2021-22 NBA Season Discussion

[sp6r=underrated]

i think all this talk about avoiding nets is distracting us from the nets potentially missing the playoffs

as of right now, they are likely finishing in 8th seed where they would play Toronto away -without kyrie- and if they lose then hawks/Hornets at home -without kyrie-

the chance they outright miss the playoffs are very high imo

Yeah speaking from experience from last season, play ins is a very scary place to be. All it takes is a little bad shooting luck in 1 or 2 games and your season is over

I was skeptical of the play-in but it has made the season a lot more interesting. The 6 vs 7 playoff seeding race used to only be interesting when matchups were in play. Now it is a huge deal.

And you are right the play in is very dangerous. List of NBA champions who lost the 1st game of a series

2021 Bucks
2020 Lakers
2019 Raptors
2016 Cavs
2013 Heat
2012 Heat
2011 Mavs
2009 Lakers
2007 Spurs
2006 Heat
2005 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2003 Spurs
2001 Lakers
1998 Bulls
1995 Rockets
1994 Rockets
1993 Bulls
1992 Bulls
1991 Bulls

[falcolombardi]

i think all this talk about avoiding nets is distracting us from the nets potentially missing the playoffs

as of right now, they are likely finishing in 8th seed where they would play Toronto away -without kyrie- and if they lose then hawks/Hornets at home -without kyrie-

the chance they outright miss the playoffs are very high imo

Yeah speaking from experience from last season, play ins is a very scary place to be. All it takes is a little bad shooting luck in 1 or 2 games and your season is over

I was skeptical of the play-in but it has made the season a lot more interesting. The 6 vs 7 playoff seeding race used to only be interesting when matchups were in play. Now it is a huge deal.

And you are right the play in is very dangerous. List of NBA champions who lost the 1st game of a series

2021 Bucks
2020 Lakers
2019 Raptors
2016 Cavs
2013 Heat
2012 Heat
2011 Mavs
2009 Lakers
2007 Spurs
2006 Heat
2005 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2003 Spurs
2001 Lakers
1998 Bulls
1995 Rockets
1994 Rockets
1993 Bulls
1992 Bulls
1991 Bulls

worth to note that no team ever won a championship as a 7/8 seed (although rockets in 95 were 6th)

so none of them would have been play-in teams

[sp6r=underrated]

Yeah speaking from experience from last season, play ins is a very scary place to be. All it takes is a little bad shooting luck in 1 or 2 games and your season is over

I was skeptical of the play-in but it has made the season a lot more interesting. The 6 vs 7 playoff seeding race used to only be interesting when matchups were in play. Now it is a huge deal.

And you are right the play in is very dangerous. List of NBA champions who lost the 1st game of a series

2021 Bucks
2020 Lakers
2019 Raptors
2016 Cavs
2013 Heat
2012 Heat
2011 Mavs
2009 Lakers
2007 Spurs
2006 Heat
2005 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2003 Spurs
2001 Lakers
1998 Bulls
1995 Rockets
1994 Rockets
1993 Bulls
1992 Bulls
1991 Bulls

worth to note that no team ever won a championship as a 7/8 seed (although rockets in 95 were 6th)

so none of them would have been play-in teams

This is true but 7 and 8 seeds have gone on deep runs before. And runs that don't end in titles are still fun. As a Knicks fan I enjoyed the 99 season even though no title resulted from it.

[parsnips33]

Luka Doncic has been on my mild "Haterade" list the past few years. There's always a handful of players I irrationally hate every few years and I'm not a huge fan of guys that tend to play an overly heliocentric style (except for Jokic, who does it in ironically the most unselfish way).

But recently he took account for his constant whining to the refs. Big character move, I really like to see stuff like that. Gonna be watching him to see how he develops as a leader going forward because the talent is ofc undeniable. I may end up rooting for him.
He plays so much like Harden (who ha been #1 on my haterade list for years) but unlike Harden has huge gonads in the clutch. He may rank higher on the ATG list than Harden when its all said and done.

No better feeling than having someone win you over from haterdom - recently went through this with Kyrie

Given Kyrie's behavior this year, how did he win you over?

Re: the vaccine thing - he made a personal choice about his health and payed the consequences for it. You could argue he should have sacrificed his own convictions for the good of the team, but that's not really a can of worms I'm interested in opening.

