Mt Rushmore of guards

[SlimShady83]

I thought I was having deju vu, but no, he's done this same thread with misleading title before:

viewtopic.php?t=2395372

Lmao I don't even remember this one a lot has gone on in my life last few months.

I said MJ, Kobe,Curry, Magic. This time Kobe. Kicking out Curry for Luka this going to be Luka's year sorry Curry, this too funny.

[SNPA]

To me this is a somewhat misleading thread title. Mt. Rushmore of guards is not the same as 'who would you take today in a vague hypothetical scenario'. Mt. Rushmore for any sport is usually thought of as just career greatness within that sport. Changing it to 'who would you choose today' to me is an attempt at changing that meaning and is disingenuous.

+1000

This is just the OP once against trying to shove his lack of respect for players not in the modern era down everyone else's throat. Just because Luka is thriving today doesn't mean he should be considered a greater player at this point than Oscar or West, but that's what the OP is trying to trick people into saying. Transparent as usual.

Chuck is 100% right here.

[Samurai]

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

There is a continuing misunderstanding about Mount Rushmore. According to its sculptor, Gutzon Borglum, it was not intended to depict the four "greatest" presidents; it was intended to represent four key eras of U.S. history. Those were the nation's birth (represented by Washington), its expansion (represented by Jefferson and the Louisiana Purchase), its development (represented by Theodore Roosevelt and his work on the Panama Canal), and its preservation (represented by Lincoln having led the country through the Civil War).

While one can debate whether there are better examples of each era today, for the purposes of this thread a Mount Rushmore of NBA guards would properly focus on who best represents the birth of guard play, the expansion of guard play, the development of guard play and its preservation. It is not about who the four "best" are and certainly nothing in Mount Rushmore's history would suggest it is about who would be "best" today or which US presidents would be "best" in today's world. So my first crack at a Mount Rushmore of guards might be:

Cousy (personally not a fan of his at all but he seems as good as any to represent the birth of NBA guard play)
Magic as a representative of the expansion of guard play to show that big guys can also play guard, including the point, and be great rebounders as well as passers.
Jordan as an example of the development of guard play and that a guard can be the leading influencer of a game that had previously been dominated by centers.
Curry and his 3-point shooting has ushered in a new era in which players now spam 3-pointers at never before seen rates and frequency. Whether you like that style of play or not, it seems to be the new norm and Curry represents the preservation of the new style of play.

[jalengreen]

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

There is a continuing misunderstanding about Mount Rushmore. According to its sculptor, Gutzon Borglum, it was not intended to depict the four "greatest" presidents; it was intended to represent four key eras of U.S. history. Those were the nation's birth (represented by Washington), its expansion (represented by Jefferson and the Louisiana Purchase), its development (represented by Theodore Roosevelt and his work on the Panama Canal), and its preservation (represented by Lincoln having led the country through the Civil War).

While one can debate whether there are better examples of each era today, for the purposes of this thread a Mount Rushmore of NBA guards would properly focus on who best represents the birth of guard play, the expansion of guard play, the development of guard play and its preservation. It is not about who the four "best" are and certainly nothing in Mount Rushmore's history would suggest it is about who would be "best" today or which US presidents would be "best" in today's world. So my first crack at a Mount Rushmore of guards might be:

Cousy (personally not a fan of his at all but he seems as good as any to represent the birth of NBA guard play)
Magic as a representative of the expansion of guard play to show that big guys can also play guard, including the point, and be great rebounders as well as passers.
Jordan as an example of the development of guard play and that a guard can be the leading influencer of a game that had previously been dominated by centers.
Curry and his 3-point shooting has ushered in a new era in which players now spam 3-pointers at never before seen rates and frequency. Whether you like that style of play or not, it seems to be the new norm and Curry represents the preservation of the new style of play.

Not to nitpick, but "preservation of the new style of play" when he's purportedly the one who ushered in the new era doesn't really make sense to me. He'd make more sense for expansion/development. Lincoln preserved the union, Steph preserving an entirely new paradigm seems like an odd analogue. He kinda did the opposite of preservation lol

I'd probably go

Cousy -> birth
Oscar -> expansion [larger point guard, all-around player, quite different from Cousy, and the only MVP guard between Cousy and Magic]
Magic -> preservation [ended 20+ yr drought of guards winning MVP, plus the whole Bird/Magic saving (literally preserving) the NBA narrative]
Curry -> development [new paradigm of guard play]

Naturally unsatisfying not to have the GOAT guard here so I suppose it might be better framed as a PG rushmore, but I don't think Jordan's the best pick for any of the four categories

[parsnips33]

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

There is a continuing misunderstanding about Mount Rushmore. According to its sculptor, Gutzon Borglum, it was not intended to depict the four "greatest" presidents; it was intended to represent four key eras of U.S. history. Those were the nation's birth (represented by Washington), its expansion (represented by Jefferson and the Louisiana Purchase), its development (represented by Theodore Roosevelt and his work on the Panama Canal), and its preservation (represented by Lincoln having led the country through the Civil War).

