PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics]

[sp6r=underrated]

I don't doubt there are people who were MJ stanning 90s basketball fans that found themselves going through the motions with NBA in mid 2000s between their entering middle age and watching these Spurs/Nets and Spurs/Pistons type finals

you reminded me of a poster named jordan23forever. dude was super knowledgable about 90s ball and used to post all the time to defend MJ and discuss 90s ball in late 00s. But you could tell he really didn't care much about anything that was currently happening. and i've seen that with a lot of guys my age aging out of the nba.

i don't know why this is. the nba is really good at getting young people interested in the nba but they seem to lose interest in their early 30s. and this trend has been going on awhile.

I wonder if that's how it goes with every generation: if people who grew up watching in the 90s kind of lost the love as well once Jordan/Hakeem/Barkley etc retired.

that has been my theory. The NBA markets itself via superstars rather than teams. Folks are more fans of Jordan than the Bulls or even Jordan's Bulls. It explains why so many follow superstars team to team in a way you don't see in other american sports leagues.

Superstar marketing keeps it hard to get middle aged folks to stay engaged. you just don't hero worship in the same way when you have kids or a full-time job.

[ceiling raiser]

Wow, a lot of deaths of 60s/70s greats recently, including inner pantheon guys.

Who else is left? I guess Big O and Kareem.

RIP

[sp6r=underrated]

Wow, a lot of deaths of 60s/70s greats recently, including inner pantheon guys.

Who else is left? I guess Big O and Kareem.

RIP

I remember a writer talking about the coming mortality of all of the rockstars from the 60s. and yeah it is inevitable. Barkley is 61 folks and these guys are generation older.

https://theweek.com/articles/861750/coming-death-just-about-every-rock-legend

[Special_Puppy]

I don't doubt there are people who were MJ stanning 90s basketball fans that found themselves going through the motions with NBA in mid 2000s between their entering middle age and watching these Spurs/Nets and Spurs/Pistons type finals

you reminded me of a poster named jordan23forever. dude was super knowledgable about 90s ball and used to post all the time to defend MJ and discuss 90s ball in late 00s. But you could tell he really didn't care much about anything that was currently happening. and i've seen that with a lot of guys my age aging out of the nba.

i don't know why this is. the nba is really good at getting young people interested in the nba but they seem to lose interest in their early 30s. and this trend has been going on awhile.

I wonder if that's how it goes with every generation: if people who grew up watching in the 90s kind of lost the love as well once Jordan/Hakeem/Barkley etc retired.

that has been my theory. The NBA markets itself via superstars rather than teams. Folks are more fans of Jordan than the Bulls or even Jordan's Bulls. It explains why so many follow superstars team to team in a way you don't see in other american sports leagues.

Superstar marketing keeps it hard to get middle aged folks to stay engaged. you just don't hero worship in the same way when you have kids or a full-time job.

For what it’s worth there was basically no age gap in the popularity of basketball 25 years ago. Popularity was pretty even across every age group. Obviously that’s changed in the past 25 years and basketball is now much more popular with young people than it is with old people. https://news.gallup.com/poll/2959/football-favorite-sport-american-fans.aspx

https://news.gallup.com/poll/610046/football-retains-dominant-position-favorite-sport.aspx

[Dr Positivity]

This was inevitable considering until last 10 years NBA players had beaten the odds in terms of mortality. I remember the stat that Moses (2015) was only the 2nd MVP to die after Wilt. The first two (Cousy and Pettit) are still alive.

In other sports one that surprised me is that Willie Mays is alive.

[ardee]

I don't doubt there are people who were MJ stanning 90s basketball fans that found themselves going through the motions with NBA in mid 2000s between their entering middle age and watching these Spurs/Nets and Spurs/Pistons type finals

you reminded me of a poster named jordan23forever. dude was super knowledgable about 90s ball and used to post all the time to defend MJ and discuss 90s ball in late 00s. But you could tell he really didn't care much about anything that was currently happening. and i've seen that with a lot of guys my age aging out of the nba.

i don't know why this is. the nba is really good at getting young people interested in the nba but they seem to lose interest in their early 30s. and this trend has been going on awhile.

