2010-11 Player of the Year thread

Post #161 » by **alucryts** » Tue May 24, 2011 6:42 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
alucryts wrote:to me at this point i feel like its dirks to lose and rose might get a pity #5 from me just because of the historical context of him being MVP...maybe. ill see how the rest of his post season goes

Well if Dirk beats Kobe, Durant and Rose or Lebron/Wade I don't see how you don't give him POY. Not to mention he would have won 2 of those series without HCA.

i agree. if he make the finals and continues this, even if they dont win hes a strong fav to win POY. it would take a ridiculous performance to oust him. if the mavs win no performance could oust him imo

Post #162 » by **alucryts** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:41 am

rose is now officially out of my top 5 baring a herculean come back. he was bad enough that he wont even be getting a pity #5 for his historical MVP. he is just not on the level of the other superstars these playoffs and has proven that multiple times

ronnymac2 · Post #163 » by **ronnymac2** » Wed May 25, 2011 6:22 am

Although I'm a big believer in the idea that players are exposed for who they really are in the playoffs, I think Rose's series against Miami needs to be taken with a grain of salt. His team is horribly flawed offensively- so flawed he won MVP, and rightfully so- and he's going up against a great defense that matches up well with his offense. He needs to do way too much heavy lifting without much help, and then he needs to at times defend Dwyane Wade on the other end. Dude's doing the best he can, but...

Post #164 » by **Doctor MJ** » Wed May 25, 2011 6:45 am

I won't go so far as to say Rose is for sure out of my top 5. He may be, there are 5 pretty dang strong contenders besides Rose, but I'm not quite that down on the guy that I'll say he's out of the discussion.

But dear lord LeBron. That was the kind of defensive performance against Rose people make up for most stars. A 3/4 who can come as close to shutting down the quickest guy in the game. This should not be possible. Yes, that can be a knock on Rose, but to me it says more about how LeBron's talent level is north of "once in a generation".

Don Draper · Post #165 » by **Don Draper** » Wed May 25, 2011 7:30 am

As of today

1. Lebron
2. Howard
3. Dirk
4. Wade
5. Rose
6. Durant
7. Kobe

nonemus · Post #166 » by **nonemus** » Wed May 25, 2011 7:31 am

Don Draper wrote:As of today

1. Lebron
2. Howard
3. Dirk
4. Wade
5. Rose
6. Durant
7. Kobe

I would agree with this list, with Rose and Durant being switchable.

nonemus · Post #167 » by **nonemus** » Wed May 25, 2011 7:40 am

The top 4 are very shaky though. I have Dirk ahead of Wade due to his performance in the playoffs, but you have to remember that Wade significantly outproduced Dirk in the 82 game season, and he still did well in the PS, although not as well (these CHI games are really putting a dent in his numbers. Howard's spot is set in stone in the top 4, it's just a matter of where. Lebron/Dirk/Wade's performance in the finals (barring a major comeback) will really be the decider of this year's POY winner imo. I mean, Lebron and Wade are both better players than Dirk, but because they play on the same team, their impact is limited (as evidenced by APM), so it doesnt really matter to an extent that they're better than Dirk. This coupled with the fact that Wade has played average in the playoffs (too much inconsistency) puts Dirk safely in the top 3, for now. But by the end of the season, the POY is either Dirk, Lebron or Wade (slighter chance due to Lebron's advantage in the RS stats). Or, if by the slight chance, they all suck, then it's Howard :lol:

Gongxi · Post #168 » by **Gongxi** » Wed May 25, 2011 11:27 am

nonemus wrote:
Don Draper wrote:As of today

1. Lebron
2. Howard
3. Dirk
4. Wade
5. Rose
6. Durant
7. Kobe

I would agree with this list, with Rose and Durant being switchable.

Good list. Also agree with switching Rose and Durant.

Sedale Threatt · Post #169 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Wed May 25, 2011 3:25 pm

Dick Whitman's list is looking good to me. That's pretty much what I've got -- LeBron, Howard, Nowitzki, Wade and Rose. Nowitzki rising with his postseason play, Rose dropping with his.

Post #170 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Wed May 25, 2011 3:52 pm

No Chris Paul for anyone? Why? PPG?

Post #171 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Wed May 25, 2011 3:52 pm

No Chris Paul for anyone? Why? PPG?