While one can debate whether there are better examples of each era today, for the purposes of this thread a Mount Rushmore of NBA guards would properly focus on who best represents the birth of guard play, the expansion of guard play, the development of guard play and its preservation. It is not about who the four "best" are and certainly nothing in Mount Rushmore's history would suggest it is about who would be "best" today or which US presidents would be "best" in today's world. So my first crack at a Mount Rushmore of guards might be:

Cousy (personally not a fan of his at all but he seems as good as any to represent the birth of NBA guard play)
Magic as a representative of the expansion of guard play to show that big guys can also play guard, including the point, and be great rebounders as well as passers.
Jordan as an example of the development of guard play and that a guard can be the leading influencer of a game that had previously been dominated by centers.
Curry and his 3-point shooting has ushered in a new era in which players now spam 3-pointers at never before seen rates and frequency. Whether you like that style of play or not, it seems to be the new norm and Curry represents the preservation of the new style of play.

Love this, so much more interesting than the generic "pick the 4 best guys" version.

[penbeast0]

...
Magic as a representative of the expansion of guard play to show that big guys can also play guard, including the point, and be great rebounders as well as passers....

That would be Oscar.

[carlquincy]

There's is no valid list without Jordan. His influence to the NBA and pop culture is just too impactful to ignore.

[One_and_Done]

There's is no valid list without Jordan. His influence to the NBA and pop culture is just too impactful to ignore.

That doesn't really have anything to do with how good you are at basketball though.

[Djoker]

Magic
Jordan
Kobe
Curry

HM: Oscar, West

[LeBronSpaghetti]

Jordan, Magic, and Curry are the easy top 3. Gets harder after that. Probably Oscar.

[Samurai]

There's is no valid list without Jordan. His influence to the NBA and pop culture is just too impactful to ignore.

That doesn't really have anything to do with how good you are at basketball though.

Neither does Mount Rushmore.

[penbeast0]

The Mt. Rushmore of marketing potential for their era . . . Maravich, Jordan, Iverson, ?

[Ol Roy]

The Mt. Rushmore would have to be Oscar, Jerry, Magic, and Michael. No more spots left after MJ.

[One_and_Done]

The Mt. Rushmore would have to be Oscar, Jerry, Magic, and Michael. No more spots left after MJ.

Pretty confident no GM today would pick those as the top 4 options to build a team around.

[Ol Roy]

The Mt. Rushmore would have to be Oscar, Jerry, Magic, and Michael. No more spots left after MJ.

Pretty confident no GM today would pick those as the top 4 options to build a team around.

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

[One_and_Done]

The Mt. Rushmore would have to be Oscar, Jerry, Magic, and Michael. No more spots left after MJ.

Pretty confident no GM today would pick those as the top 4 options to build a team around.

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

Thst's not the question the thread is asking though. Do you have any thoughts on that?

[Ol Roy]

Pretty confident no GM today would pick those as the top 4 options to build a team around.

Would be funny if the actual Mt Rushmore worked like this. Which 4 historic presidents would be best in 2025

Thst's not the question the thread is asking though. Do you have any thoughts on that?

I'd go with the same four. Oscar and Magic would fit the point forward (nominal guard) helio role well. West and Jordan would make excellent two-way combo guards today.

[One_and_Done]

Thst's not the question the thread is asking though. Do you have any thoughts on that?

I'd go with the same four. Oscar and Magic would fit the point forward (nominal guard) helio role well. West and Jordan would make excellent two-way combo guards today.

I'll re-iterate then. I feel very confident that not a single GM today would agree.

[penbeast0]

Thst's not the question the thread is asking though. Do you have any thoughts on that?

I'd go with the same four. Oscar and Magic would fit the point forward (nominal guard) helio role well. West and Jordan would make excellent two-way combo guards today.

I'll re-iterate then. I feel very confident that not a single GM today would agree.

Well, Oscar is 87, but he keeps in good shape.

[Ol Roy]

Thst's not the question the thread is asking though. Do you have any thoughts on that?

I'd go with the same four. Oscar and Magic would fit the point forward (nominal guard) helio role well. West and Jordan would make excellent two-way combo guards today.

I'll re-iterate then. I feel very confident that not a single GM today would agree.

I doubt that. Maybe ESPN can poll them.

I'm very confident that, if presented with this hypothetical, a minority of them would adopt your philosophy on cross-era translation for great players. Because money and success is the bottom line for them, not ideological rigidness.

If I were a GM and looking at say, Jerry West, I'd be pretty impressed with a guy over 6'4 barefoot, with a 6'9 wingspan and 39' vertical, with great speed and textbook shooting form. And someone totally serious about his profession (including playing intense defense) with a killer mentality. That's the kind of guy I'd be thrilled to start a team with.