The LeBron James - 21-22 Regular Season Thread - New Thread Soon Part 2

[Gooner]

There's always a trade if you're willing to take on money.

Porzingis + Bullock
Love + Sexton
Hield + Beasley + Pat Bev in a 3 way with Sac/Minn if Minnesota doesn't get Simmons are three possibilities that come to mind.

The first two make no sense for the receiving teams at all.

Mavs shed Porzingis a year early and they could use a secondary ball handler to Doncic. Its the same logic as LeBron wanting to play with another facilitator, except they have fewer spacing issues.

Cavs have no use for Love and he's actively disruptive for them, they aren't willing to pay Sexton. Its an exchange for salaries plus a useful player.

This is wishful thinking, nobody wants Westbrook. Porzingis and Love can atleast shoot the ball and they don't get in the way of anybody else.

[PistolPeteJR]

I don't get the point of playing with AD as the sole big and then having him spot up above the break.

Agreed would prefer him in the dunkers spot or on the baseline corner in that Russ/LeBron pick and roll

Their favourite play with Russ as a screener and LeBron running the PnR so far has been that when two go to LeBron, Russ gets the ball in the middle, drives it due to AD at the 5 and Melo (or another) in both corners, and typically they have AD on the weak side corner so that his man has to rotate and help off of him to prevent the Russ dunk; as soon as AD sees him commit, he's cutting and Russ is collecting the easy assist for the AD dunk.

It's a simple yet very effective play due to the threats involved.

[PistolPeteJR]

The reason the defense will not be top-tier this year is that especially with Russ, the team will commit far too many live-ball turnovers, and they don't have the young(er) personnel to run back on that end and be a decent transition-D team. This team will get destroyed in transition. In addition, they don't have the perimeter threats that will create sufficient opportunities to get out in transition themselves, which limits their transition game on O.

This is why guys like Caruso the last two years and so far a guy like Reeves are indispensable to the team, because, among other things they offer, they are younger legs that give more effort in transition on both ends. Reeves is not Caruso on D but he's decent, at least.

The Caruso loss is really bad for this squad.

[RSCD3_]

They are currently 25th in defensive rebounding and 30th in fouls on defense. This is an older team so I can’t see them not improving on that somewhat. I think they round out as a lower middle defensive team (14-21) range and if they can stay top 5 they’ll probably end up 45-51 wins. Lebron s jumper sample size not withstanding looks much better and when the playoffs come along Inassyme he’ll have more gas. This team rebounding badly imo is an aberration due to a lot of new moving pieces, as they’ve got a lot of good rebounders they just need to gel more

[falcolombardi]

peopke in the lebron vs jordan comparision thread were asking why lebron didnt cede offensive primacy and instead carry the cavs defensively if he was supposedly so flexible and versátile

which is kinda crazy to me that a) people think anythingh short of a great defensive big like mutombo or howard could carry that roster, b) people are assuming jordan could somehow by comparision, c) people are thinking that playing love or kyrie as first options somehow will get comparable results offensively

it sounds insane to me that the 15-17 cavs lebron is held to that Standard

[homecourtloss]

peopke in the lebron vs jordan comparision thread were asking why lebron didnt cede offensive primacy and instead carry the cavs defensively if he was supposedly so flexible and versátile

which is kinda crazy to me that a) people think anythingh short of a great defensive big like mutombo or howard could carry that roster, b) people are assuming jordan could somehow by comparision, c) people are thinking that playing love or kyrie as first options somehow will get comparable results offensively

it sounds insane to me that the 15-17 cavs lebron is held to that Standard

Those posters don’t argue in good faith, so it’s not worth anyone’s time to engage in a back and forth with them.

[sansterre]

peopke in the lebron vs jordan comparision thread were asking why lebron didnt cede offensive primacy and instead carry the cavs defensively if he was supposedly so flexible and versátile

which is kinda crazy to me that a) people think anythingh short of a great defensive big like mutombo or howard could carry that roster, b) people are assuming jordan could somehow by comparision, c) people are thinking that playing love or kyrie as first options somehow will get comparable results offensively

it sounds insane to me that the 15-17 cavs lebron is held to that Standard

That said, it's not unreasonable to use the weakness of the Cavs' defense as a counter to arguments about the Cavs' offense.

ie, A: "2017 LeBron is one of the greatest postseasons ever. Look at how historically dominant their offense was."

