LeBron James 2021-22 Regular Season Thread - Part ?

[thebigbird]

The Lakers are worth $5.5 billion. Letting a key championship piece walk for nothing when he was willing to give the Lakers a discount is inexcusable. Jeanie did it because she’s cheap. The Lakers didn’t pay the tax for years and now she is cheaping out while they’re trying to win championships.

I'm not going to argue that Jeannie is a good owner but I don't think any of the other owners would've agreed to pay 40M per year for a role player, especially when they were already paying almost 70M in luxury taxes.

He didn’t recruit Ariza, Russell Westbrook did. https://www.silverscreenandroll.com/platform/amp/2021/8/7/22614725/trevor-ariza-russell-westbrook-started-calling-him-20-minutes-after-lakers-trade

Dwight and Rondo were key parts of their title team, so not sure the issue behind him recruiting them. Bradley was a good player on that team too before he didn’t go to the bubble. And Gasol was great in his role until he fell out of the rotation.

The Lakers are terribly managed. Jeanie owns the team because her dad gave it to her. Magic Johnson had his job because he played for the Lakers. Pelinka is the GM because he was Kobe’s agent. Kurt Rambis and his wife have their positions because his wife is friends with Jeanie. They have no one in their front office who has their job because they’re competent, and it shows.

Perhaps all this would matter if Lebron wasn't on the team but given he is and the players have been the ones calling the shots re roster decisions, it doesn't matter that Jeannie hired all her friends (unless you're trying to argue a better GM would've given up less for Russ and AD, which...ok maybe). Pelinka did find Stanley Johnson for nothing though and that one has worked out (note: I'm crediting Pelinka for this one only because it was done mid season and presumably Lebron/AD/Russ aren't scouring the waiver wires in the midst of all those games).

Bron has made some good moves and bad ones putting together these last three Laker teams. But my point was more about how his recent comments are likely directly related to Pelinka/Jeannie not doing what he asked this deadline.

You and many others say that LeBron runs the Lakers despite there being a lot of evidence that he’s not. It goes back years ago when they hired Frank Vogel. The front office wouldn’t give LeBron’s guy Ty Lue a 5 year contract. They would only give him 3 years and Lue turned them down. Sure, they consult with LeBron about things. Most franchises do with they superstars. But LeBron isn’t calling the shots, he isn’t making all the decisions, and there’s a lot of evidence showing that. The trade deadline disaster wasn’t the first thing.

[falcolombardi]

i am of the opinion that if you have a championship window you have to capitalize on it even if it costs you a lot of money short term

keeping caruso would have helped lakers championship hopes tremendously, and winning rings helps keep lakers as a premier destinatión for players and keep the brand value up

Lakers are 27-31, currently in 9th. Let's be honest and admit that Caruso likely wouldn't have saved this team. Your argument would have a lot more merit if they were looking like contenders that were a defensive guard short.

that is in hindsight tho, before this season lakers wrte supposed to be contenders and jeanie buss still didnt want to pay for a key player

and is not only about this year that is likely lost with davis injury anyway. is also about next year thst may be the last chance for the lebron/davis core to get lakers banner 18th

lakers have a tough time ahead rebuilding a contender with their lack of Bassets, but keeping caruso would have definitely made it easier even with the other bad trades

he is incredibly cheap relative to impact and fits perfectly into lakers team

[VanWest82]

You and many others say that LeBron runs the Lakers despite there being a lot of evidence that he’s not. It goes back years ago when they hired Frank Vogel. The front office wouldn’t give LeBron’s guy Ty Lue a 5 year contract. They would only give him 3 years and Lue turned them down. Sure, they consult with LeBron about things. Most franchises do with they superstars. But LeBron isn’t calling the shots, he isn’t making all the decisions, and there’s a lot of evidence showing that. The trade deadline disaster wasn’t the first thing.

