PC Board OT thread

Moderators: penbeast0, PaulieWal, Clyde Frazier, Doctor MJ, trex_8063

sp6r=underrated
RealGM
Posts: 20,832
And1: 13,597
Joined: Jan 20, 2007
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1601 » by sp6r=underrated » Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:49 am

The 76ers Tank 3 is the clearest example of the negative influence of the players draft and the current CBA.

The Alice in Wonderland logic behind the draft is that the worse companies should be awarded the most talented new workers to the industry. It is the exact opposite of the reason why markets are generally efficient (public goods, externalizes noted) The current CBA gives owner's territorial monopolies over their city so they face no competition and have a guaranteed share of revenue. The result is the sixers have decided they will be truly awful year after year until they land a top shelf prospect. They won't spend money and under the current CBA could do so forever without going bankrupt. That's nuts.

The sixers strategy doesn't increase the talent pool in the NBA. It actually depresses revenue on the margins. Finally it isn't as if it increases the number of championship teams. There is only one title team every year. If this strategy ends up working all it does is reward deadbeats as the expense of companies who tried. That is insanity.

Basketball isn't a public good as education is. There is no reason basketball teams shouldn't face market pressures.

If there was no draft the sixers would be forced to spend money on free agents or international scouting to find prospects. The talent pool would expand. Instead we have inertia. A more ambitious and talented manager would move to the very large market of Philadelphia due to the revenue potential if owners weren't able to prevent other teams from moving to their city. Instead Harris can just count profit and watch his franchise triple in revenue despite killing the quality of his product.

The sixers behavior is extremely norm destroying and the lottery system has been broken. In an ideal world it would be eliminated so I'll settle for some reform. If it doesn't happen there is nothing stopping an owner of a team from just never spending money and eventually landing a top flight prospect as a reward for his incompetence. This is a system that allowed the parasite Sterling to prosper and Harris is following in his footsteps.
sp6r=underrated
RealGM
Posts: 20,832
And1: 13,597
Joined: Jan 20, 2007
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1602 » by sp6r=underrated » Sat Nov 14, 2015 4:53 am

Big stories this year

1. Golden State making fools of all the critics by playing at a GOAT level for a 2nd consecutive season. I underestimated them but they were comically underrespected by many. The truly scary thing is how young their core is.

2. The gap between the conferences appears non-existent this year. The east is playing mildly better though I expect some regression.

3. Sacramento.
User avatar
Dr Positivity
RealGM
Posts: 62,534
And1: 16,334
Joined: Apr 29, 2009
       

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1603 » by Dr Positivity » Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:26 am

sp6r=underrated wrote:The 76ers Tank 3 is the clearest example of the negative influence of the players draft and the current CBA.

The Alice in Wonderland logic behind the draft is that the worse companies should be awarded the most talented new workers to the industry. It is the exact opposite of the reason why markets are generally efficient (public goods, externalizes noted) The current CBA gives owner's territorial monopolies over their city so they face no competition and have a guaranteed share of revenue. The result is the sixers have decided they will be truly awful year after year until they land a top shelf prospect. They won't spend money and under the current CBA could do so forever without going bankrupt. That's nuts.

The sixers strategy doesn't increase the talent pool in the NBA. It actually depresses revenue on the margins. Finally it isn't as if it increases the number of championship teams. There is only one title team every year. If this strategy ends up working all it does is reward deadbeats as the expense of companies who tried. That is insanity.

Basketball isn't a public good as education is. There is no reason basketball teams shouldn't face market pressures.

If there was no draft the sixers would be forced to spend money on free agents or international scouting to find prospects. The talent pool would expand. Instead we have inertia. A more ambitious and talented manager would move to the very large market of Philadelphia due to the revenue potential if owners weren't able to prevent other teams from moving to their city. Instead Harris can just count profit and watch his franchise triple in revenue despite killing the quality of his product.

