2019-20 NBA Season Discussion

Post #341 » by **Clyde Frazier** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 5:23 am

Colbinii wrote:A Ruling I have never seen before.

Giannis has the ball right before the end of the first half and runs the length of the court and attempts a lay-up. Refs rule that he did not shoot the ball before the game clock. The Refs then change it to a foul on Giannis with 0.2 seconds left; Minnesota Ball. Milwaukee challenges and since the foul occured at 0.2 seconds but Continuation rules that the basket counts for Giannis even though it was after the clock expired.

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GSP · Post #342 » by **GSP** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 5:47 am

Joey Wheeler wrote:The Suns will be a good team this year, defo have a chance at making the playoffs if things go well for them. Ricky Rubio is a great player and the ideal point guard, the right guy to take the most out of this young cast. If Booker and especially Rubio stay fit, I think at least 45 wins are possible, which probably won't be enough to make playoffs in the West but still a good season.

Rubio hasnt been the biggest difference for them. Its been Baynes..........Hes posting stupid advanced numbers so far

theres 0 chance Suns end up anywhere in the vicinity of a top 10 offense this season and theyve been firmly in that all season so far

GSP · Post #343 » by **GSP** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 5:53 am

Warriors might have something with Paschall. Their other young players play like ass tho

Dr Spaceman · Post #344 » by **Dr Spaceman** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 11:12 am

Fadeaway_J wrote:The quality of Houston's defensive personnel has deteriorated so badly over the last couple of years. That 2017-18 team had CP3, Tucker, Ariza, Mbah a Moute... I'm struggling to see how this current group is going to stop anyone on a consistent basis.

Ariza is done now anyway but losing him was huge. It made Tucker their really only option to guard star forwards and this means he’s unable to really contribute in helpside or on the glass. Capela doesn’t take his conditioning seriously after the extension either.

Paul is the biggest loss though. I know he drove everyone crazy but him being out there barking and blowing up screens was a big part of what made them so good.

E-Balla · Post #345 » by **E-Balla** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 1:37 pm

Colbinii wrote:
Dr Spaceman wrote:
E-Balla wrote:Rubio and Favors are both good offensive players. However much they improved it's not much, and the defense will take a hit. Mitchell's improvement will be the real change IMO.

Favors is an efficient finisher and he boards well but are you really saying you don’t think Bojan is a HUGE upgrade over him?

2019 ORPM
Bog: 1.19
Favors: -.49

2019 OBPM:
Bog: 1.4
Favors: 1.1

I personally think Bog is a huge upgrade over Favors. I think Bog will be a great guy defensively against Kawhi, James, George (bigger Wings). Offensively he should be a huge upgrade.

As for Conley he needs time to adjust. Utah runs most of their action out of the wings and in Memphis that wasn't the case.

Huge upgrade? No. Definitely an upgrade but I don't think Bojan is that good offensively. He's above average on both ends which makes him good but his spacing advantage will be offset by the fact that Utah no longer has an above average offensive backup C.

Dr Spaceman · Post #346 » by **Dr Spaceman** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 1:38 pm

E-Balla wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
Dr Spaceman wrote:
Favors is an efficient finisher and he boards well but are you really saying you don’t think Bojan is a HUGE upgrade over him?

2019 ORPM
Bog: 1.19
Favors: -.49

2019 OBPM:
Bog: 1.4
Favors: 1.1

I personally think Bog is a huge upgrade over Favors. I think Bog will be a great guy defensively against Kawhi, James, George (bigger Wings). Offensively he should be a huge upgrade.

As for Conley he needs time to adjust. Utah runs most of their action out of the wings and in Memphis that wasn't the case.

Huge upgrade? No. Definitely an upgrade but I don't think Bojan is that good offensively. He's above average on both ends which makes him good but his spacing advantage will be offset by the fact that Utah no longer has an above average offensive backup C.

He’s averaging 18 points on 65% True shooting right now. His advantage is way more than just spacing, he is a bonafide secondary scoring option.

E-Balla · Post #347 » by **E-Balla** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 2:48 pm

GSP wrote:
Joey Wheeler wrote:The Suns will be a good team this year, defo have a chance at making the playoffs if things go well for them. Ricky Rubio is a great player and the ideal point guard, the right guy to take the most out of this young cast. If Booker and especially Rubio stay fit, I think at least 45 wins are possible, which probably won't be enough to make playoffs in the West but still a good season.