From what I've seen of his comments on his indigenous heritage and honoring that part of his history and the struggles of those people, he's a very thoughtful guy and I appreciate his perspective. Is he the best at clearly articulating his message? Not always, but people rarely are.

Really the biggest thing for me is how riveting he is on the court. It was hard for me not to hate him after 2016 at the height of all the Steph slander and Kyrie > Steph takes, but now, with some distance, I can really appreciate the artistry of his game

[Colbinii]

No better feeling than having someone win you over from haterdom - recently went through this with Kyrie

Given Kyrie's behavior this year, how did he win you over?

Re: the vaccine thing - he made a personal choice about his health and payed the consequences for it. You could argue he should have sacrificed his own convictions for the good of the team, but that's not really a can of worms I'm interested in opening.

I don't think anyone is saying "Look at his [Millionaire] teammates, he needs to get vaccinated to help a team perform better in a sport."

All the pushback Kyrie received had nothing to do with Brooklyn Nets Championship Odds. If you think everyone was upset because of Vegas lines or the good of a basketball team, you are missing a lot.

I'm not going to go into why this is missing the boat--but its missing the boat.

From what I've seen of his comments on his indigenous heritage and honoring that part of his history and the struggles of those people, he's a very thoughtful guy and I appreciate his perspective. Is he the best at clearly articulating his message? Not always, but people rarely are.

“I pray we utilize the ‘fine money’ for the marginalized communities in need, especially seeing where our world is presently. [I am] I am here for Peace, Love, and Greatness. So stop distracting me and my team, and appreciate the Art. We move different over here,” he wrote.

“I do not talk to Pawns. My attention is worth more.”

Calling Media members Pawns isn't exactly thoughtful and certainly isn't supporting or attempting to change or address the issues in our society.

[Statlanta]

“I pray we utilize the ‘fine money’ for the marginalized communities in need, especially seeing where our world is presently. [I am] I am here for Peace, Love, and Greatness. So stop distracting me and my team, and appreciate the Art. We move different over here,” he wrote.

“I do not talk to Pawns. My attention is worth more.”

Calling Media members Pawns isn't exactly thoughtful and certainly isn't supporting or attempting to change or address the issues in our society.

I think those comments address a different issue about his character than how he acted and addressed his professionalism during the vaccine mandate.

[parsnips33]

Given Kyrie's behavior this year, how did he win you over?

Re: the vaccine thing - he made a personal choice about his health and payed the consequences for it. You could argue he should have sacrificed his own convictions for the good of the team, but that's not really a can of worms I'm interested in opening.

I don't think anyone is saying "Look at his [Millionaire] teammates, he needs to get vaccinated to help a team perform better in a sport."

All the pushback Kyrie received had nothing to do with Brooklyn Nets Championship Odds. If you think everyone was upset because of Vegas lines or the good of a basketball team, you are missing a lot.

I'm not going to go into why this is missing the boat--but its missing the boat.

From what I've seen of his comments on his indigenous heritage and honoring that part of his history and the struggles of those people, he's a very thoughtful guy and I appreciate his perspective. Is he the best at clearly articulating his message? Not always, but people rarely are.

“I pray we utilize the ‘fine money’ for the marginalized communities in need, especially seeing where our world is presently. [I am] I am here for Peace, Love, and Greatness. So stop distracting me and my team, and appreciate the Art. We move different over here,” he wrote.

“I do not talk to Pawns. My attention is worth more.”

Calling Media members Pawns isn't exactly thoughtful and certainly isn't supporting or attempting to change or address the issues in our society.

Vaccine question is maybe something for a different thread - but your point is taken. There's certainly more to the situation than the narrow Nets perspective

As to the second point, he definitely put his foot in his mouth, as he's done on other occasions. But I see that lack of polish as somewhat endearing. Right or wrong, it feels more authentic to how I would act as someone without expensive media/PR training.

In any case, that's just my take. I'm certainly not surprised when people say they don't like him for off-court reasons

[Colbinii]

As to the second point, he definitely put his foot in his mouth, as he's done on other occasions. But I see that lack of polish as somewhat endearing. Right or wrong, it feels more authentic to how I would act as someone without expensive media/PR training.