The sixers behavior is extremely norm destroying and the lottery system has been broken. In an ideal world it would be eliminated so I'll settle for some reform. If it doesn't happen there is nothing stopping an owner of a team from just never spending money and eventually landing a top flight prospect as a reward for his incompetence. This is a system that allowed the parasite Sterling to prosper and Harris is following in his footsteps.


I agree with a lot of this but what I know about the Sixers plan so far financially is it's led to crap attendance and worse TV ratings, I believe. I presume the appraisal value of the team must be one of the worst in the league. So at least so far, it looks like there's some financial cost to this plan. The upside is that if the plan works and the team is great they will have a shoot up in attendance, ratings and appraisal value. But I don't know if that will happen yet cause I don't know if the plan will work. If it doesn't then they paid a cost financially compared to if they had gone down a different more successful route.

Plus even if the plan works, it may not be fair to say it was all caused by the Sixers decision to tank. Because they will have also used a lot of time to do it, which is probably the most valuable asset to every team trying to rebuild. To use a comparison in 2009 the Rockets had Yao and TMac era fell dead and they were left with Scola, Battier, Landry, Aaron Brooks, etc. A situation that screamed "blow it up and tank" by conventional wisdom. The Rockets ended up keeping enough vet talent to go .500 in 2010, 2011 and 2012 instead until James Harden trade got them back on road to contention before 2013 season. The Harden trade was connected to not tanking, cause 26 year old Lowry and 29 year Martin were the type of assets the Sixers do not currently have, in their prime starters who appeal to GM's like Toronto's at the time who needed to make the playoffs or get fired, and OKC's who wanted a starting caliber player to contend. So the Rockets got to where the Sixers want to be with a superstar and in position to contend going forward, after 3 down seasons. If the Sixers succeeded as quickly would it be because of tanking, or for the same reason the Rockets did, because of time and a GM sharp enough to make good trades and picks when he got the opportunity? Also I guess the Sixers could succeed without the players being the ones they tanked for. Noel, Covington, Saric, Stauskas aren't guys they tanked for. It remains to be seen whether picks like Embiid and Okafor end up more important than those guys
Liberate The Zoomers
User avatar
bondom34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 66,716
And1: 50,290
Joined: Mar 01, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1604 » by bondom34 » Sat Nov 14, 2015 8:34 am

Dr Positivity wrote:
sp6r=underrated wrote:The 76ers Tank 3 is the clearest example of the negative influence of the players draft and the current CBA.

The Alice in Wonderland logic behind the draft is that the worse companies should be awarded the most talented new workers to the industry. It is the exact opposite of the reason why markets are generally efficient (public goods, externalizes noted) The current CBA gives owner's territorial monopolies over their city so they face no competition and have a guaranteed share of revenue. The result is the sixers have decided they will be truly awful year after year until they land a top shelf prospect. They won't spend money and under the current CBA could do so forever without going bankrupt. That's nuts.

The sixers strategy doesn't increase the talent pool in the NBA. It actually depresses revenue on the margins. Finally it isn't as if it increases the number of championship teams. There is only one title team every year. If this strategy ends up working all it does is reward deadbeats as the expense of companies who tried. That is insanity.

Basketball isn't a public good as education is. There is no reason basketball teams shouldn't face market pressures.

If there was no draft the sixers would be forced to spend money on free agents or international scouting to find prospects. The talent pool would expand. Instead we have inertia. A more ambitious and talented manager would move to the very large market of Philadelphia due to the revenue potential if owners weren't able to prevent other teams from moving to their city. Instead Harris can just count profit and watch his franchise triple in revenue despite killing the quality of his product.

The sixers behavior is extremely norm destroying and the lottery system has been broken. In an ideal world it would be eliminated so I'll settle for some reform. If it doesn't happen there is nothing stopping an owner of a team from just never spending money and eventually landing a top flight prospect as a reward for his incompetence. This is a system that allowed the parasite Sterling to prosper and Harris is following in his footsteps.


