(Lock Thread)The LeBron James- 23-24 NBA Playoffs & Off-Season Thread -(NO PERSONAL ATTACKS & BAITING)

[therealbig3]

Prince is gone too....thanks to us not having any open spots......for Cam Reddish and Hayes.....great job Pelinka

Rob is such a horrible GM its insane. How have we still not addressed our backup C concern? That should be simple

We aren't asking for unreasonable stuff here imo. Boston built a team off of multiple great moves, why cant we make any good moves?

I hope to god bron took a little less to keep us under the 2nd apron. That can be fixed anyways if we dump a vet (cost a 2nd or so) but a million or so shouldnt be a big deal to him

I am dissapointed he didnt take a paycut, but also looks like we were striking out and I doubt Bron wanted to take a 15m paycut for someone like GTJ on the MLE

Soo are we going to somehow get Miles Bridges for the mini mle? (yes we are that desperate)

Trading multiple guys for 1 may be the best bet from a flexibility standpoint, but doing the math on Lavine its pretty hard. Unless we are fine moving 1 of Rui or Vando, but can't replace them too well. Not sure who we would be able to get for a backup/starting wing and backup pg. Not a lot of great cheap options out there. Any names?

My favorite idea is still going out and getting Cam Johnson and a solid backup C (would even take Sharpe from BKN)

Ok so honest question:

What do the Lakers have to trade to make any good moves here? Their assets are all pretty crappy, and they dont really have a great collection of draft picks to trade, so how do you plan on acquiring good players from other teams without anything good to actually give them in return?

I mean, an actually smart move would have been to say goodbye to LeBron and to trade Davis and recoup some assets and go for a rebuild, because this roster isn’t doing anything, it’s just a waste of whatever good years LeBron and Davis have left.

Lakers FRPs are pretty valuable given that they're likely to be trash post-Bron/AD

lol so is that the move? Trade future 1sts and mortgage the future even more so that the Lakers can be in even more salary cap hell for a roster that’s still a 1st, MAYBE 2nd round exit? And bank on LeBron and AD staying as healthy as they did this past season?

The more I see their situation, the more I think blowing it up is the right move. They’re not a contender that’s just a piece or two away from potentially winning it all. They were the 7th seed and a 1st round exit despite getting healthy and productive seasons out of LeBron and AD, which is so not a guarantee at this point and imo was like catching lightning in a bottle. Meanwhile, AD can still fetch legitimate assets in terms of young players and picks, and moving him to a team that can absorb his salary would be tremendous for the Lakers in terms of their roster flexibility with the new salary cap.

[jalengreen]

Ok so honest question:

What do the Lakers have to trade to make any good moves here? Their assets are all pretty crappy, and they dont really have a great collection of draft picks to trade, so how do you plan on acquiring good players from other teams without anything good to actually give them in return?

I mean, an actually smart move would have been to say goodbye to LeBron and to trade Davis and recoup some assets and go for a rebuild, because this roster isn’t doing anything, it’s just a waste of whatever good years LeBron and Davis have left.

Lakers FRPs are pretty valuable given that they're likely to be trash post-Bron/AD

lol so is that the move? Trade future 1sts and mortgage the future even more so that the Lakers can be in even more salary cap hell for a roster that’s still a 1st, MAYBE 2nd round exit? And bank on LeBron and AD staying as healthy as they did this past season?

The more I see their situation, the more I think blowing it up is the right move. They’re not a contender that’s just a piece or two away from potentially winning it all. They were the 7th seed and a 1st round exit despite getting healthy and productive seasons out of LeBron and AD, which is so not a guarantee at this point and imo was like catching lightning in a bottle. Meanwhile, AD can still fetch legitimate assets in terms of young players and picks, and moving him to a team that can absorb his salary would be tremendous for the Lakers in terms of their roster flexibility with the new salary cap.

I made sure not to say that "it's the move"; just that they do in fact have some valuable draft assets. They certainly have the capability of acquiring good players from other teams, because they have something good to give them in return. They've just chosen not to do that thus far.

[therealbig3]

Honestly speaking, what did go wrong for the Lakers after 2020? They seemed poised to keep contending, but never regained their RS success after that season, and yeah they made the conference finals one year (in which they got swept), but otherwise either missed the playoffs or were a 1st round out.

