The LeBron James - 21-22 Regular Season Thread - New Thread Soon Part 2

[McBubbles]

Also **** Westbrook. I've never liked him but I'm now in hater territory. Lowest BBIQ MVP in NBA history and it's not even close. He just doesn't care about winning, and I know it's easy to say that and just lazily go "hmph, player haz gud statz but no rangz? Obviously doesn't care about winning, stad padder " but seriously.

Dude loses important back to back games because of his clutch time BS, nearly loses a 3rd one, and his response is "I think I've been fine, people are expecting to get 25/15/15 but it's not easy bro " like **** what? Do you not see the game beyond the box score? Dude is completely unaware of his flaws or how to play winning basketball and it comes straight from his mouth. No inference required.

Hell, a few years ago, I think it was in 2019, he just straight up admitted he doesn't watch tape... How in the mother of **** god, could the most inefficient player in the league (volume adjusted) who was also leading the league in turnovers, just admit they don't watch tape, and not consider that problematic? Not lose any sleep over it at all? Just not care?

Imagine Simmons, Lebron or Giannis admitting they just don't practice their shooting. Imagine Embiid saying he just doesn't do his injury rehab, or Luka, Jokic or Zion just straight up admitting they don't give a **** about their diet. A blatantly open admission that they just don't care about self improvement or winning. Westbrook does it and it's never brought up, because the bar is set so low for him that him playing hard (not really) is all people ask

Funny thing is, I think that Westbrook believes that he cares about winning, but is just too dumb to and lacking in self awareness to realise that's not the case.

[Heej]

Yeah it's hard for me to take LeBron's stats seriously when he's playing the 5. It's just inflating his offensive numbers at the expense of legitimate defense.

Don't see it as inflating his offensive numbers. With two of Westbrook, THT, and Stanley Johnson often on the floor, these lineups aren't really providing as much spacing as you'd expect with an uber small ball lineup.

Fair point. I'm just trying to think of how sustainable this is next to AD. He's a god awful shooter too but it feels like LeBron's getting a lot more space to work with than he will later in the season and his numbers will come back down to earth

[falcolombardi]

the only way this rosters works in the playoffs is if davis becomes 2020 davis again and also starts hitting his jumpers at a good clip

dont see any other way to fix the team defense/spacing issues (one or the other is doable but not both with this roster construction)

[nzahir]

Went to my 1st game of the year and here is a recap from what I saw:

The good:
Even with an okay shooting night, Lebron was still pretty good and is able to control the pace and set guys up so well

Monk has a good connection with Lebron. If he cut down a bit on some dumb shots, he would be a lot better off.

Melo and Avery were hitting there shots, big difference for our vets when we get rest

Cons:

Vogel is legit a moron (but somehow Fizdale is even worse)

Reid was killing us down there and he made no adjustments. Dwight should have been in after a few of those offensive boards or easy post ups

Russ was a DISASTER.

He had 9 TOs (was 10 earlier) and he caused two more iirc. Many were clearly awful ideas or just carelessness.

That is legit giving up at least 10-20 points from just being dumb

You can't depend on a guy like this and I had no idea why they went away from the Lebron and Russ pick and roll

THT is such a bad fit, needs to go if we are keeping Russ.

There was a play when Lebron drove late in the 4th and there were legit 7-8 bodies in the paint

Other thoughts:

Stanley Johnson is meh, gives effort and is at least a taller body, but can't shoot well. Don't mind keeping him for depth if no other option, but should try to get an upgrade

No idea why Ariza only played 12 min

At least we won, but we should be dominating these teams

Some good takeaways.

- Russ was horrid tonight. I usually defend the guy but this game was bad.
- Vogel is fine. He is intentionally keeping it small to make sure the the learns to play through struggles and work harder on rebounds.
- THT was good tonight I thought, he waa.hustling hard. His shot sucks but he was doing some good things. I would be keen to see THT or Russ moved though.
- Johnson is very limited offensively but a great defender and hustle player. I think he will work really well with big 3 though because he is low usage on offense butnworks hard everywhere else.

