Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst

Moderators: trex_8063, penbeast0, PaulieWal, Clyde Frazier, Doctor MJ

Post Reply
70sFan
RealGM
Posts: 30,172
And1: 25,449
Joined: Aug 11, 2015
 

Re: Rank their 

Post#21 » by 70sFan » Thu Feb 1, 2018 12:31 pm

NO-KG-AI wrote:Because nobody used their strength to establish deep post position and finish strong through contact as effectively or as often as Shaq did. It was literally his entire game, and no one could do anything about it but keep throwing the biggesf bodies you could at him.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums


Nobody besides Gilmore. That's the point - Gilmore established his position as easy as anyone and he did it against the strongest players of his era. He wasn't as good as Shaq overall but it's not because of his strength.
Top
User avatar
NO-KG-AI
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 44,153
And1: 20,203
Joined: Jul 19, 2005
Location: The city of witch doctors, and good ol' pickpockets

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#22 » by NO-KG-AI » Thu Feb 1, 2018 1:16 pm

But he didn't do it as well, or as often as Shaq, or he'd have been a much better player. :dontknow:
Doctor MJ wrote:I don't understand why people jump in a thread and say basically, "This thing you're all talking about. I'm too ignorant to know anything about it. Lollerskates!"
Top
70sFan
RealGM
Posts: 30,172
And1: 25,449
Joined: Aug 11, 2015
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#23 » by 70sFan » Thu Feb 1, 2018 9:07 pm

NO-KG-AI wrote:But he didn't do it as well, or as often as Shaq, or he'd have been a much better player. :dontknow:


Not really. Shaq wasn't better than Gilmore because he could establish deep position eaier or more often - he was better player because he was a better passer, had better feel for offensive game, could read defense better, was more willing to score. Gilmore wasn't as inteligent player as Shaq and he didn't want to dominate everytime he got the ball - that's rare thing that Shaq (and other all-time great scorers) had.

Look at some examples:



That aren't selected clips - that plays were routine for Gilmore. You can see what he did against big strong men like Parish, Moses, Kareem, Lanier and many others. What makes him less impressive in terms of fighting for deep position than Shaq? I can guarnatee you that he did that regulary, every single game I've seen at any point of his NBA career (even as 39 years old).
Top
SkyHookFTW
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,555
And1: 3,229
Joined: Jul 26, 2014
         

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#24 » by SkyHookFTW » Thu Feb 1, 2018 9:26 pm

Wilt needs a mention here as a player able to get position. At age 36, his last year, on a repaired knee, he still led the league in rebounds. This didn't happen by accident. This happened because he knew where to be and how to use his strength to get there.
"It's scarier than Charles Barkley at an all you can eat buffet." --Shaq on Shark Week
"My secret to getting rebounds? It's called go get the damn ball." --Charles Barkley
Top
penbeast0
Senior Mod - NBA Player Comparisons
Senior Mod - NBA Player Comparisons
Posts: 30,426
And1: 9,953
Joined: Aug 14, 2004
Location: South Florida
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#25 » by penbeast0 » Thu Feb 1, 2018 9:31 pm

Gilmore is the NBA's all-time fg% efficiency leader for a reason. He was immensely strong to get good position, immensely tall to be able to shoot over virtually everyone inside, and not someone who shot (or called for the ball) against multiple defenders very often. He was as impressive a physical specimen as anyone not named Shaq/Wilt/LeBron but was a quiet, shy person most of the time. He didn't even take on the role of primary scorer in the ABA until Hubie Brown forced a change in 1975, preferring to defer to Dan Issel and Louie Dampier, and just get what came to him easily (and in the ABA, he was more active and played further outside). In the NBA, he was appreciably slower as well though he had gained weight to play the more plodding NBA game. But even at his peak, he didn't have Shaq's quickness or fluidity though he was an amazing athlete. More like a stronger version of Yao with less range.
“Most people use statistics like a drunk man uses a lamppost; more for support than illumination,” Andrew Lang.
Top
70sFan
RealGM
Posts: 30,172
And1: 25,449
Joined: Aug 11, 2015
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#26 » by 70sFan » Thu Feb 1, 2018 10:13 pm