Is it as simple as LeBron and AD not being healthy for the most part, outside of this past season? Was it the loss of all the veterans that made key contributions for the 2020 team without adequately replacing them? Or did the league just get a lot better and the Lakers basically stayed the same?

I’m still pretty surprised honestly that the Lakers were as mediocre as they were despite LeBron and AD playing 70+ games and both playing at a pretty high level. That’s one of the best 1-2 punches in the league and should lead a team to an easy 50+ win season and be a tough out in the playoffs, regardless of the supporting cast. And it’s not like their supporting cast is all scrubs, Russell, Reaves, Rui, these are good players.

[zimpy27]

Honestly speaking, what did go wrong for the Lakers after 2020? They seemed poised to keep contending, but never regained their RS success after that season, and yeah they made the conference finals one year (in which they got swept), but otherwise either missed the playoffs or were a 1st round out.

Is it as simple as LeBron and AD not being healthy for the most part, outside of this past season? Was it the loss of all the veterans that made key contributions for the 2020 team without adequately replacing them? Or did the league just get a lot better and the Lakers basically stayed the same?

I’m still pretty surprised honestly that the Lakers were as mediocre as they were despite LeBron and AD playing 70+ games and both playing at a pretty high level. That’s one of the best 1-2 punches in the league and should lead a team to an easy 50+ win season and be a tough out in the playoffs, regardless of the supporting cast. And it’s not like their supporting cast is all scrubs, Russell, Reaves, Rui, these are good players.

- Paid THT and let Caruso walk. (This one was the killer)
- Traded KCP, Kuzma, FRP for Westbrook.
- Traded Westbrook, FRP for DLo, Beasley, Vando (actually paid 2 SRPs to Minny to take Conley over DLo).

[RRR3]

LeBron deserves to lose at this point. He keeps choosing to stay on a team that isn't serious about winning. Bizarre he doesn't want to win more rings anymore.

[jalengreen]

Honestly speaking, what did go wrong for the Lakers after 2020? They seemed poised to keep contending, but never regained their RS success after that season, and yeah they made the conference finals one year (in which they got swept), but otherwise either missed the playoffs or were a 1st round out.

Is it as simple as LeBron and AD not being healthy for the most part, outside of this past season? Was it the loss of all the veterans that made key contributions for the 2020 team without adequately replacing them? Or did the league just get a lot better and the Lakers basically stayed the same?

I’m still pretty surprised honestly that the Lakers were as mediocre as they were despite LeBron and AD playing 70+ games and both playing at a pretty high level. That’s one of the best 1-2 punches in the league and should lead a team to an easy 50+ win season and be a tough out in the playoffs, regardless of the supporting cast. And it’s not like their supporting cast is all scrubs, Russell, Reaves, Rui, these are good players.

It certainly would've been an easy 50+ win season without ham lol

[nzahir]

Prince is gone too....thanks to us not having any open spots......for Cam Reddish and Hayes.....great job Pelinka

Rob is such a horrible GM its insane. How have we still not addressed our backup C concern? That should be simple

We aren't asking for unreasonable stuff here imo. Boston built a team off of multiple great moves, why cant we make any good moves?

I hope to god bron took a little less to keep us under the 2nd apron. That can be fixed anyways if we dump a vet (cost a 2nd or so) but a million or so shouldnt be a big deal to him

I am dissapointed he didnt take a paycut, but also looks like we were striking out and I doubt Bron wanted to take a 15m paycut for someone like GTJ on the MLE

Soo are we going to somehow get Miles Bridges for the mini mle? (yes we are that desperate)

Trading multiple guys for 1 may be the best bet from a flexibility standpoint, but doing the math on Lavine its pretty hard. Unless we are fine moving 1 of Rui or Vando, but can't replace them too well. Not sure who we would be able to get for a backup/starting wing and backup pg. Not a lot of great cheap options out there. Any names?

My favorite idea is still going out and getting Cam Johnson and a solid backup C (would even take Sharpe from BKN)

Christie was chosen over Prince... Not as severe as THT over Caruso but there is a pattern. An ugly ugly pattern.