It isn't fine for a coach to make no adjustments

If our C rotation should be AD and then Bron, shouldn't Dwight be replacing AD rn, not Melo...

Dwight should still even play at times with AD back depending on the match up

Can't have Lebron guarding Jokic and Embiid

Lot of pressure on a 37 year old Lebron who also carries the offensive load (even with a cancer turning the ball over 5-10 times a night and giving the other team way more possessions)

The issue is Johnson will be wide open and the defender will pack the paint and he will miss shots

He can play in certain matchups, or lineups, but not with the big 3, need spacing

This is the issue with our big 3

[MisterHibachi]

Given how beneficial Russ has been to LeBron's scoring, I think about a potential LeBron/CP pairing once every week. The Lakers probably could've got CP for much less from OKC than they gave up for Russ, if only they decided to go that route a year earlier.

What a shame.

[trickshot]

Wouldn't be too quick to pin the gimmick ball on Vogel. Look at his history right from those pacer days, he has always loved size and length even where it didn't make sense. Lakers in 20 didn't even play a small lineup till the rockets series. It's not in his coaching history to concede size, rebounding advantage and have the paint gaping. I feel this was out of his hands and in the hands of whoever brought fizdale.

Think was part of some grand scheme to make the westbrook thing effective but it's not smart play against everyone. It didn't even help him last night, one of his worse performances. Don't sacrifice basics for no guaranteed returns.

[Heej]

Given how beneficial Russ has been to LeBron's scoring, I think about a potential LeBron/CP pairing once every week. The Lakers probably could've got CP for much less from OKC than they gave up for Russ, if only they decided to go that route a year earlier.

What a shame.

Yeah this sucks to think about. They would've extended eachothers careers marvelously. Could've been some kind of supercharged Stockton-Malone combo man. But seriously, people hate on Westbrook in this thread but as I'm catching up on these games the one guy I can't stand the most is THT. Feels like him being a complete non-factor in the playoffs last year should've been the litmus test needed to dump his ass.

[McBubbles]

Russell Westbrook: "I disagree with the point that the game wasn't going my way. My game is not predicated on shots or if I turn the ball over. If I miss some shots, that's part of the game. I'm allowed to miss shots. I can do that. I can turn the ball over too. That's all a part of the game."

Dis dood

[McBubbles]

I think I've been overestimating / overrating Frank Vogel thus far. He's an elite defensive coach and that's literally it. He's bad at everything else. Offence, XO's, adjustments, and leadership (as evidenced by the teams effort woes imo).

He was asked why he didn't put Dwight or DJ in despite their rebounding struggles and he said and I quote "If we're gonna play this style [micro-ball] it's an area we have to learn to be better".

Ignoring the fact that implicit in his statement is the admission that this gimmicky bull **** is going to be a main stay going forward, which is awful, there's no **** "learning" about anything.

Why in the ****, would you put the now injury prone, league leader in minutes having, 37 year old Lebron James who in the past 4 years has missed 71 games, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Why in the ****, would you put a 37 year old Melo, who was never known for his conditioning or putting in effort on defence anyway, and is currently was so washed on that side of the ball that he's going to be a walking L come playoff time, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Is this dude trying to get fired? You can't out "learn" being 37 years old and in your 19th season, what the **** ****? The 7'1 Kareem didn't even put max effort on defence at 37 but you expect the undersized LeBron or Melo to? Lmao.

****, you make accomodations for AD, a 28 year old, 6'11 man when he doesn't want to play center, but just tell Lebron to stfu and suit up

Lebron's 100% gonna get injured again at this rate.

Isn't this exactly what Houston did when they got Westbrook? They even traded a really good center for Covington in the process. They lost the rebounding and turnover battles as well, spammed more 3s while shooting a slightly better % and survived on elite iso scoring to post a positive point differential. Harden had to guard 4s to keep him engaged.

Vogel is doing the same thing with the best switchable defenders he has to put around LeBron and Russ.

Maybe throw Westbrook on centers and lure them to post ups, hoping Westbrook's strength can hold up?