In any case, that's just my take. I'm certainly not surprised when people say they don't like him for off-court reasons

Kyrie Irving thinks he preaches against injustices, equality and oppression but then he makes a statement calling media members Pawns--which undoes everything he has said previously--because as you said above--we are seeing Kyrie being raw and unfiltered. Kyrie Irving's as you call it true colors, are calling people he sees as being in his way or below him, as Pawns.

[falcolombardi]

i am really curious how warriors will perform without curry to end the season

if they dont step up they may end in the 4th or 5th seed (where a matchup vs dallas could be fascinating)

[LukaTheGOAT]

Luka Doncic has been on my mild "Haterade" list the past few years. There's always a handful of players I irrationally hate every few years and I'm not a huge fan of guys that tend to play an overly heliocentric style (except for Jokic, who does it in ironically the most unselfish way).

But recently he took account for his constant whining to the refs. Big character move, I really like to see stuff like that. Gonna be watching him to see how he develops as a leader going forward because the talent is ofc undeniable. I may end up rooting for him.
He plays so much like Harden (who ha been #1 on my haterade list for years) but unlike Harden has huge gonads in the clutch. He may rank higher on the ATG list than Harden when its all said and done.

No better feeling than having someone win you over from haterdom - recently went through this with Kyrie

Given Kyrie's behavior this year, how did he win you over?

Imagine Kyrie's brilliance as a hooper.

[LukaTheGOAT]

Luka Doncic has been on my mild "Haterade" list the past few years. There's always a handful of players I irrationally hate every few years and I'm not a huge fan of guys that tend to play an overly heliocentric style (except for Jokic, who does it in ironically the most unselfish way).

But recently he took account for his constant whining to the refs. Big character move, I really like to see stuff like that. Gonna be watching him to see how he develops as a leader going forward because the talent is ofc undeniable. I may end up rooting for him.
He plays so much like Harden (who ha been #1 on my haterade list for years) but unlike Harden has huge gonads in the clutch. He may rank higher on the ATG list than Harden when its all said and done.

No better feeling than having someone win you over from haterdom - recently went through this with Kyrie

Given Kyrie's behavior this year, how did he win you over?

I imagine Kyrie's brilliance as a hooper.

[Colbinii]

i am really curious how warriors will perform without curry to end the season

if they dont step up they may end in the 4th or 5th seed (where a matchup vs dallas could be fascinating)

I would like to see the Timberwolves against them.

[falcolombardi]

i am really curious how warriors will perform without curry to end the season

if they dont step up they may end in the 4th or 5th seed (where a matchup vs dallas could be fascinating)

I would like to see the Timberwolves against them.

sounds fun, minnesota has been impressing me lately. they have some cool players beyond their big 3

[HeartBreakKid]

i am really curious how warriors will perform without curry to end the season

if they dont step up they may end in the 4th or 5th seed (where a matchup vs dallas could be fascinating)

I would like to see the Timberwolves against them.

sounds fun, minnesota has been impressing me lately. they have some cool players beyond their big 3

Cooler than me? Be honest...

[falcolombardi]

I would like to see the Timberwolves against them.

sounds fun, minnesota has been impressing me lately. they have some cool players beyond their big 3

Cooler than me? Be honest...

i mean, have you seen vandervilt? dude kinda rocks

[eminence]

After some early season hype about chasing the on/off record ('16 +18.5/+26.3), Jokic fallen back to earth. +7.7 on court, +13.8 on/off.

Some other top high minutes guys from this season:
Tatum: +10.9, +14.2
Curry: +10.1, +11.5
Mikal: +11.1, +8.7
Jrue: +9.0, +11.9
Giannis: +8.3, +10.6
Embiid: +6.6, +10.6
Garland: +6.7, +9.9
Gobert: +9.8, +6.4
Durant: +6.1, +10.0

[parsnips33]

After some early season hype about chasing the on/off record ('16 +18.5/+26.3), Jokic fallen back to earth. +7.7 on court, +13.8 on/off.

