2018: LeBron v TOR

[SpreeS]

One word - EAST. The best teams w/o Lebron Heat/Cavs in 2011/2018 period

2011 Chicago with MVP Rose
2012 Chicago with injured Rose
2013 NY with Carmelo
2014 Indiana with George
2015 Atlanta with .....
2016 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry
2017 Boston with Isaiah Thomas
2018 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry

Maybe only one George will reach All-time TOP100

[King Ken]

One word - EAST. The best teams w/o Cavs in 2015/2018 period

2015 Atlanta with .....
2016 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry
2017 Boston with Isaiah Thomas
2018 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry

Those were some excellent teams. Atlanta basically created the modern NBA style of play. Defensive versatility, everyone 1-5 can shoot. Everyone could move with or without the ball. Excellent passers who shot exceptionally well.

The issue is our depth took a hit with Thabo getting his ass kicked by NYPD and we couldn't afford that.

Playoff LeBron is also a different monster. In the RS, he plays 36 mpg. In the playoffs, 46 mpg. That means he's always on the damn floor.

He consistently was destroying the integrity of our defense and forcing Al who we built the team around defensively in bad positions and that was the end of our chapter. It's easy for low BBIQ fans to say, look at the teams, they weren't that impressive talent wise which is true but they were Excellent teams. The Raptors and the Hawks.

I would go so far to say those teams were better than those Celtics teams that Bron struggled with to a degree as an unit. That said, Toronto had the same issue v. Cleveland as we did. He destroyed the defensive integrity of their defense and he never came out of the game so you could never take advantage of their lack of depth. LeBron is the best player I've ever seen in NBA history, especially from an impact stance, prime Bron is going to break you.

[PhiEaglesfan712]

One word - EAST. The best teams w/o Lebron Heat/Cavs in 2011/2018 period

2011 Chicago with MVP Rose
2012 Chicago with injured Rose
2013 NY with Carmelo
2014 Indiana with George
2015 Atlanta with .....
2016 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry
2017 Boston with Isaiah Thomas
2018 Toronto with DeRozan/Lowry

Maybe only one George will reach All-time TOP100

2012 was the Celtics with Pierce, Garnett, Allen, and Rondo. That core won 2 Eastern Conference titles, including an NBA title, and was easily the best Eastern Conference team that LeBron faced in this period. Putting the 2012 Celtics makes the list look a lot more respectable.

[capfan33]

One thing with the east is that yea the teams were great, but generally had stronger defenses. Specifically the Pacers and Bulls had incredible defenses year in and year out that Lebron always had to get through, and the Celtics even though they were getting older.

[JordansBulls]

Largest SRS differential sweeps against #1 seeds

2018 ECSF: Cavs (.59 SRS) sweep Raptors (7.29 SRS), -6.70 SRS
2001 WCF: Lakers (3.74 SRS) sweep Spurs (7.92 SRS), -4.18 SRS
1995 Finals: Rockets (2.32 SRS) sweep Magic (6.44 SRS), -4.12 SRS
2015 ECF: Cavs (4.08 SRS) sweep Hawks (4.75 SRS), -.67 SRS
1989 Finals: Pistons (6.24 SRS) sweep Lakers (6.38 SRS), -.14 SRS

Sweeps by lower seeds against #1 seeds

—#1 seed 1969 Bullets were swept by the #3 seed Knicks. Knicks had the higher SRS (+1.43).
—#1 seed 1970 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had a slightly higher SRS (+1.0)
—#1 seed 1977 Lakers were swept by the #3 seed Blazers. The Blazers actually had a much higher SRS (+2.75)
—#1 seed 1983 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Sixers. Sixers had the higher SRS (+2.47)
—#1 seed 1989 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Pistons. Lakers had the slightly higher SRS (+.14 SRS)
—#1 seed 1995 Magic were swept by the #6 seed Rockets. Magic had the much higher SRS (+4.12)
—#1 seed 2001 Spurs were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Spurs had he much higher SRS (+4.18)
—#1 seed 2002 Nets were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had the much higher SRS (+3.48)
—#1 seed 2003 Pistons were swept by the #2 seed Nets. Nets had a higher SRS (+1.45)
—#1 seed 2015 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Cavs. Hawks had the slightly higher SRS (+.67)
—#1 seed 2018 Raptors were swept by the #4 seed Cavs. Raptors had a much higher SRS (+6.70)

Cleveland swept a team with the #2 SRS rating in the league and then Cleveland got swept by the team with the #3 SRS rating in the league and was the only ones swept by the #3 SRS Rated team as well.