Makes James Harden 7 years older, play him at the 5 and make his defensive supporting cast infinitely worse in terms of both ability and effort. Then it'd be the same lol.

And why would you throw centers on Westbrook? Him getting annihilated in the post aside, he gets back door cut a million times a game. He'd just get alley oop'd to death. His stamina also isn't that great so his already unimpressive offence would tank.

[trickshot]

I think I've been overestimating / overrating Frank Vogel thus far. He's an elite defensive coach and that's literally it. He's bad at everything else. Offence, XO's, adjustments, and leadership (as evidenced by the teams effort woes imo).

He was asked why he didn't put Dwight or DJ in despite their rebounding struggles and he said and I quote "If we're gonna play this style [micro-ball] it's an area we have to learn to be better".

Ignoring the fact that implicit in his statement is the admission that this gimmicky bull **** is going to be a main stay going forward, which is awful, there's no **** "learning" about anything.

Why in the ****, would you put the now injury prone, league leader in minutes having, 37 year old Lebron James who in the past 4 years has missed 71 games, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Why in the ****, would you put a 37 year old Melo, who was never known for his conditioning or putting in effort on defence anyway, and is currently was so washed on that side of the ball that he's going to be a walking L come playoff time, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Is this dude trying to get fired? You can't out "learn" being 37 years old and in your 19th season, what the **** ****? The 7'1 Kareem didn't even put max effort on defence at 37 but you expect the undersized LeBron or Melo to? Lmao.

****, you make accomodations for AD, a 28 year old, 6'11 man when he doesn't want to play center, but just tell Lebron to stfu and suit up

Lebron's 100% gonna get injured again at this rate.

Isn't this exactly what Houston did when they got Westbrook? They even traded a really good center for Covington in the process. They lost the rebounding and turnover battles as well, spammed more 3s while shooting a slightly better % and survived on elite iso scoring to post a positive point differential. Harden had to guard 4s to keep him engaged.

Vogel is doing the same thing with the best switchable defenders he has to put around LeBron and Russ.

Maybe throw Westbrook on centers and lure them to post ups, hoping Westbrook's strength can hold up?

Right on, people say Westbrook's performances in the 2nd half had nothing to do with Capela, maybe, maybe not but that doesn't really affect the idea the front office were after. They wanted to open up the floor and boy did it backfire when they were left with AD shooting what was basically wide open jumpers over Tucker. Had salt poured in the wound when you conceded WB the open floor and he somehow got worse. It will get exposed, I already saw Lebron last night looking fresh out of a gangbang and this is despite how he only really played hard towards the end. So dear playoff teams stop putting Westbrook in microball. OKC had it better using Ibaka and Adams but I guess everyone was better back then. Maybe the real advice is to stop trading for the guy.

[Slava]

I think I've been overestimating / overrating Frank Vogel thus far. He's an elite defensive coach and that's literally it. He's bad at everything else. Offence, XO's, adjustments, and leadership (as evidenced by the teams effort woes imo).

He was asked why he didn't put Dwight or DJ in despite their rebounding struggles and he said and I quote "If we're gonna play this style [micro-ball] it's an area we have to learn to be better".

Ignoring the fact that implicit in his statement is the admission that this gimmicky bull **** is going to be a main stay going forward, which is awful, there's no **** "learning" about anything.

Why in the ****, would you put the now injury prone, league leader in minutes having, 37 year old Lebron James who in the past 4 years has missed 71 games, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Why in the ****, would you put a 37 year old Melo, who was never known for his conditioning or putting in effort on defence anyway, and is currently was so washed on that side of the ball that he's going to be a walking L come playoff time, in the most important defensive position in basketball, that's also the biggest hustle position in basketball, and the most contact heavy / injury prone position in basketball?

Is this dude trying to get fired? You can't out "learn" being 37 years old and in your 19th season, what the **** ****? The 7'1 Kareem didn't even put max effort on defence at 37 but you expect the undersized LeBron or Melo to? Lmao.

****, you make accomodations for AD, a 28 year old, 6'11 man when he doesn't want to play center, but just tell Lebron to stfu and suit up

Lebron's 100% gonna get injured again at this rate.