Some other top high minutes guys from this season:
Tatum: +10.9, +14.2
Curry: +10.1, +11.5
Mikal: +11.1, +8.7
Jrue: +9.0, +11.9
Giannis: +8.3, +10.6
Embiid: +6.6, +10.6
Garland: +6.7, +9.9
Gobert: +9.8, +6.4
Durant: +6.1, +10.0

Is Mikal Bridges the most underrated player in the league? Holy smokes

[falcolombardi]

After some early season hype about chasing the on/off record ('16 +18.5/+26.3), Jokic fallen back to earth. +7.7 on court, +13.8 on/off.

Some other top high minutes guys from this season:
Tatum: +10.9, +14.2
Curry: +10.1, +11.5
Mikal: +11.1, +8.7
Jrue: +9.0, +11.9
Giannis: +8.3, +10.6
Embiid: +6.6, +10.6
Garland: +6.7, +9.9
Gobert: +9.8, +6.4
Durant: +6.1, +10.0

Is Mikal Bridges the most underrated player in the league? Holy smokes

he gives me kawhi vibes in the 2014 spurs, the suns in general give me 2014 vibes down to how they got better after a heartbreakking finals loss

even if he stays at this level he is an all star level player, if he improved suns could be great for years and andyears to come

[Doctor MJ]

After some early season hype about chasing the on/off record ('16 +18.5/+26.3), Jokic fallen back to earth. +7.7 on court, +13.8 on/off.

Some other top high minutes guys from this season:
Tatum: +10.9, +14.2
Curry: +10.1, +11.5
Mikal: +11.1, +8.7
Jrue: +9.0, +11.9
Giannis: +8.3, +10.6
Embiid: +6.6, +10.6
Garland: +6.7, +9.9
Gobert: +9.8, +6.4
Durant: +6.1, +10.0

Is Mikal Bridges the most underrated player in the league? Holy smokes

Strong candidate, and it's disturbing to me.

It doesn't bother me that Paul & Booker were the two all-star picks over, but the fact that when people talked about a 3rd Sun they talked about Ayton rather than Bridges really tells me something about how most basketball people are receiving the information that makes them evaluate players.

That is: On a delay. They had Ayton as the #3 guy after last year's playoffs - and understandably so, I think Paul/Booker/Ayton was the Top 3 on the Suns in the playoffs - and really never put any serious thought into reconsidering this when thinking about all-star despite the fact there was never any case whatsoever that Ayton was the better player this year.

Meaning: Not just on a delay, but on a delay significant enough that when they are doing in-season analysis, they often aren't using any actual information from the season in-question.

Obviously that's not true about all players - it's clearly a thing where folks are paying the most attention to stars, rookies, and whoever happens to reach a critical buzz. But it's the lack of independent thought among people paid for their basketball thought that disturbs me.

ftr, while I'm not prepared to call Bridges "better" than Paul or Booker, to me it's pretty open & shut that he's been the Suns MVP this year by a significant margin. That's a minority view if their ever was one...with a majority that really has no valid arguments they've even bothered to consider.

Of course as I say all this, I'm not prepared to champion Bridges as a strong MVP candidate despite the Suns' dominant record. I do think the Suns' success is mostly about "the Suns" more than any one player, and I'd expect that an otherwise healthy Suns team would still be great without Bridges.

[Doctor MJ]

After some early season hype about chasing the on/off record ('16 +18.5/+26.3), Jokic fallen back to earth. +7.7 on court, +13.8 on/off.

Some other top high minutes guys from this season:
Tatum: +10.9, +14.2
Curry: +10.1, +11.5
Mikal: +11.1, +8.7
Jrue: +9.0, +11.9
Giannis: +8.3, +10.6
Embiid: +6.6, +10.6
Garland: +6.7, +9.9
Gobert: +9.8, +6.4
Durant: +6.1, +10.0

Is Mikal Bridges the most underrated player in the league? Holy smokes

he gives me kawhi vibes in the 2014 spurs, the suns in general give me 2014 vibes down to how they got better after a heartbreakking finals loss

even if he stays at this level he is an all star level player, if he improved suns could be great for years and andyears to come

One thing I'll say: Kawhi was a guy right from the jump who impressed more in the playoffs than in the regular season. There was a bulletproof-ness to his game that was extremely impressive and not at all normal. Bridges didn't give me that impression in the playoffs last year.

I do think Bridges should have been an all-star this year, and I expect him to have a long, great career, but would not predict him to be a Kawhi-level performer even aside from the volume scoring.