B: "It was historically dominant, but the team's defense was also unusually weak for a Finals team. To some extent, a lot of what made the '17 Cavs' offense so nuts was the way they were built, which was fairly offense-heavy. So we're sort of in SSoL territory, where you can't really talk about the historic offense without acknowledging that defense was, to some extent, sacrificed to get there."

[Texas Chuck]

peopke in the lebron vs jordan comparision thread were asking why lebron didnt cede offensive primacy and instead carry the cavs defensively if he was supposedly so flexible and versátile

which is kinda crazy to me that a) people think anythingh short of a great defensive big like mutombo or howard could carry that roster, b) people are assuming jordan could somehow by comparision, c) people are thinking that playing love or kyrie as first options somehow will get comparable results offensively

it sounds insane to me that the 15-17 cavs lebron is held to that Standard

That said, it's not unreasonable to use the weakness of the Cavs' defense as a counter to arguments about the Cavs' offense.

ie, A: "2017 LeBron is one of the greatest postseasons ever. Look at how historically dominant their offense was."

B: "It was historically dominant, but the team's defense was also unusually weak for a Finals team. To some extent, a lot of what made the '17 Cavs' offense so nuts was the way they were built, which was fairly offense-heavy. So we're sort of in SSoL territory, where you can't really talk about the historic offense without acknowledging that defense was, to some extent, sacrificed to get there."

Totally agree on this point. Roster construction was an issue for the Cavs. But for all the Lebron is the GM narrative, that's not up to him.

But its the question he asks at the beginning that still feels pertinent. While the Cavs could certainly have gotten better defensive results by having Lebron focus on that end first and rest more on offense counting on Kyrie to pick up the slack, I'm not at all convinced it would have led to better results. They went to 3 Finals and won a title while facing one of the most dominant teams of all time.

I think its probably simply a case of there wasn't a different way for Lebron to play that was going to lead to them taking 2 of 3 or sweeping the Warriors.

[McBubbles]

This is completely unrelated to anything, but to those of you who frequent / used to frequent Reddit NBA like myself, d'you remember after the 2018 Finals when the LeBron hate got so bad that a post unironically claiming that LeBron was the cause of Kevin Loves mental health issues got upvoted to the front page?

That, along with LeBron being blamed for the Game 1 loss and another massively upvoted and again unironic thread called "Jordan would have lost in 6", in which posters just shat on LeBron and sucked off Jordan were the factors that made me realize that mainstream basketball media maybe wasn't for me anymore. All it did was piss me the **** off and made me contemplate on how sports fandom/ coverage is in a lot of ways pseudo-religious lol.

[frica]

Sometimes I wonder if we're just missing things the GMs don't.
But this cast is really badly build no?

[dcstanley]

How many plus defenders on this roster? Lebron, AD, Ariza and Bazemore? Maybe Reaves and Nunn?

[thebigbird]

Vogel will still start him though.

Read on Twitter

?s=21

[trickshot]

peopke in the lebron vs jordan comparision thread were asking why lebron didnt cede offensive primacy and instead carry the cavs defensively if he was supposedly so flexible and versátile

which is kinda crazy to me that a) people think anythingh short of a great defensive big like mutombo or howard could carry that roster, b) people are assuming jordan could somehow by comparision, c) people are thinking that playing love or kyrie as first options somehow will get comparable results offensively

it sounds insane to me that the 15-17 cavs lebron is held to that Standard

That said, it's not unreasonable to use the weakness of the Cavs' defense as a counter to arguments about the Cavs' offense.

ie, A: "2017 LeBron is one of the greatest postseasons ever. Look at how historically dominant their offense was."

B: "It was historically dominant, but the team's defense was also unusually weak for a Finals team. To some extent, a lot of what made the '17 Cavs' offense so nuts was the way they were built, which was fairly offense-heavy. So we're sort of in SSoL territory, where you can't really talk about the historic offense without acknowledging that defense was, to some extent, sacrificed to get there."

I also thought the roster did away with defense but the same core had already won the previous year so it's kind of harsh to move them into inflated empty offense territory. Lebron isn't moving them to league average with any amount of effort and he most definitely isn't going to make them guard Warriors any better. Every other team sacrificed something to get where they were, Warriors didn't have to because of a salary anomaly. Without it the Cavs are facing the same offense they beat in 16 or the Harden and CP3 Rockets.