Right, he doesn't make all of the decisions. I agree he doesn't. I think he has marginally the most influence on roster decisions, including Pelinka, Jeannie, Vogel, and the other players. And even in the example you gave, Lakers did try to hire Lue and just couldn't come to terms. Lebron can't control everything.

Again, it's already been confirmed by Shelburne (unless you think she's lying or misrepresenting) that the players were the ones who put this roster together, and there are enough bird crumbs to conclude that Lebron has had a big hand in each of the last three Lakers rosters. That doesn't mean he's running the show just that he has a lot of influence.

[VanWest82]

i am of the opinion that if you have a championship window you have to capitalize on it even if it costs you a lot of money short term

keeping caruso would have helped lakers championship hopes tremendously, and winning rings helps keep lakers as a premier destinatión for players and keep the brand value up

Lakers are 27-31, currently in 9th. Let's be honest and admit that Caruso likely wouldn't have saved this team. Your argument would have a lot more merit if they were looking like contenders that were a defensive guard short.

that is in hindsight tho, before this season lakers wrte supposed to be contenders and jeanie buss still didnt want to pay for a key player

and is not only about this year that is likely lost with davis injury anyway. is also about next year thst may be the last chance for the lebron/davis core to get lakers banner 18th

lakers have a tough time ahead rebuilding a contender with their lack of Bassets, but keeping caruso would have definitely made it easier even with the other bad trades

he is incredibly cheap relative to impact and fits perfectly into lakers team

Lakers are paying north of 200M including taxes for this roster. You're suggesting they should have paid 240M with Caruso. It's not good for NBA to have teams with 2x the payroll as everyone else.

[falcolombardi]

You and many others say that LeBron runs the Lakers despite there being a lot of evidence that he’s not. It goes back years ago when they hired Frank Vogel. The front office wouldn’t give LeBron’s guy Ty Lue a 5 year contract. They would only give him 3 years and Lue turned them down. Sure, they consult with LeBron about things. Most franchises do with they superstars. But LeBron isn’t calling the shots, he isn’t making all the decisions, and there’s a lot of evidence showing that. The trade deadline disaster wasn’t the first thing.

Right, he doesn't make all of the decisions. I agree he doesn't. I think he has marginally the most influence on roster decisions, including Pelinka, Jeannie, Vogel, and the other players. And even in the example you gave, Lakers did try to hire Lue and just couldn't come to terms. Lebron can't control everything.

Again, it's already been confirmed by Shelburne (unless you think she's lying or misrepresenting) that the players were the ones who put this roster together, and there are enough bird crumbs to conclude that Lebron has had a big hand in each of the last three Lakers rosters. That doesn't mean he's running the show just that he has a lot of influence.

that is probably closest to how teams work, a give and take relationship between ownership and team stars

[Ballerhogger]

i am of the opinion that if you have a championship window you have to capitalize on it even if it costs you a lot of money short term

keeping caruso would have helped lakers championship hopes tremendously, and winning rings helps keep lakers as a premier destinatión for players and keep the brand value up

Lakers are 27-31, currently in 9th. Let's be honest and admit that Caruso likely wouldn't have saved this team. Your argument would have a lot more merit if they were looking like contenders that were a defensive guard short.

caruso is not saving this team he obviously would take lot of THT minutes but let’s not act like he’s good scorer. His defense is very good but enough make this team go over 500. The lack of rebounders and wing defenders is killing us right now. AD has obviously taken step back due to his injuries defensively.

[VanWest82]

You and many others say that LeBron runs the Lakers despite there being a lot of evidence that he’s not. It goes back years ago when they hired Frank Vogel. The front office wouldn’t give LeBron’s guy Ty Lue a 5 year contract. They would only give him 3 years and Lue turned them down. Sure, they consult with LeBron about things. Most franchises do with they superstars. But LeBron isn’t calling the shots, he isn’t making all the decisions, and there’s a lot of evidence showing that. The trade deadline disaster wasn’t the first thing.