penbeast0 wrote:Gilmore is the NBA's all-time fg% efficiency leader for a reason. He was immensely strong to get good position, immensely tall to be able to shoot over virtually everyone inside, and not someone who shot (or called for the ball) against multiple defenders very often. He was as impressive a physical specimen as anyone not named Shaq/Wilt/LeBron but was a quiet, shy person most of the time. He didn't even take on the role of primary scorer in the ABA until Hubie Brown forced a change in 1975, preferring to defer to Dan Issel and Louie Dampier, and just get what came to him easily (and in the ABA, he was more active and played further outside). In the NBA, he was appreciably slower as well though he had gained weight to play the more plodding NBA game. But even at his peak, he didn't have Shaq's quickness or fluidity though he was an amazing athlete. More like a stronger version of Yao with less range.



That's the point - Gilmore didn't have Shaq’s quickness and he didn't have Shaq’s BBIQ/mentality. That's why he wasn't as good overall on offense - he didn't lacked strength compared to him.
Top
penbeast0
Senior Mod - NBA Player Comparisons
Senior Mod - NBA Player Comparisons
Posts: 30,426
And1: 9,953
Joined: Aug 14, 2004
Location: South Florida
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#27 » by penbeast0 » Thu Feb 1, 2018 11:05 pm

70sFan wrote:

That's the point - Gilmore didn't have Shaq’s quickness and he didn't have Shaq’s BBIQ/mentality. That's why he wasn't as good overall on offense - he didn't lacked strength compared to him.


Yes, I generally agree with you since we both mainly saw the same guys. :beer:
“Most people use statistics like a drunk man uses a lamppost; more for support than illumination,” Andrew Lang.
Top
User avatar
NO-KG-AI
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 44,153
And1: 20,203
Joined: Jul 19, 2005
Location: The city of witch doctors, and good ol' pickpockets

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#28 » by NO-KG-AI » Fri Feb 2, 2018 1:09 am

I don't care how strong a guy is for his size, he's not overpowering a guy 100 pounds heavier than him in the post. The only way that kinda works sometimes is when a guy is way shorter and stocky, and can get good enough position to throw that bigger guy off balance sometimes.
Doctor MJ wrote:I don't understand why people jump in a thread and say basically, "This thing you're all talking about. I'm too ignorant to know anything about it. Lollerskates!"
Top
Jaqua92
RealGM
Posts: 13,304
And1: 8,527
Joined: Feb 21, 2017
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#29 » by Jaqua92 » Fri Feb 2, 2018 5:16 am

Lol you spelled strength wrong twice.
Top
70sFan
RealGM
Posts: 30,172
And1: 25,449
Joined: Aug 11, 2015
 

Re: Rank their "basketball effective strenght" from best to worst 

Post#30 » by 70sFan » Fri Feb 2, 2018 5:32 am

NO-KG-AI wrote:I don't care how strong a guy is for his size, he's not overpowering a guy 100 pounds heavier than him in the post. The only way that kinda works sometimes is when a guy is way shorter and stocky, and can get good enough position to throw that bigger guy off balance sometimes.


Firstly, Shaq wasn't 100 heavier than Gilmore. Gilmore weighed around 280 lbs in NBA career, Shaq weighed around 320-40 lbs during his prime. Gilmore was all muscles, I don't think the difference is that big. Gilmore was one of the biggest players ever. Remember that before calling him much smaller than Shaq.

Secondly, I just posted over 20 examples of A-Train strength in the post and you reply me with "I don't care how strong the guy is for his size". Thanks for great, in-depth analysis...
Top
Post Reply

Return to Player Comparisons

 

 

More Basketball News »