I remember him quite well. Stopped posting a couple years into my time on the board.

I feel like him now myself. Love talking about the glory days of Kobe/Nash/Dirk/Duncan/KG and then LeBron/Wade/CP3/Durant/Russ/Harden/Steph/Kawhi. Don't really have as much to contribute about modern players, just not as interested. Sometimes I wonder if after LeBron and Steph retire if there'll be anyone to keep my interest in the league at all besides Jokic.

[Dr Positivity]

Surprised there aren't more examples in sports of teams/people who had peak success early and then had heartbreaks/chokes afterwards like Rory Mcilroy's weird career arc, which would be like if the 2012 Thunder had won and then went on to blow 3-1 lead against Warriors, stayed and lost in the finals to the Cavs, etc. Rodgers would probably be one of the better examples, along with Brees and Wilson to an extent. The Yankees in mid 2000s had a drought, though perhaps like Mcilroy eventually, there will be happy ending. Roddick had his one major early although he was more outclassed talent wise than anything else later on. Likewise Pettit's Hawks went on to lose their following series, though they were more outgunned than choking.

[ardee]

Surprised there aren't more examples in sports of teams/people who had peak success early and then had heartbreaks/chokes afterwards like Rory Mcilroy's weird career arc, which would be like if the 2012 Thunder had won and then went on to blow 3-1 lead against Warriors, stayed and lost in the finals to the Cavs, etc. Rodgers would probably be one of the better examples, along with Brees and Wilson to an extent. The Yankees in mid 2000s had a drought, though perhaps like Mcilroy eventually, there will be happy ending. Roddick had his one major early although he was more outclassed talent wise than anything else later on. Likewise Pettit's Hawks went on to lose their following series, though they were more outgunned than choking.

I was gonna say Kaka in futbol, he allmost single-handedly leads AC Milan to a UCL in 2007, wins the Ballon D'Or and then a Copa America with Brazil that same summer. Then goes to Real Madrid a couple years later but gets injured a bunch and is washed up by 32.

That being said, seems different from your examples here because they're all actually healthy and kept playing, just couldn't get over the hump again.

Will think about this some more, but I think Rodgers is definitely the best example.

[Jaivl]

Surprised there aren't more examples in sports of teams/people who had peak success early and then had heartbreaks/chokes afterwards like Rory Mcilroy's weird career arc, which would be like if the 2012 Thunder had won and then went on to blow 3-1 lead against Warriors, stayed and lost in the finals to the Cavs, etc. Rodgers would probably be one of the better examples, along with Brees and Wilson to an extent. The Yankees in mid 2000s had a drought, though perhaps like Mcilroy eventually, there will be happy ending. Roddick had his one major early although he was more outclassed talent wise than anything else later on. Likewise Pettit's Hawks went on to lose their following series, though they were more outgunned than choking.

Lots of examples on athletics -- Julius Yego, Noah Ngeny, Nijel Amos, Yago Lamela, Bob Beamon himself (!), Michael Norman, Juan Miguel Echevarría (for now).

Weightlifting is full of examples due to the earlier peaking age. Adkhamjon Ergashev is a textbook one. Eileen Cikamatana, Andranik Karapetyan, basically every vietnamese lifter. Aramnau may count too.

Bojan Krkic on football... hell, basically every Barça homegrown star over the last decade.

[ronnymac2]

This was inevitable considering until last 10 years NBA players had beaten the odds in terms of mortality. I remember the stat that Moses (2015) was only the 2nd MVP to die after Wilt. The first two (Cousy and Pettit) are still alive.

In other sports one that surprised me is that Willie Mays is alive.

Welp...RIP Willie Mays.

[Goudelock]

This was inevitable considering until last 10 years NBA players had beaten the odds in terms of mortality. I remember the stat that Moses (2015) was only the 2nd MVP to die after Wilt. The first two (Cousy and Pettit) are still alive.

In other sports one that surprised me is that Willie Mays is alive.