Right, he doesn't make all of the decisions. I agree he doesn't. I think he has marginally the most influence on roster decisions, including Pelinka, Jeannie, Vogel, and the other players. And even in the example you gave, Lakers did try to hire Lue and just couldn't come to terms. Lebron can't control everything.

Again, it's already been confirmed by Shelburne (unless you think she's lying or misrepresenting) that the players were the ones who put this roster together, and there are enough bird crumbs to conclude that Lebron has had a big hand in each of the last three Lakers rosters. That doesn't mean he's running the show just that he has a lot of influence.

that is probably closest to how teams work, a give and take relationship between ownership and team stars

Yes. I expect KD has a lot of influence on Nets moves.

My original point though was that these recent comments from Lebron were likely triggered by the "take" aspect of the give and take in terms of taking away influence where Jeannie/Pelinka chose not to listen to him this time, and so Lebron responded in order to win back leverage as this presumably won't be the last time he has an opinion on the roster.

[letskissbro]

Read on Twitter

These are the losers voting on the awards btw. In addition to clowns like Ric Bucher and Bill Simmons. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Klutch and LeBron's media "fanboys" have just been running the show the last decade. If anything he needs more fanboys in the media. Out of all the rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles the NBA has seen over the years LeBron James is the one guy who hasn't been a positive to the sport yeah okay.

He embodies everything these media idiots and so many Americans hate. They treated Ali the same way (*this isn't a comparison on their political stances, just their outspokenness and resulting backlash). That's why I'm glad LeBron stopped caring about his perception and I'm all for what Klutch and what they're doing. Any kind of push back against pieces of **** who peddle racially motivated vitriol like this is good in my book.

[falcolombardi]

i wouldnt go as far as comparing lebron to ali lol

that said i agree that no player has ever been so polarizing in the Internet era at least probably as a consequence of absurd amount of media attention

[letskissbro]

i wouldnt go as far as comparing lebron to ali lol

that said i agree that no player has ever been so polarizing in the Internet era at least probably as a consequence of absurd amount of media attention

Maybe Floyd is a better comp but in the end they're all hated for the same reasons. It all stems from a desire to put the "uppity" in their place.

[Greyhound]

This thread has become tiresome and no surprise it’s down to the posters who were board banned on the general board spreading their nonsense elsewhere.

What is this?

So you pop up out of nowhere with an unsolicited shot in the dark, to make what point exactly?

Perhaps the proper course of action would be to chastise that septic tank called the general board before coming here to do whatever it is you are attempting to do.

Speaking only for myself, I abandoned the general board after receiving some bogus temporary ban for discussing national/ regional/ race designations with some trolls and their corresponding woke puppets.

I have been eligible for reinstatement for over a year now, but I wont even bother. It’s not worth it to post there anymore. The level of intellectual discussion there is tick above chimpanzee/ dolphin level.

I can just as easily get the vapid fan perspective from the YouTube comments section.

Getting all of that out of the way…

Do you have anything to add to any of the various discussions (LeBron related) we are having here, or are you here just to troll?

———-

Hopefully I am not bogus banned for this response, but if I am…

Happy trails.

[falcolombardi]

i wouldnt go as far as comparing lebron to ali lol

that said i agree that no player has ever been so polarizing in the Internet era at least probably as a consequence of absurd amount of media attention

I don't see why not. They're hated for the same reasons. It all stems from a desire to put the "uppity" in their place.

while there may be some anti-blm sentimient against lebron (he is fairly outspoken about race issues) most of it seems to be a lot more mandane. os a disservice to ali to compare the struggles he faced to modern american athletes. only kaepernick comes remotely close

edit:black nascar pilot bubba Wallace is actually the best example as he has faced a huge amount of racial attacks for being a black pilot in a, lets say, very white sport

because he "ruined" basketball "creating" superteams is the most common reason it seems but i honestly thingh peopke just started disliking him because the media never stops talking about him 24/7

he can go to wstch a wnba game and skip bayless will say he wants to steal the spotlight away from women athletes anf make a whole segment on it

doesnt help that every fan of older greats brings him down (basketball wise or personality wise) to prop up their favorites (as do some lebron fans to older eras greats too)