[Mos_Heat]

How many plus defenders on this roster? Lebron, AD, Ariza and Bazemore? Maybe Reaves and Nunn?

Ariza is not a plus defender for his position. Neutral at best. I think Nunn is decent for a guard, Reaves tbd

[nzahir]

Vogel will still start him though.

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Just pathetic, Vogel is the definition of insanity

I know our depth is weak, but even w/o DJ we have

Russ, Monk/Avery/Reaves, Bazemore, Bron, AD
Monk/Avery/Reaves, Melo, Dwight

We even have Rondo as a worst case, but no need to even play DJ rn

[nzahir]

How many plus defenders on this roster? Lebron, AD, Ariza and Bazemore? Maybe Reaves and Nunn?

Ariza is not a plus defender for his position. Neutral at best. I think Nunn is decent for a guard, Reaves tbd

All the numbers point to Ariza being a positive defender

He seems like a Danny Green type of guy now

Slower than he used to be, not a great man defender anymore, still serviceable though.

But a smart defender who makes high IQ plays, rotates well, and is in good position

Nunn's numbers are meh, a slight negative, but he is also a guard

I think he is fine for a guard

Lebron, AD, Ariza, and Bazemore are positives

Dwight is solid as a backup C, but needs to foul less. Also matchup dependent

Nunn is good enough

Reaves and THT are a bit of mysteries

THT was a good man defender, awful help defender. If he can fix that a bit, he will be a very solid overall defender with great physical tools

Reaves seems like a solid defender b/c of high iq, effort, and being in the right places. I would trust him

So those are 8 guys who are good enough come playoffs to positives imo

I would try to get at least another 3 and d guard/wing or a 4/5 who is a positive on D

[Slava]

Its 3 games, with one of Nunn or THT coming back, they'll have enough wings to go with AD at the 5 line ups. DeAndre isn't going to be in the starting line up or drawing significant minutes any longer than that. In fact, I could see him getting cut if a wing becomes available on the waiver wire as Bradley is suddenly proving to be useful.

[falcolombardi]

This is completely unrelated to anything, but to those of you who frequent / used to frequent Reddit NBA like myself, d'you remember after the 2018 Finals when the LeBron hate got so bad that a post unironically claiming that LeBron was the cause of Kevin Loves mental health issues got upvoted to the front page?

That, along with LeBron being blamed for the Game 1 loss and another massively upvoted and again unironic thread called "Jordan would have lost in 6", in which posters just shat on LeBron and sucked off Jordan were the factors that made me realize that mainstream basketball media maybe wasn't for me anymore. All it did was piss me the **** off and made me contemplate on how sports fandom/ coverage is in a lot of ways pseudo-religious lol.

no other league or sports, not even soccer has the ultra intense cult of personality/worship of star players

as well as the vcarious macho performance through players fandom

[trickshot]

That Lebron/Westbrook high PnR was fire though. Should be the hub of the offense. AD's poor passing makes him underwhelming in the high PnR, is way better in the low pnr where all he has to do is finish.

Has also been a bit surprising how little chemistry AD and Westbrook have started with. Was the one combination I thought would yield the highest points per possession while the others struggled to catch up. AD seems better with Rondo and also seems to fumble half of the passes Westbrook throws at him ('throw' being an understatement). Speaking of which they have to figure out the Rondo/Westbrook situation because Rondo likely won't be picking up DNPs in the playoffs.

[trickshot]

Vogel will still start him though.

Read on Twitter

?s=21

Just pathetic, Vogel is the definition of insanity

I know our depth is weak, but even w/o DJ we have

Russ, Monk/Avery/Reaves, Bazemore, Bron, AD
Monk/Avery/Reaves, Melo, Dwight

We even have Rondo as a worst case, but no need to even play DJ rn

Jordan was most likely promised minutes. He left the Nets for playing time, he would have sought assurances from whomever he signed with, in this case the Lakers. So I'll say it once again, what a foolish signing. Lob threat my foot, notice the playmakers throw his "lobs" under the rim where he (and his defender) can reach. Will be so easy to guard in the playoffs, he can no longer reach lobs with arc on them. You had better start looking for a replacement starting now.