JordansBulls · Post #172 » by **JordansBulls** » Wed May 25, 2011 3:55 pm

alucryts wrote:rose is now officially out of my top 5 baring a herculean come back. he was bad enough that he wont even be getting a pity #5 for his historical MVP. he is just not on the level of the other superstars these playoffs and has proven that multiple times

Not sure why. He is being defended by two guys who are almost as quick as him are good defenders and have the length and size to deal with him not to mention the only playmaker on the team, not to mention those 2 guys are better than him.

Sedale Threatt · Post #173 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Wed May 25, 2011 3:59 pm

NO-KG-AI wrote:No Chris Paul for anyone? Why? PPG?

Make a case.

colts18 · Post #174 » by **colts18** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:03 pm

NO-KG-AI wrote:No Chris Paul for anyone? Why? PPG?

He wasn't all that great this year. He had a 1 month stretch where he was a liability for his team.

Tim_Hardawayy · Post #175 » by **Tim_Hardawayy** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:04 pm

One thing to consider, Paul's first round against the Lakers looks slightly less impressive after Dallas swept LA in the 2nd round. I think that's something people are taking into account.

If LA were still playing, and that series was their toughest challenge yet, I could see Paul still showing up in peoples top 5 (maybe even over Dirk, if LA had handled Dallas in 5 or something).

Post #176 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:15 pm

Sedale Threatt wrote:
NO-KG-AI wrote:No Chris Paul for anyone? Why? PPG?

Make a case.

I thought he was statistically superior to Kobe, Rose, and Durant. Their PER's are all in the same ballpark(Kobe leads over Paul by .2), but Paul is tied with Rose for the best defensive rating(despite being on an inferior defensive team), and he dwarfs all 3 pretty substantially in offensive rating(he's 8 above the next closest, Durant).

He has the highest winshare rating of the bunch, despite being on the team with the least wins.

He has a substantial lead in on/off, and is the leader in adjusted +/-.

I thought he was pretty easily the best of the bunch in his short playoff run as well, dismantling LA without his second best player to the tune of 22 points, 6 rebounds, 11.5 assists, and his PER, TS% and offensive rating are all a fair bit ahead of even Dirk, who is being lauded as the next GOD.

I don't think he's player of the year, but given what Kobe and Rose have done in the post season, and the fact that they only have team record as their trump card, I thought he'd see more mentions.

Sedale Threatt · Post #177 » by **Sedale Threatt** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:21 pm

A good post, subtle pot shot at Nowitzki aside.

Speaking for myself, and this probably isn't fair, but I suppose in comparison to what he's done in the past, he didn't really measure up. And you should know, if you pay attention, that I'm a huge Chris Paul fan, so it's not like I'm looking for reasons to keep him off.

Even if I did reconsider, highest I could put him is five, ahead of Rose. That's something to chew on. Kobe's not even on my radar -- he's not on anyone's that I can see, so he probably doesn't even need to be mentioned -- and Durant has pretty much slipped off.

Post #178 » by **NO-KG-AI** » Wed May 25, 2011 4:30 pm

I don't really disagree, was just stirring discussion, since everyone's top 7 seemed pretty dead set.

Post #179 » by **alucryts** » Wed May 25, 2011 5:33 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
alucryts wrote:rose is now officially out of my top 5 baring a herculean come back. he was bad enough that he wont even be getting a pity #5 for his historical MVP. he is just not on the level of the other superstars these playoffs and has proven that multiple times

Not sure why. He is being defended by two guys who are almost as quick as him are good defenders and have the length and size to deal with him not to mention the only playmaker on the team, not to mention those 2 guys are better than him.

i dont expect him to average 30+ppg on jordan efficiency, but he is just playing to his age out there making a ton of mistakes...he legit looks overwhelmed out there and isnt even giving what i could consider average performances for his standards. last night and lately it seems anything outside a dunk or open mid range shots and hes useless scoring the ball. lebron legit shut him down last night; like i was saying a little bit ago about howard, it now applies to rose. theres just 5 guys who deserve the poy more. either way i have so far:

1. Dirk
2. Lebron
3. Wade
4. Howard
5. Durant
6. Rose

colts18 · Post #180 » by **colts18** » Wed May 25, 2011 5:47 pm

This is my problem with POY voting. We are too much affected by recent events. We do need to some hindsight to realize the best player. For example in the 2009 voting LeBron wasn't even close to being the unanimous winner, but in hindsight it's clear he should have been. Though OTOH, we have too much hindsight. Like MJ being voted in the top 5 in his rookie season or some of his POTY victories before 91. At the time, I doubt he would have got as much consideration.