[thebigbird]

Read on Twitter

These are the losers voting on the awards btw. In addition to clowns like Ric Bucher and Bill Simmons. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Klutch and LeBron's media "fanboys" have just been running the show the last decade. If anything he needs more fanboys in the media. Out of all the rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles the NBA has seen over the years LeBron James is the one guy who hasn't been a positive to the sport yeah okay.

He embodies everything these media idiots and so many Americans hate. They treated Ali the same way (*this isn't a comparison on their political stances, just their outspokenness and resulting backlash). That's why I'm glad LeBron stopped caring about his perception and I'm all for what Klutch and what they're doing. Any kind of push back against pieces of **** who peddle racially motivated vitriol like this is good in my book.

The NBA media is pure garbage. So much vitriol for a player who has been a model citizen off the court since entering the league as an 18 year old kid. Dudes have made entire careers out of hating on LeBron. You have one great who was credibly accused of rape, another great who impregnated a literal child, and yet LeBron is the problem star. Hmm.

The past few years I’ve become so much less interested in the NBA and way more interested in the NFL. That’s a league that builds their stars up. The NBA is nonstop trashing the best players. The media clowns with the most ridiculous takes get the most attention. It’s a cancer.

[Greyhound]

Anyways, for all the **** Davis has taken for not playing center until this season, Lebron’s reluctance to play PG full time, is a bit under-discussed, when that was the position he had the most success with the lakers and won a championship. Then it’s been one bad move after another to enable him to play off ball that has gotten us to the Westbrook sized hole in the roster.

How much of this is LeBron and how much is the Lakers front office analysis/ plan of action?
I am not entirely certain where to place the blame.

When LeBron came to the Lakers, all they talked about was surrounding him with playmakers and having him operate off the ball.

When that failed, they put the ball in LeBron’s hands and won a championship the following season (with him leading the league in assists).

Directly following that, the talk shifted back to taking the load off of LeBron (once again) and moving him off the ball. That lead to the disastrous Schroder acquisition.

Over that time fans chirped this moving from “LeBron ball” mantra in lock step with the direction being pushed by the team.

I personally never thought it to be a good idea to stray from the LeBron as the effective PG strategy that won them a championship. You can check the history, I have always been adamant about that.

If LeBron has been the one pushing for this, I am in agreement with you. I am just not sure that he is.

[Fadeaway_J]

i wouldnt go as far as comparing lebron to ali lol

that said i agree that no player has ever been so polarizing in the Internet era at least probably as a consequence of absurd amount of media attention

I don't see why not. They're hated for the same reasons. It all stems from a desire to put the "uppity" in their place.

while there may be some anti-blm sentimient against lebron (he is fairly outspoken about race issues) most of it seems to be a lot more mandane. os a disservice to ali to compare the struggles he faced to modern american athletes. only kaepernick comes remotely close

edit:black nascar pilot bubba Wallace is actually the best example as he has faced a huge amount of racial attacks for being a black pilot in a, lets say, very white sport

because he "ruined" basketball "creating" superteams is the most common reason it seems but i honestly thingh peopke just started disliking him because the media never stops talking about him 24/7

he can go to wstch a wnba game and skip bayless will say he wants to steal the spotlight away from women athletes anf make a whole segment on it

doesnt help that every fan of older greats brings him down (basketball wise or personality wise) to prop up their favorites (as do some lebron fans to older eras greats too)

The MJ comparisons are also a big factor. Kobe got backlash for that as well (especially since he clearly patterned so much of himself on MJ), but I think it eventually became clear that as great as he was, he wouldn't be toppling MJ. With LeBron, there is a decent chance he will be seen as the consensus GOAT in a generation or two, and the MJ gatekeepers aren't having that.