I agree with a lot of this but what I know about the Sixers plan so far financially is it's led to crap attendance and worse TV ratings, I believe. I presume the appraisal value of the team must be one of the worst in the league. So at least so far, it looks like there's some financial cost to this plan. The upside is that if the plan works and the team is great they will have a shoot up in attendance, ratings and appraisal value. But I don't know if that will happen yet cause I don't know if the plan will work. If it doesn't then they paid a cost financially compared to if they had gone down a different more successful route.

Plus even if the plan works, it may not be fair to say it was all caused by the Sixers decision to tank. Because they will have also used a lot of time to do it, which is probably the most valuable asset to every team trying to rebuild. To use a comparison in 2009 the Rockets had Yao and TMac era fell dead and they were left with Scola, Battier, Landry, Aaron Brooks, etc. A situation that screamed "blow it up and tank" by conventional wisdom. The Rockets ended up keeping enough vet talent to go .500 in 2010, 2011 and 2012 instead until James Harden trade got them back on road to contention before 2013 season. The Harden trade was connected to not tanking, cause 26 year old Lowry and 29 year Martin were the type of assets the Sixers do not currently have, in their prime starters who appeal to GM's like Toronto's at the time who needed to make the playoffs or get fired, and OKC's who wanted a starting caliber player to contend. So the Rockets got to where the Sixers want to be with a superstar and in position to contend going forward, after 3 down seasons. If the Sixers succeeded as quickly would it be because of tanking, or for the same reason the Rockets did, because of time and a GM sharp enough to make good trades and picks when he got the opportunity?

A lot of this isn't due to tanking though. The TV ratings are down but I think its partially due to Comcast (plus Philly is uber frontrunner fan wise), the ticket sales fluctuate wildly in Philly. They were bad when the Sixers were good too, its not a bball town.
MyUniBroDavis wrote: he was like YALL PEOPLE WHO DOUBT ME WILL SEE YALLS STATS ARE WRONG I HAVE THE BIG BRAIN PLAYS MUCHO NASTY BIG BRAIN BIG CHUNGUS BRAIN YOU BOYS ON UR BBALL REFERENCE NO UNDERSTANDO
sp6r=underrated
RealGM
Posts: 20,832
And1: 13,597
Joined: Jan 20, 2007
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1605 » by sp6r=underrated » Sun Nov 15, 2015 3:56 am

Does anyone think McHale could get fired if the Rockets continue to struggle? They have gotten wrecked through the first ten games of the season.
User avatar
bondom34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 66,716
And1: 50,290
Joined: Mar 01, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1606 » by bondom34 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 6:25 am

sp6r=underrated wrote:Does anyone think McHale could get fired if the Rockets continue to struggle? They have gotten wrecked through the first ten games of the season.

I'm thinking so, though don't know how much is on him. They don't look good but Harden looks disinterested, Lawson doesn't look good, and they've got some injuries. To me the biggest issue he's got is starting Lawson, but Bev's been out some. Harden doesn't look right and when he's off his game he quits on both ends which is prob my biggest critique of his. Morey built a great team on paper, but really they're mentally weak if you believe in that thing (I do).
MyUniBroDavis wrote: he was like YALL PEOPLE WHO DOUBT ME WILL SEE YALLS STATS ARE WRONG I HAVE THE BIG BRAIN PLAYS MUCHO NASTY BIG BRAIN BIG CHUNGUS BRAIN YOU BOYS ON UR BBALL REFERENCE NO UNDERSTANDO
ceiling raiser
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,531
And1: 3,754
Joined: Jan 27, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1607 » by ceiling raiser » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:10 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/666641061192839168[/tweet]

Appears Lowe decided to stay with ESPN, or has not made a decision yet.

