Retro Player of the Year Project

[Sedale Threatt]

[ThaRegul8r]

A white, 6-9 big?



This guy fits the description.

[semi-sentient]

[bastillon]

Bobby Jones was playing like a 7 footer because of his wingspan. theoretically McHale is about 6'9 too, but his long ass arms make this height requirement silly. same with Cowens - he's really about 6'11 + has octopus arms as well.

I'm gonna check some Pettit all-star highlights and get back to you.

[ThaRegul8r]

Bobby Jones was playing like a 7 footer because of his wingspan. theoretically McHale is about 6'9 too, but his long ass arms make this height requirement silly. same with Cowens - he's really about 6'11 + has octopus arms as well.

You have to admit though, that you left yourself open to that when you said you didn't see how a white 6-9 big could be a good defender, when the NBA has had a white 6-9 big who was one of the greatest defenders it's ever seen.

[bastillon]

1st half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOcl2sDn ... re=related
3rd Qtr
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7M0rS8rTb3o
4th Qtr
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-cGQnGTdFQ

a lot of Pettit here.

[bastillon]

Pettit has David Lee's body and his defense looks similar as well. he can't block/contest shots and it really hurts his value.

[lorak]

1st half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOcl2sDn ... re=related

Wilt made 2 of 3 fade away jump shots. Just sayin...

[bastillon]

yeah, they're highlights. they don't show the bad plays, only the good ones.

[lorak]

Theres plenty of bad plays on these "highlights".

[penbeast0]

One thing I'm noticing in the analysis we are doing here is how much the real clutch performers stand out. Guys like Cliff Hagan, Jerry West, Hakeem . . . every year they raise their games while guys like Cousy, Wilt, guys anyone can call all-time greats . . . slip.

There are reasons for everything but how consistent the numerical difference is for some players was a big surprise. So glad you started this project!

[Jimmy76]

1st half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOcl2sDn ... re=related

Wilt made 2 of 3 fade away jump shots. Just sayin...

The horrors a modern Larry Brown defense could inflict on these teams

Defense, shot selection, and half-court offense are just ridiculously underdeveloped compared to today but I think a lot of these players would definitely have the talent to be stars today

Russel can really run the floor

[bastillon]

Theres plenty of bad plays on these "highlights".

80-90% of possessions end up with a basket.

[JordansBulls]

Figure I would post this here as well.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1998/bird/flashbacks/1986flash.html

There has never been a basketball player quite like the Celtics' Larry Joe Bird, in whom talent and tenacity rage a daily wire-to-wire battle for supremacy. Owing to the extraordinary importance of the giant pivotman in the game, it is probably impossible to declare that, in his seventh season, the 6' 9", 220-pound Bird, a forward, is greater than Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain or Kareem Abdul-Jabbar—that is, the greatest player of all time. Or maybe it isn't.

Bird, who has never been accused of false modesty, clings to the position (publicly at least) that Magic Johnson is the game's best active player. "He makes his teammates better to a greater degree than I do. It's his character, not just his abilities," says Bird.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1998/bird/flashbacks/1988flash.html

March 21, 1988

Boston's Larry Bird, in what may be his finest season, gets Red Auerbach's vote—over Bill Russell—as the best ever

I disagree with it, but it is interesting to hear Red say this.

[ipoopinmypants]

From an outsider's perspective, it pains me to scroll down the dolem page and see Connie freaking Hawkins with a first place vote.

[Bgil]

1st half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iOcl2sDn ... re=related

Wilt made 2 of 3 fade away jump shots. Just sayin...

The horrors a modern Larry Brown defense could inflict on these teams

Defense, shot selection, and half-court offense are just ridiculously underdeveloped compared to today but I think a lot of these players would definitely have the talent to be stars today

Russel can really run the floor

Any defense from the past 15 years would terrorize those ball handlers. Derek Fisher is a better ball handler and PG than everyone in that highlight.

[ThaRegul8r]

Figure I would post this here as well.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1998/bird/flashbacks/1986flash.html

There has never been a basketball player quite like the Celtics' Larry Joe Bird, in whom talent and tenacity rage a daily wire-to-wire battle for supremacy. Owing to the extraordinary importance of the giant pivotman in the game, it is probably impossible to declare that, in his seventh season, the 6' 9", 220-pound Bird, a forward, is greater than Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain or Kareem Abdul-Jabbar—that is, the greatest player of all time. Or maybe it isn't.

Bird, who has never been accused of false modesty, clings to the position (publicly at least) that Magic Johnson is the game's best active player. "He makes his teammates better to a greater degree than I do. It's his character, not just his abilities," says Bird.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/nba/1998/bird/flashbacks/1988flash.html

March 21, 1988

Boston's Larry Bird, in what may be his finest season, gets Red Auerbach's vote—over Bill Russell—as the best ever

I disagree with it, but it is interesting to hear Red say this.

“If Russell had ever failed, the franchise would have been out of town and Auerbach would have been out with it. Anytime Auerbach sits down and tries to tell you that Bird and Bill Russell are even, he’s sick. Auerbach should have fifty pictures of Bill Russell in his office and he should kiss every one of them every day. Because Russell made him.”
(Dan Shaughnessy, Seeing Red: The Red Auerbach Story [New York: Crown, 1994], p. 103)

[penbeast0]

Any defense from the past 15 years would terrorize those ball handlers. Derek Fisher is a better ball handler and PG than everyone in that highlight.

Kobe and LeBron carry the ball every single play. Under 1960s dribbling rules, they would get called for a foul every time down the court. The worst scrub in the 50s handles the ball better than anyone in the NBA today (if you are going to call the rules as written).

[bastillon]

Any defense from the past 15 years would terrorize those ball handlers. Derek Fisher is a better ball handler and PG than everyone in that highlight.

Kobe and LeBron carry the ball every single play. Under 1960s dribbling rules, they would get called for a foul every time down the court. The worst scrub in the 50s handles the ball better than anyone in the NBA today (if you are going to call the rules as written).

you know it's not true. it's ok to say they would've been called for palming more often, but every single play ? c'mon penbeast.

it's kinda obvious what Bgil says. game is evolving. if you put Jerry West in today's game and give him all the benefits that we have nowadays he would've been a much better player as well. Kobe would still be a great scorer/shooter in the 60s. Nash would still rock on offense with his passing/scoring. Dwight would still rebound like a mad man and intimidate anyone inside 15 feet. no reason to diminish today's players honestly.

[penbeast0]

Every play is correct . . . . the difference (and the point I was making) is that players adjust to the rules as they are called and to the style of play of the league.

Kobe would be a SF with much more of an inside game (and even more of a propensity for circus shots a la Elgin Baylor) . . . assuming his bulk and strength didn't come from weight training and steroids; LeBron a combo forward taught to post up like pre-injury Connie Hawkins. Neither would handle the ball nearly as much and both would look like they weren't particularly good ballhandlers by today's standards.