Welp...RIP Willie Mays.

RIP to arguably the last living superstar of the 1950s in any area of American life.

It's a shame that he didn't get to see himself and the Negro Leagues be honored in his hometown, but Mays lived as full a life as one could live.

[ronnymac2]

you reminded me of a poster named jordan23forever. dude was super knowledgable about 90s ball and used to post all the time to defend MJ and discuss 90s ball in late 00s. But you could tell he really didn't care much about anything that was currently happening. and i've seen that with a lot of guys my age aging out of the nba.

Nobody - and I mean nobody - has ever used the better than J23F.

I remember he would "LOL" at some statement, then sometimes "Double LOL" at a second statement. But when he hit somebody with the ...game over.

[sp6r=underrated]

https://puck.news/stephen-a-smith-offered-18-million-a-year-by-espn/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=organic_social&utm_campaign=1&utm_content=stephen-a-smith-offered-18-million-a-year-by-espn

I just don't understand the business of tv. I don't understand why networks would pay any of these people these salaries. My assumption is folks like Buck, Aikman, SAS are much more like Tucker Carlson (ignore politics) when it comes to driving ratings than a huge star like Taylor Swift who audiences will follow.

But again I'm sure this is my ignorance. I do suspect if he gets his figures we will see even more cuts at ESPN as they follow the studs and duds model.

ESPN has been working hard to re-sign Smith, whose contract ends in a year; last week ESPN made its initial offer of $18 million per year for five years. I’m told ESPN execs pitched Smith’s WME agents that he would be their highest-paid star, earning more than Monday Night Football’s Troy Aikman or Joe Buck.

In many respects, ESPN has made Stephen A. the face of the network over the past several years, having him front NBA coverage in addition to First Take, his daily studio show, which has been on a ratings run, posting an incredible 22 consecutive months of audience gains. Last month, the show posted its most watched episode, a wild feat considering the distribution drop all networks have faced.

ESPN’s ultimate decision on Stephen A. will be fascinating, considering the network’s trimming of its high-priced talent in recent years. Smith has been a focal point of ESPN’s strategy to invest in a few stars, like Mike Greenberg, Scott Van Pelt, etcetera, and his appearances on different shows—First Take, SportsCenter, NBA Countdown—and provocative on-air statements have helped drive the conversations on other ESPN studio shows. Jimmy Pitaro and Burke Magnus have a choice to make: Does ESPN want to go higher than $18 million? After all, Smith is not driving viewers to the live games that pay ESPN’s bills. How much would First Take viewership really drop if Shannon Sharpe, who Smith personally recruited last August and who just signed a multiyear extension with ESPN, took his place? Is Smith truly a Maddow? What if he’s more like Tucker Carlson or Megyn Kelly—stars who never quite transcended the network that spawned their success?

ESPN should tread carefully. While Smith almost certainly wouldn’t jump to another TV network, there’s a big market for a bona fide star—including the streamers looking to break into sports, the gambling companies looking to stand out, and the satellite radio networks. One point that probably bears repeating: Stephen A. is represented by WME, the agency that convinced MSNBC to bump Maddow’s salary from $7 million to $30 million. Let’s see if they can work their same magic here.

[jalengreen]

https://puck.news/stephen-a-smith-offered-18-million-a-year-by-espn/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=organic_social&utm_campaign=1&utm_content=stephen-a-smith-offered-18-million-a-year-by-espn

I just don't understand the business of tv. I don't understand why networks would pay any of these people these salaries. My assumption is folks like Buck, Aikman, SAS are much more like Tucker Carlson (ignore politics) when it comes to driving ratings than a huge star like Taylor Swift who audiences will follow.

But again I'm sure this is my ignorance. I do suspect if he gets his figures we will see even more cuts at ESPN as they follow the studs and duds model.

ESPN has been working hard to re-sign Smith, whose contract ends in a year; last week ESPN made its initial offer of $18 million per year for five years. I’m told ESPN execs pitched Smith’s WME agents that he would be their highest-paid star, earning more than Monday Night Football’s Troy Aikman or Joe Buck.