[falcolombardi]

Largest SRS differential sweeps against #1 seeds

2018 ECSF: Cavs (.59 SRS) sweep Raptors (7.29 SRS), -6.70 SRS
2001 WCF: Lakers (3.74 SRS) sweep Spurs (7.92 SRS), -4.18 SRS
1995 Finals: Rockets (2.32 SRS) sweep Magic (6.44 SRS), -4.12 SRS
2015 ECF: Cavs (4.08 SRS) sweep Hawks (4.75 SRS), -.67 SRS
1989 Finals: Pistons (6.24 SRS) sweep Lakers (6.38 SRS), -.14 SRS

Sweeps by lower seeds against #1 seeds

—#1 seed 1969 Bullets were swept by the #3 seed Knicks. Knicks had the higher SRS (+1.43).
—#1 seed 1970 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had a slightly higher SRS (+1.0)
—#1 seed 1977 Lakers were swept by the #3 seed Blazers. The Blazers actually had a much higher SRS (+2.75)
—#1 seed 1983 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Sixers. Sixers had the higher SRS (+2.47)
—#1 seed 1989 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Pistons. Lakers had the slightly higher SRS (+.14 SRS)
—#1 seed 1995 Magic were swept by the #6 seed Rockets. Magic had the much higher SRS (+4.12)
—#1 seed 2001 Spurs were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Spurs had he much higher SRS (+4.18)
—#1 seed 2002 Nets were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had the much higher SRS (+3.48)
—#1 seed 2003 Pistons were swept by the #2 seed Nets. Nets had a higher SRS (+1.45)
—#1 seed 2015 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Cavs. Hawks had the slightly higher SRS (+.67)
—#1 seed 2018 Raptors were swept by the #4 seed Cavs. Raptors had a much higher SRS (+6.70)

Cleveland swept a team with the #2 SRS rating in the league and then Cleveland got swept by the team with the #3 SRS rating in the league and was the only ones swept by the #3 SRS Rated team as well.

Is almost like hca and srs is not a perfect way to evaluate how good a team is

[JordansBulls]

Largest SRS differential sweeps against #1 seeds

2018 ECSF: Cavs (.59 SRS) sweep Raptors (7.29 SRS), -6.70 SRS
2001 WCF: Lakers (3.74 SRS) sweep Spurs (7.92 SRS), -4.18 SRS
1995 Finals: Rockets (2.32 SRS) sweep Magic (6.44 SRS), -4.12 SRS
2015 ECF: Cavs (4.08 SRS) sweep Hawks (4.75 SRS), -.67 SRS
1989 Finals: Pistons (6.24 SRS) sweep Lakers (6.38 SRS), -.14 SRS

Sweeps by lower seeds against #1 seeds

—#1 seed 1969 Bullets were swept by the #3 seed Knicks. Knicks had the higher SRS (+1.43).
—#1 seed 1970 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had a slightly higher SRS (+1.0)
—#1 seed 1977 Lakers were swept by the #3 seed Blazers. The Blazers actually had a much higher SRS (+2.75)
—#1 seed 1983 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Sixers. Sixers had the higher SRS (+2.47)
—#1 seed 1989 Lakers were swept by the #1 seed Pistons. Lakers had the slightly higher SRS (+.14 SRS)
—#1 seed 1995 Magic were swept by the #6 seed Rockets. Magic had the much higher SRS (+4.12)
—#1 seed 2001 Spurs were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Spurs had he much higher SRS (+4.18)
—#1 seed 2002 Nets were swept by the #2 seed Lakers. Lakers had the much higher SRS (+3.48)
—#1 seed 2003 Pistons were swept by the #2 seed Nets. Nets had a higher SRS (+1.45)
—#1 seed 2015 Hawks were swept by the #2 seed Cavs. Hawks had the slightly higher SRS (+.67)
—#1 seed 2018 Raptors were swept by the #4 seed Cavs. Raptors had a much higher SRS (+6.70)

Cleveland swept a team with the #2 SRS rating in the league and then Cleveland got swept by the team with the #3 SRS rating in the league and was the only ones swept by the #3 SRS Rated team as well.

Is almost like hca and srs is not a perfect way to evaluate how good a team is

A team that didn't even get 50 wins got a win off of them while an all time great against them in his prime couldn't with another hall of famer in there prime couldn't.

[falcolombardi]

Cleveland swept a team with the #2 SRS rating in the league and then Cleveland got swept by the team with the #3 SRS rating in the league and was the only ones swept by the #3 SRS Rated team as well.

