are no spring chickens from the outside my friend. They shoot a heckuva lot better than the Portland bigs.
The pick and roll defense is no doubt a problem, I'll give you that. If you base everything off of what you saw in that first game, then you're sorrowly mistaken. Being Shaq's first game ........and we STILL had a shot to win. This Suns team is a far different team than in that game. Stop acting like it'll be some automatic win. Ya'll don't have anyone to guard Amare. We don't have anyone to matchup one-on-one with Kobe. It would be a great series.
Just saw your answer about "DP" .........if you think Nash can't penetrate, then I'm sorry - you must be living in a cave. While he may not be a Kobe or a McGrady, he can still penetrate, often times making life easier around him. To think that Nash is all pick-and-roll is extremely foolish.
...........and since when do you guys boast the perimeter defense to keep the Suns on lockdown to prevent any cuts to the hoop? That's a big sore spot on your team right now.