Ewing v Kobe

[Baller 24]

Patrick Ewing or Kobe Bryant?

You have to draft either prime Kobe or prime Pat in their prime, who do you pick to build your team around?

here are some stats for both players:

Kobe:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... nko01.html

Ewing:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... gpa01.html

[WesWesley]

Give me Kobe please.

Even though I'd much prefer to build around a big, Kobe is just too unreal to pass up on.

Kobe is in a class of his own just under Jordan.

There have been plenty other better bigs to come around since Ewing. (of this and ewings eras I would take, Shaq, Duncan, Barkley, Garnett, Robinson and Malone over him. Also, guys like Howard and Oden have to potential to be better than Ewing).

Now this is no knock on Ewing; he was great.

[Kosta]

Kobe will end up and is already probably higher on the all time list, but if I'm trying to build a team today around one of them, it's Ewing. He would by far be the best center in today's NBA, and it can't be stressed enough that it's so much easier building around a big. Kobe is the best S.G since Jordan and maybe top 2 all time, but he's not "just under" Jordan, he's far below him still and will stay there.

Now I might not be the man with the hook-ups, and I've had beef with Ewing backers before, but I'm not just taking him to look unbiased.

[WesWesley]

Kobe will win this comparison, similar to how Hibbert was drafted over Kosta Koufos.

[Baller 24]

Kobe is FAR from Jordan, and I don't even want to have a discussion on why hes so far, not far light years behind in terms of achievements, athleticism, and I'll even say skill. Kobe matches some skill, but not all, Jordan is still by far better then him at everything and anything on the court, until then Kobe is closer to guys like Drexler and the rest of the other SG's in his class, until he leads a team on his own to win the chip, no sir he is still far from Jordan, and even if he does win one on his own still won't be that much closer, especially when taking the fact that Kobe can't win without an all star caliber big man. Where talking about a man that had no all star caliber offensive big men leading his team to 6 championships.

Anyways...

I think its close, but Ewing would be the better pick to build a team around. VERY underrated in terms of offense and defense. He had the agility, skill, and physical attributes to make him one of the best. He lead team filled with primarily scrubs in his prime to the finals, but also lost to Jordan many times in the eastern conference playoffs. Ewing was a guy that averaged 28pts, 10reb, 4blk, on 50+% shooting. Like Kosta said, he would probably be the best big man today in the league, and quite ahead of Dwight.

[WesWesley]

Well baller i respect your opinion, but I'm not alone in people thinking that Kobe is just under Jordan. In fact, you can ask many pro analysts and they'll agree with me. However, that is not the comparison at hand.

And I never said Dwight was better than Ewing. I was alluding to the fact that he may end up being better. I definitely see the potential in Dwight.

And Kobe did lead his team to the finals this year, where he was beat by a much better team. I'd put money on Kobe getting at least another ring or two, but that's just me.

Also Kobe was a big big factor in the 3 rings he won, let's not just sweep those championships under the rug like they didn't happen, or that it was purely Shaq. Jordan also had amazing teams when he won his rings, much better than Kobe's '08 Lakers.

[Kosta]

Kobe will win this comparison, similar to how Hibbert was drafted over Kosta Koufos.

It's not a comparison, it's who you'd rather build around. Individually Kobe is and will go down as the greater player. Koufos will be better than Hibbert, doesn't matter where he got drafted. You don't need a hook-up to know that, kind of like taking Magic over Pippen.

[WesWesley]

Kobe will win this comparison, similar to how Hibbert was drafted over Kosta Koufos.

It's not a comparison, it's who you'd rather build around. Individually Kobe is and will go down as the greater player. Koufos will be better than Hibbert, doesn't matter where he got drafted. You don't need a hook-up to know that, kind of like taking Magic over Pippen.

It is a comparison. You're comparing the players in terms of who you'd rather build your team around.

Besides, what's with all the cheap shots? Not that I care or anything, but I just find it unprovoked.

[Baller 24]

Well baller i respect your opinion, but I'm not alone in people thinking that Kobe is just under Jordan. In fact, you can ask many pro analysts and they'll agree with me. However, that is not the comparison at hand.

And I never said Dwight was better than Ewing. I was alluding to the fact that he may end up being better. I definitely see the potential in Dwight.

And Kobe did lead his team to the finals this year, where he was beat by a much better team. I'd put money on Kobe getting at least another ring or two, but that's just me.

Also Kobe was a big big factor in the 3 rings he won, let's not just sweep those championships under the rug like they didn't happen, or that it was purely Shaq. Jordan also had amazing teams when he won his rings, much better than Kobe's '08 Lakers.