Is almost like hca and srs is not a perfect way to evaluate how good a team is

A team that didn't even get 50 wins got a win off of them while an all time great against them in his prime couldn't with another hall of famer in there prime couldn't.

Yes, the 86 hawks winning a game against boston when jordan couldnt is very wild/s

Man your cut offs are always so arbitrary lol

[JordansBulls]

Is almost like hca and srs is not a perfect way to evaluate how good a team is

A team that didn't even get 50 wins got a win off of them while an all time great against them in his prime couldn't with another hall of famer in there prime couldn't.

Yes, the 86 hawks winning a game against boston when jordan couldnt is very wild/s

Man your cut offs are always so arbitrary lol

So Jordan had won league mvp by that time? In 2018 did Lebron have a league mvp? I mean come on let's be real. 1986 set the playoff record and missed 64 games in his 2nd season. People try to say Lebron 2018 is his peak. No one says Jordan in year 2 missing 64 is his peak. And Lebron had switched teams multiple times as well. If this is incorrect prove me wrong.

[falcolombardi]

A team that didn't even get 50 wins got a win off of them while an all time great against them in his prime couldn't with another hall of famer in there prime couldn't.

Yes, the 86 hawks winning a game against boston when jordan couldnt is very wild/s

Man your cut offs are always so arbitrary lol

So Jordan had won league mvp by that time? In 2018 did Lebron have a league mvp? I mean come on let's be real. 1986 set the playoff record and missed 64 games in his 2nd season. People try to say Lebron 2018 is his peak. No one says Jordan in year 2 missing 64 is his peak. And Lebron had switched teams multiple times as well. If this is incorrect prove me wrong.

Jordan in 86 was less than a year younger than lebron in his first mvp and arguable peak season (2009)

I have also never seen 2018 lebron argued as his peak in real gm tbh but maybe it happens?

Regardless, my point is how arbitrary it all is to say "this player got swept but this merely ok team took a game!"

[JordansBulls]

Yes, the 86 hawks winning a game against boston when jordan couldnt is very wild/s

Man your cut offs are always so arbitrary lol

So Jordan had won league mvp by that time? In 2018 did Lebron have a league mvp? I mean come on let's be real. 1986 set the playoff record and missed 64 games in his 2nd season. People try to say Lebron 2018 is his peak. No one says Jordan in year 2 missing 64 is his peak. And Lebron had switched teams multiple times as well. If this is incorrect prove me wrong.

Jordan in 86 was less than a year younger than lebron in his first mvp and arguable peak season (2009)

I have also never seen 2018 lebron argued as his peak in real gm tbh but maybe it happens?

Regardless, my point is how arbitrary it all is to say "this player got swept but this merely ok team took a game!"

Then why switch teams if that good? I mean 1 title in 11 years for the franchise that drafted him while guys like Dirk, Hakeem did better for franchises that never won.

Dirk didn't switch teams, Hakeem didn't, MJ didn't, Isiah didn't to win a title. And I am talking about franchises who didn't win before those guys joining them and winning league/finals mvp. If wrong show me.

[Jaivl]

Didn't MJ switch teams twice IN THE MIDDLE OF HIS PRIME? Resorting to blatant lies to prove a point is so beneath you, JB.

First the Birmingham Barons, then the Washington Wizards. Weak-willed, weak-minded player. Small dong as well, per Madonna.

[PistolPeteJR]

A team that didn't even get 50 wins got a win off of them while an all time great against them in his prime couldn't with another hall of famer in there prime couldn't.

Yes, the 86 hawks winning a game against boston when jordan couldnt is very wild/s

Man your cut offs are always so arbitrary lol

So Jordan had won league mvp by that time? In 2018 did Lebron have a league mvp? I mean come on let's be real. 1986 set the playoff record and missed 64 games in his 2nd season. People try to say Lebron 2018 is his peak. No one says Jordan in year 2 missing 64 is his peak. And Lebron had switched teams multiple times as well. If this is incorrect prove me wrong.

99% of people who have an opinion on LeBron's peak DO NOT say it was 2018. Please stop.

[PhiEaglesfan712]

A reasonable case can be made that 2018 was LeBron's peak. In my opinion, the 2017-18 season was LeBron's best considering the the supporting cast that year wasn't anywhere as good as he had in previous seasons, especially 2011-17. LeBron's team even had a makeover at the trade deadline and was left with a bunch of nobodys, which he carried to the Finals. To me, that's more impressive than his 2012, 2013, and 2016 Championships.