The Lebron Thread (2015-16 Pt. 3)

[colts18]

LeBron's defense last night according to NBA sportVU stats:

3-17 FG (18%)
0-5 3P (0%)
1-6 defending rim (17%)

He's allowing 33.9% FG% against Warriors (-14.1% below average) in this series. Kyrie allowing 61% in this series (Love 36%).

[MisterHibachi]

LeBron is actually the leader in 3P makes in the Finals. 64 for his career. Curry already has 47 though, so that won't last long.

[colts18]

Leaders in the 5 categories in this series:

Points:
1. Kyrie 141
2. LeBron 140

Rebounds:
1. LeBron 60
2. Thompson 52

Assists:
1. LeBron 40
T2. Kyrie 23
T2. Green 23
T2. Curry 23

Steals:
T1. LeBron 12
T1. Kyrie 12

Blocks:
T1. LeBron 10
T1. Bogut 10

LeBron ahead of tied in 4 categories and just 1 point behind Kyrie in Points scored.

[JLei]

LeBron is actually the leader in 3P makes in the Finals. 64 for his career. Curry already has 47 though, so that won't last long.

Never assume someone is going to just keep making the NBA Finals. While Curry could probably pass him this Finals if it goes 7. We thought Durant and Westbrook were primed to meet Bron here every year and they haven't been back. Injuries and unforeseen things can happen.

[RSCD3_]

kyrie 40+ on close to 90% TS at this point i'd assume... yeah

Finished with 41 on 82.4% TS and 146 ORTG

Has there been any other games with 40+ points and 80+ TS%

[PCProductions]

Really hoping to see Lebron be huge in this game. If Game 6 were to happen, it might be a more team related effort to win considering both how good the Cavs are at home and how well role players tend to do at home versus on the road. Game 5 will have be Lebron/Kyrie doing some incredible things to keep their title hopes alive. Very excited for this game.

I need to learn to shut my big mouth.

[Texas Chuck]

kyrie 40+ on close to 90% TS at this point i'd assume... yeah

Finished with 41 on 82.4% TS and 146 ORTG

Has there been any other games with 40+ points and 80+ TS%

Dirk in game 1 of the 2011 WCF put up 48 points on 94%TS. With no 3's. Going 12/15 and 24/24 from the line

edit: Durant had 40 on 76%TS in the same game.

[Arman_tanzarian]

Let's meme it:

Elimination Games

Michael Jordan (13 G)

Average Defense: 104.3 DRTG (-3.4)

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   TOV   STL   FGA   FTA   TS%   TOV%   GmSc

41.6  31.3  7.9   7.0   4.2   2.0   24.0  11.7 .537  .125    23.3

Lebron James (16 G)

Average Defense: 101.3 DRTG (-5.3)

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   TOV   STL   FGA   FTA   TS%   TOV%   GmSc

45.1  32.4  11.0  6.6   4.2   1.4   23.9  11.3 .561  .127    24.7

Kobe Bryant Post-2001 (13 G)

Average Defense: 102.7 DRTG ( -3.2)

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   TOV   STL   FGA   FTA   TS%   TOV%   GmSc

42.3  24.9  5.7   3.1   3.5   1.2   21.7  7.3  .500  .124    13.8

Spoiler:

Kobe Bryant Career (18 G)

Average Defense: 102.3 DRTG ( -3.1)

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   TOV   STL   FGA   FTA   TS%   TOV%   GmSc

40.0  22.2  5.4   3.2   3.1   0.9   19.4  6.5  .498  .123    12.6

But Kobe is a closer! He's so clutch! He was made for the Finals! He's got the will to win!

These were literally the arguments that people were STILL using on the GB a couple of days ago.

LeBron's not perfect, but I think people like to talk themselves into circles just to justify a player that they like more (Kobe) over the one they like less (LeBron), instead of going with the simple answer of the player that is objectively better across the board, on a career-long basis, is the better player.

Kobe was never that good in the finals. No clue where people make this stuff up even. I remember people were saying the other day that at least in this situation Kobe empties the clip? What? He completely stopped shooting in game 7 against the Suns and in Game 7 against Celtics he was 6-24 in the closeout with his teammates carrying him. Kobe's a winner and an all time great yes. He's no clutch god though. MJ is.

[RSCD3_]

I'm sure Love was in his own head the rest of the way after this exchange with LeBron. It no doubt exacerbated his already severely diminished confidence.

Loves like that guy who does next to no work on a project with two other ppl doing 95% of it, and he tries to come together with a big grin and satisfied with his input lol.

I'm sure Love was in his own head the rest of the way after this exchange with LeBron. It no doubt exacerbated his already severely diminished confidence.

I'm sure Love was in his own head the rest of the way after this exchange with LeBron. It no doubt exacerbated his already severely diminished confidence.

Just an update the video was taken out of context


https://streamable.com/i80t

Context shows they are actually voicing displeasure at the ezeli foul

[G35]

Kobe was never that good in the finals. No clue where people make this stuff up even. I remember people were saying the other day that at least in this situation Kobe empties the clip? What? He completely stopped shooting in game 7 against the Suns and in Game 7 against Celtics he was 6-24 in the closeout with his teammates carrying him. Kobe's a winner and an all time great yes. He's no clutch god though. MJ is.

