Better player: Kevin McHale or LaMarcus Aldridge

[dygaction]

Who do you pick?

[Colbinii]

McHale was better at his peak, almost assuredly.

[Cavsfansince84]

Not really close. McHale was comfortably better on both ends.

[IdolW0rm]

McHale is vastly superior. Can't really see half an argument favoring LA here.

[70sFan]

Don't see any case for Aldridge.

[AEnigma]

There are limits to the value of midrange accuracy and turnover economy.

[ronnymac2]

I didn't know LaMarcus Aldridge was a 20,000-point scorer. 16 seasons in and he still was a double-digit scorer last year.

Aldridge is one of very few players in NBA history who was a top-2 player on a 10 SRS team (2016). His first three years in SAS, his teams finished top-3 in defensive rating (including two No. 1 finishes). He had two years in Portland as the second best offensive player on top-2 offenses in the league (2009 and 2014).

His playoff resume is a bit up-and-down, but no doubt this guy has longevity and could be slotted with a myriad of different teammates, team archetypes, etc, and be successful. Not often is a volume jump-shooting forward with elite TOV% also a good offensive rebounder and very good (probably not elite) defensive big man. That's a great piece to have.

I think McHale at his best was better. Not a blowout though. For career, considering McHale's incredibly underwhelming longevity of prime, I think you've got a compelling comparison.

Would have been really interesting if Kawhi hadn't gone down in 2017. Aldridge was coming off the greatest game of his career in Game 6 of the WCSF against HOU where he dropped 34 points, 12 rebounds (5 offensive), 63 TS% with two turnovers in a blowout victory over number-three SRS Houston without Kawhi playing. Spurs controlling the overhyped greatest team ever in Game 1 of the WCF before they need to send their goon to purposefully hurt SAS's best player. If SAS beats Golden State and Cleveland, Aldridge's all-time stock skyrockets.

[homecourtloss]

I didn't know LaMarcus Aldridge was a 20,000-point scorer. 16 seasons in and he still was a double-digit scorer last year.

Aldridge is one of very few players in NBA history who was a top-2 player on a 10 SRS team (2016). His first three years in SAS, his teams finished top-3 in defensive rating (including two No. 1 finishes). He had two years in Portland as the second best offensive player on top-2 offenses in the league (2009 and 2014).

He played a lot of minutes on a team that like the rest its players but I’m not sure if he was a top two player on the 2016 team. I know they played fewer minutes but to be honest, I’d rather have Manu, Danny Green, and probably even old Duncan who is a much better defensive player and his final year than Aldridge was in his best year.

San Antonio finished top three in defensive rating in those years, but how much of that can be attributed to Aldridge?

In 2016 the Spurs were basically the same defensively with him on court or with him off the court. RAPM and other impact metrics not really indicative Of LMA being a key defensive cog

In 2017, the Spurs were much better defensively without him on the court; same as above with metrics

In 2018, the Spurs were about the same defensively with him on court or with him off the court; same as above with metrics

[ronnymac2]

I didn't know LaMarcus Aldridge was a 20,000-point scorer. 16 seasons in and he still was a double-digit scorer last year.

Aldridge is one of very few players in NBA history who was a top-2 player on a 10 SRS team (2016). His first three years in SAS, his teams finished top-3 in defensive rating (including two No. 1 finishes). He had two years in Portland as the second best offensive player on top-2 offenses in the league (2009 and 2014).

He played a lot of minutes on a team that like the rest its players but I’m not sure if he was a top two player on the 2016 team. I know they played fewer minutes but to be honest, I’d rather have Manu, Danny Green, and probably even old Duncan who is a much better defensive player and his final year than Aldridge was in his best year.

San Antonio finished top three in defensive rating in those years, but how much of that can be attributed to Aldridge?

In 2016 the Spurs were basically the same defensively with him on court or with him off the court. RAPM and other impact metrics not really indicative Of LMA being a key defensive cog

In 2017, the Spurs were much better defensively without him on the court; same as above with metrics

In 2018, the Spurs We’re about the same defensively with him on court or with him off the court; same as above with metrics

+1 because I interpret most of this to be in support of my statement that LMA was the team's second-best player.

I feel like I need to comment on taking 2016 Manu over 2016 LMA. The most important stat in sports is minutes. Manu played 29% of his team's minutes to LMA's 57%. You'd have to be questioning why LMA is on the floor at all to justify taking Manu over LMA.

[kendogg]

were you really drunk at 3 in the afternoon?

[KobesScarf]

I can comfortably say McHale is superior in every aspect of basketball

[Colbinii]

I can comfortably say McHale is superior in every aspect of basketball

He wasn't a better shooter beyond 16'. Aldridge is also a better Free Throw Shooter.

[KobesScarf]

I can comfortably say McHale is superior in every aspect of basketball

He wasn't a better shooter beyond 16'. Aldridge is also a better Free Throw Shooter.

Late 80s Mchale is a better FT shooter but I guess it's not correct to say he's superior.