Either way, great to have his commentary back. :clap:
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
Dr Spaceman
General Manager
Posts: 8,575
And1: 11,211
Joined: Jan 16, 2013
   

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1608 » by Dr Spaceman » Tue Nov 17, 2015 4:15 pm

fpliii wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/666641061192839168[/tweet]

Appears Lowe decided to stay with ESPN, or has not made a decision yet.

Either way, great to have his commentary back. :clap:


Yeah, glad to have him back. Although truthfully I'm a bit disappointed to see it's with ESPN.

Any news on the Lowe Post? I actually missed that more than his columns.
“I’m not the fastest guy on the court, but I can dictate when the race begins.”
ceiling raiser
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,531
And1: 3,754
Joined: Jan 27, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1609 » by ceiling raiser » Wed Nov 18, 2015 8:40 pm

Dr Spaceman wrote:Yeah, glad to have him back. Although truthfully I'm a bit disappointed to see it's with ESPN.

Any news on the Lowe Post? I actually missed that more than his columns.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/667012881884532736[/tweet]
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
ceiling raiser
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,531
And1: 3,754
Joined: Jan 27, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1610 » by ceiling raiser » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:32 pm

Apologies for double posting, but looks like it's up:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ZachLowe_NBA/status/667103541023121408[/tweet]
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
User avatar
Clyde Frazier
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 20,212
And1: 26,083
Joined: Sep 07, 2010

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1611 » by Clyde Frazier » Thu Nov 19, 2015 1:42 am

NBA released a white chocolate mix today featuring some lesser known footage. Can post that here if anyone's interested, but it actually reminded me of when he was in the Nike freestyle video. Loved this back in the day.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgrkMYFtR6s[/youtube]
sp6r=underrated
RealGM
Posts: 20,832
And1: 13,597
Joined: Jan 20, 2007
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1612 » by sp6r=underrated » Thu Nov 19, 2015 4:59 am

sp6r=underrated wrote:Does anyone think McHale could get fired if the Rockets continue to struggle? They have gotten wrecked through the first ten games of the season.


Didn't expect it to happen that quick. I wish McHale would replace Shaq on Inside the NBA. He is legitimately funny with basketball knowledge.
User avatar
SideshowBob
General Manager
Posts: 9,061
And1: 6,263
Joined: Jul 16, 2010
Location: Washington DC
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1613 » by SideshowBob » Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:11 am

Bucks playing a RS game on TNT for the first time since 2002.

Chuck laying down the knowledge; Milwaukee "only team in the East that can beat the Cavs in a series".
But in his home dwelling...the hi-top faded warrior is revered. *Smack!* The sound of his palm blocking the basketball... the sound of thousands rising, roaring... the sound of "get that sugar honey iced tea outta here!"
User avatar
RSCD3_
RealGM
Posts: 13,932
And1: 7,342
Joined: Oct 05, 2013
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1614 » by RSCD3_ » Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:16 pm

SideshowBob wrote:Bucks playing a RS game on TNT for the first time since 2002.

Chuck laying down the knowledge; Milwaukee "only team in the East that can beat the Cavs in a series".


Chuck has an obsession with teams that can post up or defend really well ( only if it's because of a PF/C though as GS " would get mauled if they faced a team with "any real center" or something. ) Milwaukee has both since giannis is technically the size of a center with a wiry strong build and every player of their starting lineup can post ( albeit some alot more effectively than others )
I came here to do two things: get lost and slice **** up & I'm all out of directions.

Butler removing rearview mirror in his car as a symbol to never look back

Peja Stojakovic wrote:Jimmy butler, with no regard for human life
User avatar
RSCD3_
RealGM
Posts: 13,932
And1: 7,342
Joined: Oct 05, 2013
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1615 » by RSCD3_ » Fri Nov 20, 2015 4:20 pm

Also I am going to compile a list of longevity of the top 50 or so players in the league for a thread here but I was wondering how to weigh postseason minutes, I definitely want to give them a bigger slice of the pie but how much 1.25x,1.5x,2x or perhaps more?