I am fine with Christie over Prince if this meant we were going to lose Christie

Christie has higher upside and Prince was a negative player overall. Fine shooter, but Knecht should (hopefully) be better at that at least

The Caruso thing was non defendable. Caruso was a top 5 defender. Prince is a backup 2/3

[zimpy27]

Prince is gone too....thanks to us not having any open spots......for Cam Reddish and Hayes.....great job Pelinka

Rob is such a horrible GM its insane. How have we still not addressed our backup C concern? That should be simple

We aren't asking for unreasonable stuff here imo. Boston built a team off of multiple great moves, why cant we make any good moves?

I hope to god bron took a little less to keep us under the 2nd apron. That can be fixed anyways if we dump a vet (cost a 2nd or so) but a million or so shouldnt be a big deal to him

I am dissapointed he didnt take a paycut, but also looks like we were striking out and I doubt Bron wanted to take a 15m paycut for someone like GTJ on the MLE

Soo are we going to somehow get Miles Bridges for the mini mle? (yes we are that desperate)

Trading multiple guys for 1 may be the best bet from a flexibility standpoint, but doing the math on Lavine its pretty hard. Unless we are fine moving 1 of Rui or Vando, but can't replace them too well. Not sure who we would be able to get for a backup/starting wing and backup pg. Not a lot of great cheap options out there. Any names?

My favorite idea is still going out and getting Cam Johnson and a solid backup C (would even take Sharpe from BKN)

Christie was chosen over Prince... Not as severe as THT over Caruso but there is a pattern. An ugly ugly pattern.

I am fine with Christie over Prince if this meant we were going to lose Christie

Christie has higher upside and Prince was a negative player overall. Fine shooter, but Knecht should (hopefully) be better at that at least

The Caruso thing was non defendable. Caruso was a top 5 defender. Prince is a backup 2/3

$5m price difference though. Lakers could have grabbed Smith instead.

[therealbig3]

Honestly speaking, what did go wrong for the Lakers after 2020? They seemed poised to keep contending, but never regained their RS success after that season, and yeah they made the conference finals one year (in which they got swept), but otherwise either missed the playoffs or were a 1st round out.

Is it as simple as LeBron and AD not being healthy for the most part, outside of this past season? Was it the loss of all the veterans that made key contributions for the 2020 team without adequately replacing them? Or did the league just get a lot better and the Lakers basically stayed the same?

I’m still pretty surprised honestly that the Lakers were as mediocre as they were despite LeBron and AD playing 70+ games and both playing at a pretty high level. That’s one of the best 1-2 punches in the league and should lead a team to an easy 50+ win season and be a tough out in the playoffs, regardless of the supporting cast. And it’s not like their supporting cast is all scrubs, Russell, Reaves, Rui, these are good players.

- Paid THT and let Caruso walk. (This one was the killer)
- Traded KCP, Kuzma, FRP for Westbrook.
- Traded Westbrook, FRP for DLo, Beasley, Vando (actually paid 2 SRPs to Minny to take Conley over DLo).

Man THT and Westbrook over Caruso and KCP just reeks of someone in the front office having no idea what players are actually the ones you want. Kuzma is whatever, but KCP and Caruso are like two of the best 3 and D role players in the league and were huge reasons why they won the title.

LeBron deserves blame for that too if he was why they went the Westbrook route. Was clear as day that the guy wasn’t a star any more but also wasn’t a good role player either because he didn’t play good defense nor did he shoot the ball well, and still had a star player’s ego. That’s just…wow.

Still surprised they couldn’t do better than the 7th seed this year with LeBron and Davis though.

[nzahir]

Prince is gone too....thanks to us not having any open spots......for Cam Reddish and Hayes.....great job Pelinka

Rob is such a horrible GM its insane. How have we still not addressed our backup C concern? That should be simple

We aren't asking for unreasonable stuff here imo. Boston built a team off of multiple great moves, why cant we make any good moves?

I hope to god bron took a little less to keep us under the 2nd apron. That can be fixed anyways if we dump a vet (cost a 2nd or so) but a million or so shouldnt be a big deal to him

I am dissapointed he didnt take a paycut, but also looks like we were striking out and I doubt Bron wanted to take a 15m paycut for someone like GTJ on the MLE

Soo are we going to somehow get Miles Bridges for the mini mle? (yes we are that desperate)

Trading multiple guys for 1 may be the best bet from a flexibility standpoint, but doing the math on Lavine its pretty hard. Unless we are fine moving 1 of Rui or Vando, but can't replace them too well. Not sure who we would be able to get for a backup/starting wing and backup pg. Not a lot of great cheap options out there. Any names?