I respect your post to, but pro analyst say that he is comparable in terms of skill and athletic abilities, especially in the fact that he can read a defense so well. BUT that being said, he is still far from his class, when I mean his class I mean doing what Jordan has done. Now the class Jordan is in in terms of players comparable to his skill and size would be Magic Johnson and Larry Bird (note I said size). Kobe is no where close to those guys in terms of all time overall achievements. Oh and btw, Kobe got there on his own, but there was a certain big man that is all star caliber named Pau Gasol. Jordan never had someone with the skill of Gasol offensivly.


Now I used Dwight because obviously the majority think he is the best center in the league right now, so thats why I said that. Now Ewing was one of a kind, A BEAST but was in a decade where Hakeem and Drob were also doing their thing, so when talking about that Ewing would probably come in last out of the 3. Ewing lead a Knicks team that I don't even think Kobe can lead into the 2nd round to the finals, and was countless times lost against Jordan.

Jordan never had a dominant big men, not to mention he had to face teams like the bad boy Pistons, Magic's Lakers, Birds Celtics , and played against terrific teams like the Suns, Jazz, and Sonics. Jordan also never has lost in a finals appearance, while Kobe has now twice. Not to mention Kobe has never been a finals MVP of his 3 championships. He had a big part to do with that championship with Shaq, but Shaq's role was even BIGGER. I don't hate Kobe, but I just hate the fact that some consider him to be better then the great one. What if Kobe was compared to guys like Bird and Magic, would he will be better to build around? probably not, and think about the fact that those guys are considered below Jordan.

[Kosta]

Kobe will win this comparison, similar to how Hibbert was drafted over Kosta Koufos.

It's not a comparison, it's who you'd rather build around. Individually Kobe is and will go down as the greater player. Koufos will be better than Hibbert, doesn't matter where he got drafted. You don't need a hook-up to know that, kind of like taking Magic over Pippen.

It is a comparison. You're comparing the players in terms of who you'd rather build your team around.

Besides, what's with all the cheap shots? Not that I care or anything, but I just find it unprovoked.

It's not a one on one comparison between individual talent here, in that case, Kobe would win. I just think Ewing's dominance up front would be more valuable to a team and would be easier to win around.

Provoking, no, no provoking. Just messing with you, we cool.

[Baller 24]

Kosta, thats exactly why I'd take Ewing over Kobe the front court dominance on both ends of the floor would be HUGE. Not to mention the fact that if you have a player of that caliber up in the front court you can build your team around just pure shooters and still get far.

[WesWesley]

Yes, Kobe doesn't have Jordan's resume. There is a reason he is Jordan.

However, Kobe is under 30 still. Let's not forget this. I think he's got some MVPs and championships left. I think the return of Bynum is going to help. Bottom line was Gasol looked real soft in the finals. Sure didn't look like an all star. I can't count how many times Kobe has led scrubs to the playoffs too. And the West he was playing in was tough, real tough.

And yes Jordan didn't have an all star caliber offensive big man, but you have to understand that his team was built much differently than that. In terms of overall team talent, Jordan's team was better than Kobe's with Gasol. Jordan had a lock down perimeter defender in Pippen, who was also a great finisher and playmaker. Easily a top 50 of all time. Gasol is not.

I just don't see any legitimate flaws in a prime Kobe's game. When he was younger, he had some shot selection issues and bumped heads with teammates. The mature prime Kobe has not been playing like that. Prime Kobe is clutch, versatile, a great passer, great defender, who lead his team to the top of the very tough and competitive Western Conference. He also has the ability to single handily take over a win games for his team.

[WesWesley]

The only current big playing at a high level I would take over Kobe is Tim Duncan.

I would take Kobe over Garnett, and Garnett over Ewing.

[TMACFORMVP]

Ewing was one of the most underrated players to have ever played the game. Just because he was overshadowed by his peers in Robinson and Hakeem, doesn't mean people have to discount what he did as a player on both ends of the floor; where he was just flat out dominant. He'd easily be the best C in the game right now and a Top 5 player in the league. Had he not played in the era dominated by centers, he'd have numerous all-nba defensive selections and all-nba first team awards. The fact that he was on the 2nd team numerous times and even first team once is quite an accomplishment in itself.

The Knicks were continuously one of the top defensive teams in the league.

91-92: 2nd in defensive rating
92-93: 1st in defensive rating
93-94: 1st in defensive rating
94-95: 1st in defensive rating
95-96: 3rd in defensive rating
96-97: 2nd in defensive rating

If the guy had any offensive talent to surround him, he'd at least be talked on Robinson's level IMO. The year he went to the finals, John Starks was the second leading scorer throughout the playoffs and averaged 14.6 points per game on 38%.