Suggestions and thoughts would be appreciated
I came here to do two things: get lost and slice **** up & I'm all out of directions.

Butler removing rearview mirror in his car as a symbol to never look back

Peja Stojakovic wrote:Jimmy butler, with no regard for human life
User avatar
SideshowBob
General Manager
Posts: 9,061
And1: 6,263
Joined: Jul 16, 2010
Location: Washington DC
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1616 » by SideshowBob » Fri Nov 20, 2015 7:02 pm

RSCD3_ wrote:Also I am going to compile a list of longevity of the top 50 or so players in the league for a thread here but I was wondering how to weigh postseason minutes, I definitely want to give them a bigger slice of the pie but how much 1.25x,1.5x,2x or perhaps more?


Suggestions and thoughts would be appreciated


mysticbb always used a 3x weight for postseason games/minutes. He's still on APBRmetrics from time to time, might want to try reaching out to him, I'm sure he can explain eloquently why he did so.
But in his home dwelling...the hi-top faded warrior is revered. *Smack!* The sound of his palm blocking the basketball... the sound of thousands rising, roaring... the sound of "get that sugar honey iced tea outta here!"
User avatar
Texas Chuck
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Senior Mod - NBA TnT Forum
Posts: 92,280
And1: 98,046
Joined: May 19, 2012
Location: Purgatory
   

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1617 » by Texas Chuck » Sat Nov 21, 2015 7:10 pm

Zaza Pachulia is currently reminding me why I love basketball. Not sure if any of you have been paying attention to Dallas this year, but Zaza has been great. And the way he gets the crowd fired up has been awesome.

And last night he went all Kevin McHale on Gobert. Struggled to finish, but he had Gobert just flailing and flying all over the place.

And if I see one or two more silly player threads on here, I swear I will start a Zaza thread and just post vines of him knocking people down and diving on the floor and pumping his fist.
ThunderBolt wrote:I’m going to let some of you in on a little secret I learned on realgm. If you don’t like a thread, not only do you not have to comment but you don’t even have to open it and read it. You’re welcome.
Dr Spaceman
General Manager
Posts: 8,575
And1: 11,211
Joined: Jan 16, 2013
   

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1618 » by Dr Spaceman » Sat Nov 21, 2015 9:15 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
And if I see one or two more silly player threads on here, I swear I will start a Zaza thread and just post vines of him knocking people down and diving on the floor and pumping his fist.


:D :D :D :D
“I’m not the fastest guy on the court, but I can dictate when the race begins.”
User avatar
bondom34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 66,716
And1: 50,290
Joined: Mar 01, 2013

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1619 » by bondom34 » Sun Nov 22, 2015 2:07 am

Wait until he dominates the game tomorrow Chuck (or honestly its more likely to be JJB, who I know you'd rather make the thread for :D).
MyUniBroDavis wrote: he was like YALL PEOPLE WHO DOUBT ME WILL SEE YALLS STATS ARE WRONG I HAVE THE BIG BRAIN PLAYS MUCHO NASTY BIG BRAIN BIG CHUNGUS BRAIN YOU BOYS ON UR BBALL REFERENCE NO UNDERSTANDO
User avatar
SideshowBob
General Manager
Posts: 9,061
And1: 6,263
Joined: Jul 16, 2010
Location: Washington DC
 

Re: PC Board OT thread 

Post#1620 » by SideshowBob » Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:20 am

Daugherty doing ESPN halftime. Refreshingly insightful commentary, he sounds like he was honed in while watching the first half. Pretty solid breakdown of how GS offense was functioning and why it's a tough cover.
But in his home dwelling...the hi-top faded warrior is revered. *Smack!* The sound of his palm blocking the basketball... the sound of thousands rising, roaring... the sound of "get that sugar honey iced tea outta here!"

Return to Player Comparisons


cron