As for outside shooting I have no doubt what so ever that if Mchale decided to shoot more from outside he would be way better than Aldridge

[Colbinii]

I can comfortably say McHale is superior in every aspect of basketball

He wasn't a better shooter beyond 16'. Aldridge is also a better Free Throw Shooter.

Late 80s Mchale is a better FT shooter but I guess it's not correct to say he's superior.

As for outside shooting I have no doubt what so ever that if Mchale decided to shoot more from outside he would be way better than Aldridge

It's possible, yes.

[tsherkin]

There are limits to the value of midrange accuracy and turnover economy.

Came here to say this.

[prolific passer]

McHale was one of the best power forwards on both ends.

[Colbinii]

There are limits to the value of midrange accuracy and turnover economy.

Came here to say this.

This is true but it is still undervalued in many areas of basketball analysis.

Aldridge was, for a rough comparison, a poor-mans Dirk Nowitzki. Aldridge has a Strong [All-star level] Offensive impact footprint while in Portland, from his Offensive On/Off [From 2009-2015, had splits of +2.7, +8.5, +2.0, +9.1, +4.5, +6.2, +4.9, +7.5] with a Net On-Court rating of +4.2 and On/Off of +8.4. As a high usage big man over this sample [26.2 USG%] he scored slightly below league average with a total TS+ of -156.5--and as mentioned by AEnigma, extremely turnover adverse with just 8.2 TOV% over this span. Ultimately, what held Aldridge back offensively in his era was two-fold: Inability to draw fouls [and inability to attack the rim] and an inability to be a playmaker for others [evidence by his .270 FTr and 10.7 AST%]. These weaknesses, combined with his lack of a 3-Point shot, is what held him back in comparisons to players like Griffin and Love at the time [when ranking best PF in the league].

[tsherkin]

There are limits to the value of midrange accuracy and turnover economy.

Came here to say this.

This is true but it is still undervalued in many areas of basketball analysis.

Aldridge was, for a rough comparison, a poor-mans Dirk Nowitzki. Aldridge has a Strong [All-star level] Offensive impact footprint while in Portland, from his Offensive On/Off [From 2009-2015, had splits of +2.7, +8.5, +2.0, +9.1, +4.5, +6.2, +4.9, +7.5] with a Net On-Court rating of +4.2 and On/Off of +8.4. As a high usage big man over this sample [26.2 USG%] he scored slightly below league average with a total TS+ of -156.5--and as mentioned by AEnigma, extremely turnover adverse with just 8.2 TOV% over this span. Ultimately, what held Aldridge back offensively in his era was two-fold: Inability to draw fouls [and inability to attack the rim] and an inability to be a playmaker for others [evidence by his .270 FTr and 10.7 AST%]. These weaknesses, combined with his lack of a 3-Point shot, is what held him back in comparisons to players like Griffin and Love at the time [when ranking best PF in the league].

This is fair stuff. He wasnt great at getting in close and he shot a huge volume from 16-23 feet, so he was routinely not an efficient player. But partially because he didnt drive/handle much and wasnt big into risky passes and usually ended possessions with a long J FGA, his turnover economy was excellent. "Not giving it up" has value but that goes only so far because it doesnt pressure the D. He improved a bit into the back third or so of his career.

He had value, but there's a cap on what that type of player can do, and especially as a focal offensive player. Once he started to be around better scorers, his utility became a little clearer, I think. He showed 3pt range at the end of his career, and I think he would have thrived more had that been more a part of his game earlier. His shooting touch was undeniable.

[trex_8063]

I tend to be bullish on LMA compared to most here......but I can't see how this isn't Kevin McHale.

LaMarcus has a much better turnover economy (near GOAT-level among big men), perhaps due to his penchant for mid-range jumpers: it's difficult to turn the ball over on a mid-range jumper (an oft-overlooked BENEFIT of mid-range reliance).
But the discrepancy in shooting efficiency is even more relevant, imo (McHale somewhere in the neighborhood of +7% rTS [for prime and career] relative to LMA; for peak it's more like +8-9%).

One might suggest LMA has a greater floor-stretching effect, but I don't think this is a big distinction at all. Offensive rebounding is very similar too (maybe relative to era a slight edge to LMA).

So it seems very very close offensively; I'd likely give the edge to McHale though (again: that shooting efficiency gap is massive.....it's like DeMar DeRozan vs Stephen Curry, or something like that).


Defenisvely, I gotta go again with McHale: a similar-tiered defensive rebounder [particularly considering he was frequently guarding SF's]; versatile guy (again noting he defended SF and PF (and sporadically C)), and a better rim-protector than LMA.

The gap may not be huge (I've always felt LMA was a little underrated on that end, too), but I believe it's there.


So in terms of peak or prime, I've got to go with McHale, fairly comfortably.

In terms of career, LMA has got a notable longevity edge; but otoh McHale has far more team accomplishments to his credit, as well as perhaps other "legacy points".

I think Aldridge is really underrated on this board, and probably in the mainstream as well. But I'm still with McHale for career as well.