In many respects, ESPN has made Stephen A. the face of the network over the past several years, having him front NBA coverage in addition to First Take, his daily studio show, which has been on a ratings run, posting an incredible 22 consecutive months of audience gains. Last month, the show posted its most watched episode, a wild feat considering the distribution drop all networks have faced.

ESPN’s ultimate decision on Stephen A. will be fascinating, considering the network’s trimming of its high-priced talent in recent years. Smith has been a focal point of ESPN’s strategy to invest in a few stars, like Mike Greenberg, Scott Van Pelt, etcetera, and his appearances on different shows—First Take, SportsCenter, NBA Countdown—and provocative on-air statements have helped drive the conversations on other ESPN studio shows. Jimmy Pitaro and Burke Magnus have a choice to make: Does ESPN want to go higher than $18 million? After all, Smith is not driving viewers to the live games that pay ESPN’s bills. How much would First Take viewership really drop if Shannon Sharpe, who Smith personally recruited last August and who just signed a multiyear extension with ESPN, took his place? Is Smith truly a Maddow? What if he’s more like Tucker Carlson or Megyn Kelly—stars who never quite transcended the network that spawned their success?

ESPN should tread carefully. While Smith almost certainly wouldn’t jump to another TV network, there’s a big market for a bona fide star—including the streamers looking to break into sports, the gambling companies looking to stand out, and the satellite radio networks. One point that probably bears repeating: Stephen A. is represented by WME, the agency that convinced MSNBC to bump Maddow’s salary from $7 million to $30 million. Let’s see if they can work their same magic here.

Well Buck and Aikman are commentators, feel like that’s different because AFAIK no one is tuning into a game because of a commentator. That’s why I really don’t understand the Brady mega contract he received; like, are they thinking that people will watch games they otherwise wouldn’t simply because of Brady commentating? I don’t buy it, but yeah could be my ignorance as well.

As far as SAS goes, honestly doesn’t really surprise me. Unlike commentators for whom the *sport* is the true show, if you tune in to First Take then SAS is the show. And there are other sports shows out there, but ESPN is the default, and SAS carrying them is a part of that. Lose him and all those barbershops, airports, etc might eventually choose a different channel, and that’s not something they can risk. But again, just spitballing; definitely a topic I’m ignorant on.

[jalengreen]

I’m ready to watch my first hockey game in years lol. Hope it’s an all-time end to an all-time comeback like 2016

[sp6r=underrated]

Well Buck and Aikman are commentators, feel like that’s different because AFAIK no one is tuning into a game because of a commentator. That’s why I really don’t understand the Brady mega contract he received

Announcing contracts are insane and the Brady one is pure madness. The best explanation I heard is that it was just billionaire bragging rights.

[Texas Chuck]

eh you might not tune into a game because of the commentator, but you might tune out with bad ones. As a Cowboys fan I'm spoiled because the Fox A team has basically been the Cowboys local broadcast going back to Madden/Summeral. And when they get a CBS game they always get Nance/Romo.

But sometimes they play a terrible team and you get the C or D team and its just brutally bad. So I get why they pay the top guys what they do. It's a huge, huge difference.

Also the ManningCast is the best sports experience on TV, no close 2nd. I know its a total production deal for Payton, but man they are worth what that costs. What a great way to watch a football game.

[eminence]

Anyone else following the US T&F Olympic qualifiers?

Crouser looking ready to cement his GOAT status.

Sha'Carri moving quickly.

Men's 100 team fully capable of sweeping.

I've got some hope for a men's 1500 medal.

And of course the Women's 800.

[Dr Positivity]

Watch on YouTube

People in the past just talked differently. It's pretty fascinating.

[OhayoKD]

Watch on YouTube

People in the past just talked differently. It's pretty fascinating.

I love to **** on boomers, but these guys sound about 100 times smarter than post-merger basketball dudes. Probably an unfair comaprison though considering

A. College-skipping
B. Socio-economic privelige played a much larger role in making the nba than it does now