[Greyhound]

Read on Twitter

These are the losers voting on the awards btw. In addition to clowns like Ric Bucher and Bill Simmons. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Klutch and LeBron's media "fanboys" have just been running the show the last decade. If anything he needs more fanboys in the media. Out of all the rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles the NBA has seen over the years LeBron James is the one guy who hasn't been a positive to the sport yeah okay.

He embodies everything these media idiots and so many Americans hate. They treated Ali the same way (*this isn't a comparison on their political stances, just their outspokenness and resulting backlash). That's why I'm glad LeBron stopped caring about his perception and I'm all for what Klutch and what they're doing. Any kind of push back against pieces of **** who peddle racially motivated vitriol like this is good in my book.

The NBA media is pure garbage. So much vitriol for a player who has been a model citizen off the court since entering the league as an 18 year old kid. Dudes have made entire careers out of hating on LeBron. You have one great who was credibly accused of rape, another great who impregnated a literal child, and yet LeBron is the problem star. Hmm.

The past few years I’ve become so much less interested in the NBA and way more interested in the NFL. That’s a league that builds their stars up. The NBA is nonstop trashing the best players. The media clowns with the most ridiculous takes get the most attention. It’s a cancer.

Agreed 100%.

I am trending more towards football as well.

[RCM88x]

Read on Twitter

These are the losers voting on the awards btw. In addition to clowns like Ric Bucher and Bill Simmons. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Klutch and LeBron's media "fanboys" have just been running the show the last decade. If anything he needs more fanboys in the media. Out of all the rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles the NBA has seen over the years LeBron James is the one guy who hasn't been a positive to the sport yeah okay.

He embodies everything these media idiots and so many Americans hate. They treated Ali the same way (*this isn't a comparison on their political stances, just their outspokenness and resulting backlash). That's why I'm glad LeBron stopped caring about his perception and I'm all for what Klutch and what they're doing. Any kind of push back against pieces of **** who peddle racially motivated vitriol like this is good in my book.

The NBA media is pure garbage. So much vitriol for a player who has been a model citizen off the court since entering the league as an 18 year old kid. Dudes have made entire careers out of hating on LeBron. You have one great who was credibly accused of rape, another great who impregnated a literal child, and yet LeBron is the problem star. Hmm.

The past few years I’ve become so much less interested in the NBA and way more interested in the NFL. That’s a league that builds their stars up. The NBA is nonstop trashing the best players. The media clowns with the most ridiculous takes get the most attention. It’s a cancer.

Agreed 100%.

I am trending more towards football as well.

Not to get off topic here, but with the NFL and even MLB it's been extremely rare that the face of those leagues is of the same demographic as LeBron. Not to mention as outspoken politically.

I think that plays a significant factor in how they're perceived by the general media.

[thebigbird]

The NBA media is pure garbage. So much vitriol for a player who has been a model citizen off the court since entering the league as an 18 year old kid. Dudes have made entire careers out of hating on LeBron. You have one great who was credibly accused of rape, another great who impregnated a literal child, and yet LeBron is the problem star. Hmm.

The past few years I’ve become so much less interested in the NBA and way more interested in the NFL. That’s a league that builds their stars up. The NBA is nonstop trashing the best players. The media clowns with the most ridiculous takes get the most attention. It’s a cancer.

Agreed 100%.

I am trending more towards football as well.

Not to get off topic here, but with the NFL and even MLB it's been extremely rare that the face of those leagues is of the same demographic as LeBron. Not to mention as outspoken politically.

I think that plays a significant factor in how they're perceived by the general media.

The politics stuff is relatively new, though. The 2016 election is really the first time I remember him really speaking out. And it was a lot less than it’s been in the past 2-3 years. Not to say that it never happened before then, just that I don’t remember it. I think that’s a reason why some portions of the country who don’t really care about basketball hate him, but the irrational hatred predates that stuff.