Rubio hasnt been the biggest difference for them. Its been Baynes..........Hes posting stupid advanced numbers so far

theres 0 chance Suns end up anywhere in the vicinity of a top 10 offense this season and theyve been firmly in that all season so far

Their top 5 defense is a bigger deal to me. I can see them being a top 10 offense.

E-Balla · Post #348 » by **E-Balla** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 2:49 pm

Dr Spaceman wrote:
E-Balla wrote:
Colbinii wrote:
2019 ORPM
Bog: 1.19
Favors: -.49

2019 OBPM:
Bog: 1.4
Favors: 1.1

I personally think Bog is a huge upgrade over Favors. I think Bog will be a great guy defensively against Kawhi, James, George (bigger Wings). Offensively he should be a huge upgrade.

As for Conley he needs time to adjust. Utah runs most of their action out of the wings and in Memphis that wasn't the case.

Huge upgrade? No. Definitely an upgrade but I don't think Bojan is that good offensively. He's above average on both ends which makes him good but his spacing advantage will be offset by the fact that Utah no longer has an above average offensive backup C.

He’s averaging 18 points on 65% True shooting right now. His advantage is way more than just spacing, he is a bonafide secondary scoring option.

7 games.

Dr Spaceman · Post #349 » by **Dr Spaceman** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 3:27 pm

E-Balla wrote:
Dr Spaceman wrote:
E-Balla wrote:Huge upgrade? No. Definitely an upgrade but I don't think Bojan is that good offensively. He's above average on both ends which makes him good but his spacing advantage will be offset by the fact that Utah no longer has an above average offensive backup C.

He’s averaging 18 points on 65% True shooting right now. His advantage is way more than just spacing, he is a bonafide secondary scoring option.

7 games.

Last year he was 20 PPG on 60+ true shooting and was the #1 scoring option on a playoff team without Dipo. The dude is just good.

yoyoboy · Post #350 » by **yoyoboy** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 4:02 pm

Harden + Westbrook ON:
131 minutes
108.2 ORTG
117.9 DRTG
-9.7 Net

Harden ON + Westbrook OFF:
118 minutes
109.4 ORTG
105.8 DRTG
+3.6 Net

Westbrook ON + Harden OFF:
69 minutes
105.9 ORTG
123.2 DRTG
-17.3 Net

Early results are less than encouraging for Houston...

therealbig3 · Post #351 » by **therealbig3** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 4:27 pm

Westbrook and Harden just screamed "awful fit" from the very beginning. Never been a big fan of Westbrook, think he puts a very clear ceiling on what a team can ultimately achieve, and he's a low IQ player imo, but obviously he's still great and he fills up a stat sheet like no other. But even decrepit Paul just runs a smoother offense than Westbrook.

E-Balla · Post #352 » by **E-Balla** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 4:37 pm

Dr Spaceman wrote:
E-Balla wrote:
Dr Spaceman wrote:
He’s averaging 18 points on 65% True shooting right now. His advantage is way more than just spacing, he is a bonafide secondary scoring option.

7 games.

Last year he was 20 PPG on 60+ true shooting and was the #1 scoring option on a playoff team without Dipo. The dude is just good.

He is, but he's not THAT good. They might be borderline top 10. To me it'll depend on Mitchell.

Dr Spaceman · Post #353 » by **Dr Spaceman** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 5:52 pm

yoyoboy wrote:Harden + Westbrook ON:
131 minutes
108.2 ORTG
117.9 DRTG
-9.7 Net

Harden ON + Westbrook OFF:
118 minutes
109.4 ORTG
105.8 DRTG
+3.6 Net

Westbrook ON + Harden OFF:
69 minutes
105.9 ORTG
123.2 DRTG
-17.3 Net

Early results are less than encouraging for Houston...

I wonder what happens when you filter out Eric Gordon.

This isn’t in jest. He is straight up the worst player in the NBA right now, -9.4 BPM. As a guy they depend on a ton for his offense, I’m not surprised the offense is looking like crap. And of course Harden has struggled a lot shooting the ball.