My favorite idea is still going out and getting Cam Johnson and a solid backup C (would even take Sharpe from BKN)

Ok so honest question:

What do the Lakers have to trade to make any good moves here? Their assets are all pretty crappy, and they dont really have a great collection of draft picks to trade, so how do you plan on acquiring good players from other teams without anything good to actually give them in return?

I mean, an actually smart move would have been to say goodbye to LeBron and to trade Davis and recoup some assets and go for a rebuild, because this roster isn’t doing anything, it’s just a waste of whatever good years LeBron and Davis have left.

We have 2 1sts, some swaps, JHS, and if we wanted to guys like Reaves, Rui, Knecht

Didnt the Pelicans just get Dejounte Murray for 2 1sts, Dyson Daniels, and LNJ?

Dejounte was an all star and is on a very good contract

We are aiming for guys a tier below (but maybe better fits) on worse deals...

I am not saying we are getting a guy like Trae Young for Dlo, Rui, Vincent, and a 1st

These picks have potential upside, remember how bad this team was from 2013-2018....worst record in the nba in that 5 year stretch

I dont see a 3rd star who is available, unless we are moving basically Reaves and all our picks and swaps for a guy like Lauri or going after overpaid Lavine (tough to work with contracts and Lebron's deal, but doable)

So they should get guys who are in their 20s who have value and can fit in now, but also grow in the future (or be moved in the future to recoup assets). Such as Rui. Trading for him works for winning now, but he also has upside and can grow here or be moved later

This is why I think a guy like Cam Johnson makes a lot of sense

Getting a backup C is also NON DEFENDABLE!!!

Cheaper options for assets: Day'ron Sharpe, Duop Reath
More expensive: Walker Kessler (on a cheap contract)

Best trades left (from rumors at least)
BKN for Cam Johnson or Cam Johnson and Sharpe. Dlo, JHS, Hayes, and a 1st for both. If no Sharpe, then remove JHS, maybe add 1-2 2nds. May need to dump Cam due to Apron? Then go and get a C like Kessler with the other 1st and JHS.

Portland trade is not as good, but its going after Grant and Duop Reath

Lavine deal that guys the depth

But at a bare minimum, get a backup C and see whats available at the deadline with another 1st. You can't build the whole team at the deadline, so getting something now is better

[nzahir]

Christie was chosen over Prince... Not as severe as THT over Caruso but there is a pattern. An ugly ugly pattern.

I am fine with Christie over Prince if this meant we were going to lose Christie

Christie has higher upside and Prince was a negative player overall. Fine shooter, but Knecht should (hopefully) be better at that at least

The Caruso thing was non defendable. Caruso was a top 5 defender. Prince is a backup 2/3

$5m price difference though. Lakers could have grabbed Smith instead.

Ehh we cant just let Christie walk, that would be dumb

[jalengreen]

Lakers started the season 19-21 and then finished 28-14, including an 11-3 run to close the regular season. They had one of the toughest schedules post-ASB as well. Clearly looked like a 50+ win team in the second half of the season, simply had a really bad start - and coaching was a significant part of that. Think they had a WCF run in them if they snagged the 5 seed, which looked doable at a point.

[nzahir]

Lakers started the season 19-21 and then finished 28-14, including an 11-3 run to close the regular season. They had one of the toughest schedules post-ASB as well. Clearly looked like a 50+ win team in the second half of the season, simply had a really bad start - and coaching was a significant part of that. Think they had a WCF run in them if they snagged the 5 seed, which looked doable at a point.