Isn't this exactly what Houston did when they got Westbrook? They even traded a really good center for Covington in the process. They lost the rebounding and turnover battles as well, spammed more 3s while shooting a slightly better % and survived on elite iso scoring to post a positive point differential. Harden had to guard 4s to keep him engaged.

Vogel is doing the same thing with the best switchable defenders he has to put around LeBron and Russ.

Maybe throw Westbrook on centers and lure them to post ups, hoping Westbrook's strength can hold up?

Makes James Harden 7 years older, play him at the 5 and make his defensive supporting cast infinitely worse in terms of both ability and effort. Then it'd be the same lol.

And why would you throw centers on Westbrook? Him getting annihilated in the post aside, he gets back door cut a million times a game. He'd just get alley oop'd to death. His stamina also isn't that great so his already unimpressive offence would tank.

Other than playing help defence and offering rim protection, LeBron doesn't really do the center grunt work either. Its either Stanley Johnson or Ariza drawing the opposing center assignment. I think its a better way to use LeBron as he communicates coverages a lot more effectively from that position and it saves legs a lot more than making perimeter rotations or fighting over screens for a larger part of the game.

[MisterHibachi]

Read on Twitter

Are they not resigning Stanley?

[MisterHibachi]

Given how beneficial Russ has been to LeBron's scoring, I think about a potential LeBron/CP pairing once every week. The Lakers probably could've got CP for much less from OKC than they gave up for Russ, if only they decided to go that route a year earlier.

What a shame.

Yeah this sucks to think about. They would've extended eachothers careers marvelously. Could've been some kind of supercharged Stockton-Malone combo man. But seriously, people hate on Westbrook in this thread but as I'm catching up on these games the one guy I can't stand the most is THT. Feels like him being a complete non-factor in the playoffs last year should've been the litmus test needed to dump his ass.

Agreed on THT. Someone in this thread earlier said he's the only second round pick who plays with such little energy, and it's so true. He doesn't seem to have that fire that second round picks looking to secure their place in the league have. The Lakers might have paid him too early.

[Fadeaway_J]

Read on Twitter

Are they not resigning Stanley?

That would be the cherry on top of the sundae of stupidity this front office has served up since last offseason.

[PistolPeteJR]

They’re trying to resign Johnson.

[thebigbird]

Wtf are they waiting for with Stanley Johnson?? Signing him is a no brainer but they let him hit the free agency waters. I’m sure they’re nickel and diming it and trying to save a few bucks by signing him a day later or something stupid like that. Just not a serious organization at all.

[Heej]

Wtf are they waiting for with Stanley Johnson?? Signing him is a no brainer but they let him hit the free agency waters. I’m sure they’re nickel and diming it and trying to save a few bucks by signing him a day later or something stupid like that. Just not a serious organization at all.

It's a glamour franchise run like a 2-bit mom and pop shop. Pathetic

[Ballerhogger]

Wtf are they waiting for with Stanley Johnson?? Signing him is a no brainer but they let him hit the free agency waters. I’m sure they’re nickel and diming it and trying to save a few bucks by signing him a day later or something stupid like that. Just not a serious organization at all.

I don’t get either… we need him lol

[thebigbird]

Wtf are they waiting for with Stanley Johnson?? Signing him is a no brainer but they let him hit the free agency waters. I’m sure they’re nickel and diming it and trying to save a few bucks by signing him a day later or something stupid like that. Just not a serious organization at all.

It's a glamour franchise run like a 2-bit mom and pop shop. Pathetic

They’re so bad that they actually make me miss Dan Gilbert. He had his own issues, but he wasn’t afraid to spend money. He would’ve resigned Caruso without giving it a second thought. Meanwhile Jeanie is probably telling the guys to shower with cold water to save on the electric bill.

[trickshot]

and Ariza has performed decently, by the ye test positive impact even but it's clear it was definitely foolish to wait for his return. He looks like a decent fringe player, shocker right? that's what he already was last season. If the plan was to let him be the lone wing I swear I can see why fans hate their front office.