[falcolombardi]

Read on Twitter

These are the losers voting on the awards btw. In addition to clowns like Ric Bucher and Bill Simmons. Yet I'm supposed to believe that Klutch and LeBron's media "fanboys" have just been running the show the last decade. If anything he needs more fanboys in the media. Out of all the rapists, wife beaters, and pedophiles the NBA has seen over the years LeBron James is the one guy who hasn't been a positive to the sport yeah okay.

He embodies everything these media idiots and so many Americans hate. They treated Ali the same way (*this isn't a comparison on their political stances, just their outspokenness and resulting backlash). That's why I'm glad LeBron stopped caring about his perception and I'm all for what Klutch and what they're doing. Any kind of push back against pieces of **** who peddle racially motivated vitriol like this is good in my book.

The NBA media is pure garbage. So much vitriol for a player who has been a model citizen off the court since entering the league as an 18 year old kid. Dudes have made entire careers out of hating on LeBron. You have one great who was credibly accused of rape, another great who impregnated a literal child, and yet LeBron is the problem star. Hmm.

The past few years I’ve become so much less interested in the NBA and way more interested in the NFL. That’s a league that builds their stars up. The NBA is nonstop trashing the best players. The media clowns with the most ridiculous takes get the most attention. It’s a cancer.

Agreed 100%.

I am trending more towards football as well.

nfl seems to be pretty questionable at some stuff too, the history of black quarterbacks is a ****

and the fan culture on nfl i see seems to start resembling the worse of basketball culture, like the obsesión with stanning some players while diminishng every other one

[zimpy27]

I think these comments are way more calculated than you guys are giving him credit for. Follow the fact pattern.

There have been rumors for years that Lebron/Klutch is way more involved in roster decisions than your average star player. He obviously doesn't orchestrate trades and things like that but he meets with AD and Russ and they decide to play together and then Pelinka makes it happen. He recruits guys like Melo, Dwight, Rondo, Gasol, Bradley, Ariza, etc. to play for mins.

Ramona Shelburne - Jeannie's media outlet - reports post deadline that Lakers FO/ownership decided "You guys got yourselves into this...this was your choice of roster and team. We're not going to mortgage our future...Go make it work."

Now you have all the passive aggressive comments about leaving, praising other GMs as MVPs and being smart for trading all their picks for titles. Lakers were previously listening to Lebron on roster decisions and this time they didn't, so Lebron is trying to take back some leverage.

The "cheap owner" stuff is a red herring. Lakers are 27M over the tax line. A 10M contract for Caruso would've cost Jeannie 40M including luxury tax. No one's making that decision for Caruso. Lakers chose THT over Caruso which you can bet Lebron had a voice in. In any event, it does seem like there's a divide growing between Bron and FO/ownership.

Either LeBron has control over trades or he doesn't. He can't be responsible for getting Westbrook but then not allowed to undo the mistake with trades at deadline. Lakers FO are trying to hide behind LeBron on the Westbrook decision. The HARD truth is that Rob/Jeannie made that trade after listening to advisors (LeBron, Davis, Rambis 1, Rambis 2 and probably more) then Rob/Jeannie decided not to make a trade at deadline after listening to advisors (LeBron, Davis, Rambis 1, Rambis 2 and probably more). The advisors likely don't all agree but the decision is ultimately weighed by Rob/Jeannie.

Lakers never planned to offer Caruso more than 7m a season. Rob and Jeannie just didn't value him that highly. The Caruso not getting paid had nothing to do with not being able to afford it. They didn't see his value as an asset to spend that much on.

LeBron is unhappy because the FO didn't listen to him about trading at deadline. For those that think LeBron is in control, you just got your wake up call and seem to be showing that you prefer accepting cognitive dissonance instead.