We did look good in the 2nd half and a good coach definitely helps

We blew game 2 to Denver and couldn't get stops

We also blew game 5 and that was due to AD missing basically a whole Q and not having a backup big

Win those 2 and we should at least get to 7 games even if we don't win the series

As of now

Dlo, Reaves, Vando, Bron, AD
Vincent, Knecht, Christie, Rui, Wood

Its actually not a bad roster, I think a solid backup C helps a lot

We should be decent to actually really good if a few things happen:
Vando is used better (and is healthy)
Knecht and Christie are able to contribute something, a lot riding on those 2 yong guys off the bench
Vincent is healthy (not really a big fan anyways of him, but cant be worse than last seasons disaster, one of the worst players in the league when he was playing)

We have 2 guys who aren't in the top 5, but in the later portion of the top 10 to the top 15 range. And come playoff time I still dont have many guys over Bron

The issue becomes DLO, he was super important for us in the regular season, but was bad again vs Den

I just dont see how we can trust him. I rather move on now rather than have him as a key part of the team

[therealbig3]

I guess I see how close they are differently…losing in 7 vs losing in 5 to this year’s Nuggets doesn’t really turn the Lakers into a contender…the Nuggets themselves were beaten by a T’Wolves team who then went on to lose in convincing fashion to the Mavs, who then went on to lose in convincing fashion to the Celtics. Although matchups matter a lot and you can’t equate different series to each other, I do think the Nuggets were a clear step down from what they were in 2023, and there were clearly teams that were just better than them this year. I don’t think they were real contenders themselves.

Idk I think the Lakers are quite far from being legitimate contenders as they currently stand. And the coaching isn’t guaranteed to be better given that it’s a rookie coach who is besties with LeBron and may be forced to play a bad player more than he should.

[jalengreen]

I don’t think they’re serious contenders personally, I just don’t look back at 2024 with confusion as to why a LeBron/AD team wasn’t better, because I think they were quite good!

[tsherkin]

Nothing about LA screams "contender" when they haven't really established greater depth or the tools which would let them compete against those better teams. They scraped into the playoffs barely ahead of Golden State and Sacramento and lack depth. And they now also have a new coach. Major additions so far are Dalton Knecht and Bronnie James, like... nothing has changed of consequence yet, besides Lebron clarifying his return. And last year had 76 games of AD and 71 of Lebron.

Until they add a third player of consequence, they aren't going to do anything different.

[nzahir]

Nothing about LA screams "contender" when they haven't really established greater depth or the tools which would let them compete against those better teams. They scraped into the playoffs barely ahead of Golden State and Sacramento and lack depth. And they now also have a new coach. Major additions so far are Dalton Knecht and Bronnie James, like... nothing has changed of consequence yet, besides Lebron clarifying his return. And last year had 76 games of AD and 71 of Lebron.

Until they add a third player of consequence, they aren't going to do anything different.

So you want us to go the big 3 route?

Markennan is the only guy who has a good contract that is a star

Is Markennan getable for 2 1sts, 3 swaps, Rui (maybe routed to a 3rd team for some value), Knecht, JHS (and salary filler if needed) for Markennan and any meh contracts (but hopefully playable guys)

Reaves, Christie/Vando, Lauri, Bron, AD
Dlo, Reddish?, Christie/Vando, Wood
Vincent

Need to be getting back some sort of playable backup C or wing in that deal

Look to move Vincent possibly in another deal?

More likely we need to include Reaves though, but trying to see if we can keep him and get Lauri

[tsherkin]

So you want us to go the big 3 route?

Markennan is the only guy who has a good contract that is a star

If they can, that's about the only route they've got unless Lebron turns the clock back half a decade and the shooters come through. Dunno if it's feasible, but I think at some point you just cede the notion that there won't be contention for the next little while. I have zero faith in Lakers management to pull off anything.

[Dupp]

Did the lakers even try to get buddy?


Their reluctancy to get shooters around lebron is annoying.

[nzahir]

So you want us to go the big 3 route?

Markennan is the only guy who has a good contract that is a star

If they can, that's about the only route they've got unless Lebron turns the clock back half a decade and the shooters come through. Dunno if it's feasible, but I think at some point you just cede the notion that there won't be contention for the next little while. I have zero faith in Lakers management to pull off anything.

Lol Lebron has 1-3 year left, so it kinda now or never....unless he goes elsewhere after

I dont think Lauri is realistic, even though we have the assets if we want to move Reaves, but I dont see us doing it

Our best bet is probably to build a defensive identity again like in 2020 or in 2023 after the Westbrook deal if we cant get an offensive star