The idea of clutch and not clutch is up for interpretation.

This is from Wikipedia so take from it what you will:

Clutch performance in sports is the phenomenon of athletes under pressure, often in the last minutes of a game, to summon strength, concentration and whatever else necessary to succeed, to perform well, and perhaps change the outcome of the game. It occurs in basketball, hockey, football, and other sports. The opposite is "choking": failing to perform as needed, when under pressure.

I think it's easier to say whether a player is a choker compared to whether a player is clutch. However, both terms imply meaning: clutch implies doing things to obtain a favorable outcome, whereas choke implies failing to perform as needed under pressure. The great players have been in thousands of games, hundreds of playoff games, and invariably been able to win more times than not. Winning is clutch, losing is not.....

[therealbig3]

Winning is clutch, losing is not.....

That's actually not what it says.

The concept of "clutch" is to perform well under pressure. Usually, this is taken to mean end of game situations. "Choking" is not performing well under pressure.

It says "possibly changing the outcome"...but it's not a requirement. You can play well, and still lose. You can also play like crap, and still win. That definition from wikipedia supports that.

It's a false equivalency to then equate "clutch" with "winning", and "not clutch" with "losing", because they are two separate things. One does not have to be the other.

[PaulieWal]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/HPbasketball/status/742747261403205633[/tweet]

If I am the Lue/LeBron you have to know that you can't rely on Kyrie hitting contested shots for game 6 and possibly a game 7. They still need to get better quality shots.

[Colbinii]

They need to incorporate Kevin Love into the game. I know everyone has been hating on him, and I have, but his offense out of the post is much more conductive to winning basketball than Kyrie Irving's Isolation ball.

[ppedro123]

They need to incorporate Kevin Love into the game. I know everyone has been hating on him, and I have, but his offense out of the post is much more conductive to winning basketball than Kyrie Irving's Isolation ball.

have you ever seen Love post up?

[Dipper 13]

So who else in history is up there with lebron as an elimination game player? Surely statistically he must be close to the top of the list right?

Wilt Chamberlain (23 Games)

Average Estimated Defense Faced: 91.4 DRtg (-4.0)

*Assists & minutes played both missing for one (same) game, their average is from 22 games

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   FGA   FTA   FG%   TS%

47.1  31.1  25.7  3.4   22.9  13.6 .546  .539

If only looking at his big scoring years through 1966:


Wilt Chamberlain (12 Games)

Average Estimated Defense Faced: 87.4 DRtg (-5.7)

*Assists & minutes played both missing for one (same) game, their average is from 11 games

Code: Select all

MPG   PTS   TRB   AST   FGA   FTA   FG%   TS%

47.6  37.3  27.6  1.6   29.3  14.2 .521  .525

Also to add to this:


Jerry West (23 Games)

Average Estimated Defense Faced: 93.1 DRtg (-2.7)

*Assists missing for four games, average is from 19 games

Code: Select all

PTS   TRB   AST   FGA   FTA   FG%   TS%

30.6  6.7   6.7   23.2  9.2  .502  .561

[Colbinii]

They need to incorporate Kevin Love into the game. I know everyone has been hating on him, and I have, but his offense out of the post is much more conductive to winning basketball than Kyrie Irving's Isolation ball.

have you ever seen Love post up?

He use to play for the Timberwolves. I saw him put up an MVP caliber year in the post.

[Colbinii]

Jerry West (23 Games)

Average Estimated Defense Faced: 93.1 DRtg (-2.7)

*Assists missing for four games, average is from 19 games

Code: Select all

PTS   TRB   AST   FGA   FTA   FG%   TS%

30.6  6.7   6.7   23.2  9.2  .502  .561

56 TS% back then

[ppedro123]

They need to incorporate Kevin Love into the game. I know everyone has been hating on him, and I have, but his offense out of the post is much more conductive to winning basketball than Kyrie Irving's Isolation ball.

have you ever seen Love post up?

He use to play for the Timberwolves. I saw him put up an MVP caliber year in the post.

Sadly, this ain't 2014. Dude shoots like 30% at the rim.

[Statlanta]

Alright folks, time for the real questions now.

Considering the stakes...best T-shirt game ever? Kyrie #2?

Absolutely love these Cavs unis BTW. By far their best since these for me





Def two of the best unis of these era for me.

I don't know guys it's very weird to me. These shirt jerseys are called the Cavs' PRIDE jerseys and both LeBron and Kyrie had amazing games in this apparel extending the series. Is there some subliminal message I'm not getting here(Also I've noticed LeBron teams tend to have the most amount of jersey options in the league).

[Colbinii]

have you ever seen Love post up?

He use to play for the Timberwolves. I saw him put up an MVP caliber year in the post.

Sadly, this ain't 2014. Dude shoots like 30% at the rim.

The mid-post isn't at the rim, and this isn't about his ability to just score. He can create for others out of the post and it allows him to stay closer to the basket where his offensive rebounding can play a huge part.