I’m not all that worried about Houston. They will have a top 3 offense by seasons end IMO and the defense... well, it can’t get worse. They are #1 by a mile allowing opponents to shoot 44% on threes which is a mathematical impossibility. They won’t be historically bad, just bad.

AdagioPace · Post #354 » by **AdagioPace** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 6:06 pm

it's funny how Harden's and Westbrook's worst parts have been additive

from the beginning while their best traits need careful weighting every single minute (entropy is a real thing)! I remember that somebody during the off-season was talking about a possible "low floor" for the Rockets....While the offense has looked good (by virtue of "brute talent") the rest is highly combustible and I don't think there's a solution.

eminence · Post #355 » by **eminence** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 6:10 pm

RW+JH+EG 107.9 in 54 minutes
RW+JH-EG 108.5 in 77 minutes
RW+EG-JH 104.3 in 58 minutes
RW-JH-EG 114.8 in 11 minutes
JH+EG-RW 105.6 in 90 minutes
JH-RW-EG 121.3 in 28 minutes
EG-RW-JH 109.5 in 11 minutes
None 128.6 in 10 minutes

All from NBAwowy (tend to be a bit lower than Bbref I've found). Not great imo that both Harden/Westbrook seem to be having more success alone than with one another (though obviously very early). Hints at a lower playoff ceiling.

Dr Spaceman · Post #356 » by **Dr Spaceman** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 6:31 pm

AdagioPace wrote:it's funny how Harden's and Westbrook's worst parts have been additive from the beginning while their best traits need careful weighting every single minute (entropy is a real thing)! I remember that somebody during the off-season was talking about a possible "low floor" for the Rockets....While the offense has looked good (by virtue of "brute talent") the rest is highly combustible and I don't think there's a solution.

I don’t agree they have a low floor. Harden by himself putting up 40-50 surrounded by a bunch of dudes is enough to win 50 games. The only way IMO they drop out of playoff contention is an actual injury to Harden because he can just volume score like nobody else. I think if Harden was on the Warriors this year they could make the playoffs.

GSP · Post #357 » by **GSP** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 8:46 pm

E-Balla wrote:
GSP wrote:
Joey Wheeler wrote:The Suns will be a good team this year, defo have a chance at making the playoffs if things go well for them. Ricky Rubio is a great player and the ideal point guard, the right guy to take the most out of this young cast. If Booker and especially Rubio stay fit, I think at least 45 wins are possible, which probably won't be enough to make playoffs in the West but still a good season.

Rubio hasnt been the biggest difference for them. Its been Baynes..........Hes posting stupid advanced numbers so far

theres 0 chance Suns end up anywhere in the vicinity of a top 10 offense this season and theyve been firmly in that all season so far

Their top 5 defense is a bigger deal to me. I can see them being a top 10 offense.

I see it the other way. I can see them being a top 10 defense

Rubio, Baynes, Oubre, Bridges, Tyler, Carter are all plus to strong defenders. If Aytons game 1 performance wasnt a mirage they could be really good on that end. Saric and Booker havent been horrible in their schemes either. Kamisky sucks tho

I dont buy their offensive efficiency at all, efg, 3pt, overall passing too namely from Baynes and Booker now too. Teams will get much better defending them as the season goes. Right now Baynes is screening the **** out of everyone and getting the perimeter players wide open spots to create from the elbows, as well as him facilitating and stretching the floor at an absurd level hes never shown

clyde21 · Post #358 » by **clyde21** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 9:43 pm

top 3 MVPs so far for me

1. KAT
2. Giannis
3. Kyrie

i expect Kyrie to fade by game 30 tho per usual.

MisterHibachi · Post #359 » by **MisterHibachi** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 9:46 pm

clyde21 wrote:top 3 MVPs so far for me

1. KAT
2. Giannis
3. Kyrie

i expect Kyrie to fade by game 30 tho per usual.

Brooklyn is under .500 right now. How is Kyrie in the top 3?

clyde21 · Post #360 » by **clyde21** » Tue Nov 5, 2019 11:28 pm

MisterHibachi wrote:
clyde21 wrote:top 3 MVPs so far for me

1. KAT
2. Giannis
3. Kyrie

i expect Kyrie to fade by game 30 tho per usual.

Brooklyn is under .500 right now. How is Kyrie in the top 3?

good point, remove Kyrie and put Doncic at 3