Kobe will go down as the better player, and has already surpassed him career wise, but this is much closer than people would think. I personally would have loved to see Ewing in his prime with a second option on offense that drew attention and could not only get baskets for himself, but for Ewing as well.

[Baller 24]

Yes, Kobe doesn't have Jordan's resume. There is a reason he is Jordan.

However, Kobe is under 30 still. Let's not forget this. I think he's got some MVPs and championships left. I think the return of Bynum is going to help. Bottom line was Gasol looked real soft in the finals. Sure didn't look like an all star. I can't count how many times Kobe has led scrubs to the playoffs too. And the West he was playing in was tough, real tough.

And yes Jordan didn't have an all star caliber offensive big man, but you have to understand that his team was built much differently than that. In terms of overall team talent, Jordan's team was better than Kobe's with Gasol. Jordan had a lock down perimeter defender in Pippen, who was also a great finisher and playmaker. Easily a top 50 of all time. Gasol is not.

I just don't see any legitimate flaws in a prime Kobe's game. When he was younger, he had some shot selection issues and bumped heads with teammates. The mature prime Kobe has not been playing like that. Prime Kobe is clutch, versatile, a great passer, great defender, who lead his team to the top of the very tough and competitive Western Conference. He also has the ability to single handily take over a win games for his team.

Those are some good points, I can see why you'd say hes a class below Jordan, BUT Jordan is a career 50% shooter (minus the Wizards years, with the Wizards years hes 49.7%). Now lol I'd hate to say this but you can't possibly use the "hes got these many MVP/Championships left" because we have to wait and see until that happens, right now thought. When we talk about now, I think hes far behind because well simply because how you said it there is a reason why Jordan is Jordan. Now putting it that way, Kobe is closer to Jordan then ANYONE. Lol I say we stop the Jordan/Kobe discussion before this starts to turn out be a Jordan/Kobe thread with fanboys come and say hes equal or greater then the great one.

Anyways...

Imagine Ewing today, I think he'd have a better shot at winning the tittle then ANY other player in the league today with the exception of Duncan, lol and there are reasons why.

[Jordan23Forever]

I can't count how many times Kobe has led scrubs to the playoffs too.

Breaking news: Kobe fans can't count to two.

In case you didn't already know.

BUT Jordan is a career 50% shooter (minus the Wizards years, with the Wizards years hes 49.7%).

Jordan was actually a 51% shooter for his career pre-Wizards (50.6%). But can we please keep the MJ/Kobe stuff out of this thread? You can discuss the comparison at hand without talking about Jordan.

[JordansBulls]

I thought this thread was about Ewing and Kobe?

[WesWesley]

I thought this thread was about Ewing and Kobe?

It is a Ewing Kobe thread. MJ got thrown into the mix, but that happens in any discussion. You guys are further ruining the thread with your asinine comments.

Anyways Baller.

I think that this time is more of a transition era in the NBA. There is a lot of young spectacular talent that should be able to compete with the likes of the greats, but have yet to have the time to show that. There are maybe 3 players in the league who will go down as greats that are still playing at a high level. (Kobe, KG, Duncan). Another great in Shaq is passed his prime, and wouldn't be able to handle a prime Ewing now. However, we have guys like LeBron, Paul, Howard, and Oden who all have the potential to go down as great players. I believe LeBron can go down with the company of Bird and maybe Magic. I think that Paul has the potential to be mentioned with Stockton and Isiah. Dwight has the potential to go down in the same group as the Barkley's and Malones. And Oden, while he still hasn't played has unbelievable potential. I feel if he pans out he can be as good as Duncan and Moses Malone. Will these players pan out? Obviously time will only tell, but you also never know when a guy like a Beasley, or Kevin Durant turn out to be the next Pippen or Barkley.

Kobe took his team to the finals this year, so I find your argument that Ewing had one of the best chances to do that weak, because it can be used for Kobe too. It's generally agreed upon that Kobe is the better talent of the two; so why would you take the lesser talent, when Kobe has proven that he can take a team to the finals in the hardest conference? A good, but not spectacular team at that too.

[shawngoat23]

Kobe will go higher on the all-time list, but I'll build around Ewing.

And I disagree that Garnett is better than Ewing. You can make a case either way, but I'd rather take my chances with Ewing.

[Squire]

like all the other posters said kobe will be higher on the all time list but you never win championships without a big man so EWING is for me. I also would much rather have a star at the C than at the SG