The Lebron Thread | 2021 & Offseason

[Larry David]

Watched Shroeder all season and he was amazing

[yoyoboy]

Green was dealing with an achilles injury in the playoffs and he’s entering a contract year now. Even if the playoffs are what we can expecting from him going forward, it’s no coincidence the team still performed so well in the Green minutes despite his shooting struggles. He just plays the right way and his team defense and gravity were crucial components that’ll be missed.

Unless the Lakers can get a wing who gives the Lakers 80% of what Green did then it’s not as bad, but that remains to be seen. Hopefully the FO did it because they have a plan.

[trickshot]

I don’t get all the Danny Green love. He’s an aging wing who frankly has been a pretty average 3p shooter for the past 5 years save for the one year in Toronto, and that’s all he adds on the offensive end. A floor spacer who quietly has been living off reputation for a while, and he has been prone to some brutal slumps as we saw in the postseason. They may miss him some on the defensive end but it’s not going to move the needle. Schroeder is just hands down a better player and fills a need for a secondary ball handler when Lebron needs a blow

People want to keep the band together but yeah Green's positive impact can be replaced. His postseason shooting slumps are becoming too frequent and his defense as good as it was still had Lebron and AD having to take guards like Murray and Butler when it counted. It's his team defense that's fantastic. He also got bodied by stronger wings. At 15m the decision becomes an easy one because his utility as a roleplayer was getting narrower with age. At some points in the Houston series Lebron was hesitant to keep feeding him which says a lot as Lebron never ignores the open man. Screwing up 3 on 1 fastbreaks must have been the icing on the cake for someone upstairs.

He's on a physical decline and the Lakers have done well to move him before it became any clearer to the league how shot he really is. Probably did him a favour too as his kids no longer have to see his name trending on twitter everytime the Lakers play

[Cavsfansince84]

Green was dealing with an achilles injury in the playoffs and he’s entering a contract year now. Even if the playoffs are what we can expecting from him going forward, it’s no coincidence the team still performed so well in the Green minutes despite his shooting struggles. He just plays the right way and his team defense and gravity were crucial components that’ll be missed.

Unless the Lakers can get a wing who gives the Lakers 80% of what Green did then it’s not as bad, but that remains to be seen. Hopefully the FO did it because they have a plan.

I think at the end of the day DG was one small part of why the Lakers won the title. Everyone not named Lebron or AD can be replaced. That's one of LeBron's best attributes tbh. No one thought much of Dwight, Rondo or some of those other guys before last season either. LeBron, Vogel and AD brought out the best in those guys though. That's the true strength of the team right there. It was the same way in 2018 when the Cavs flushed their roster for a bunch of riff raff and they still went to the finals.

[LikeABosh]

Is Kuzma safe to you guys?

Probably. Re-signing AD, KCP, and using the MLE will put the Lakers dangerously close to the absolute hard cap. At that point, the Lakers can't afford to bundle him with filler to get a better player because they simply won't have any space to fill out the roster (not even with minimum contracts)

The way I see it, the only possible trade for him is for another cheap contract player. I don't even know who that would be

[dreamshake]

The more I think about the Schroeder trade, the more I like it. He fills the secondary ballhandling/playmaking role they needed, shouldn't hurt their defensive identity, and shoots well enough not to compromise spacing.

I know they probably still have Bradley and are likely going to find another SG option (Matthews?), but maybe part of the thought process of moving Danny was to clear a path for more THT minutes. He looked great in the minutes he got in the playoffs and I'd love to see more. Developing him into a legit rotation piece on a cheap rookie deal would really help open up financial flexibility going forward.

And lastly, it means the idea of a DeRozan trade is over, which is a big relief. Hated that idea.

[Fadeaway_J]

The more I think about the Schroeder trade, the more I like it. He fills the secondary ballhandling/playmaking role they needed, shouldn't hurt their defensive identity, and shoots well enough not to compromise spacing.

I know they probably still have Bradley and are likely going to find another SG option (Matthews?), but maybe part of the thought process of moving Danny was to clear a path for more THT minutes. He looked great in the minutes he got in the playoffs and I'd love to see more. Developing him into a legit rotation piece on a cheap rookie deal would really help open up financial flexibility going forward.

And lastly, it means the idea of a DeRozan trade is over, which is a big relief. Hated that idea.

Yeah, I've come around to this view.

Rondo's improvement in the playoffs shouldn't obscure what an open sore the backup PG spot was for most of the season. I really feel like they needed to upgrade there to relieve some pressure on LeBron, and that's even more true in what's going to be a compressed regular season. Green has a desirable skill set but you'd think KCP, Bradley, Caruso, and someone like Matthews should be able to cover his production, and that's assuming he wasn't just heading for terminal decline.

[LikeABosh]

Am I the only one who would prefer re-signing Morris for cheap than Ibaka for the Full MLE?

[Firebird1]

LeBron needs MORE help! LMAO. In all seriousness though, they will regret losing Rondo. He was a legit secondary facilitator to helping buoy the offense. I'm not sure if Schroder can make a similiar or even greater impact compared to Rondo's play this postseason. I think the Lakers will get worse. Although things may change and new discoveries are bound to happen later on that may change viewpoints. Losing Green is a small loss too. He brings you defense and 3. I think the Lakers will get worse next season across the board.

[The Master]

Am I the only one who would prefer re-signing Morris for cheap than Ibaka for the Full MLE?

I don't think Kieff can sustain ~40% 3pt shooting, and without ~40% 3pt shooting he's not rotation-level player. It will be nice to re-sign him for minimum, but I wouldn't consider Morris to be anything more than 10/11th piece of rotation. But yes, I'm not a fan of getting Ibaka for full MLE ahead of other options, I can agree on that.

About Schroeder trade:

1. I feel good with a fact Lakers didn't blindly fall in love with Playoff Rondo having in mind how awful he was on regular basis during regular season. It would be great to keep him, but not for full MLE-level territory. Lakers' need of getting proper backup ballhandler was quite obvious then, and I don't think Lakers could have gotten anyone at this point with bigger potential than German.

2. That being said, I think this trade can turn out to be veery mediocre for Lakers. Firstly, like I said few weeks ago, Danny Green played two of his three best statistical regular seasons in contract years, and I wouldn't be suprised if he's able to duplicate that this again considering he'll fight for his maybe last multiyear contract. Secondly, while I'm confident that Schroder in good environment will keep up his defensive impact as well as provide necessary playmaking/driving skills - I'm not so sure about his shooting.

Schroeder's catch and shoot stats:
20: 41.4% (3.6 3PA)
19: 35.0% (3.1 3PA)
18: 28.0% (1.9 3PA)
17: 39.6% (1.9 3PA)
16: 38.3% (1.7 3PA)

He was below-30% 3pt shooter in postseason, so it makes me wonder if that regular season was a fluke. If he's back to mediocre spot up shooting, then he'll be no x-factor for this team even if he still provides some valuable skills. LeBron gives his teammates much more space than they have in general, but we have some experience with Jae Crowder's back-to-reality slump.

3. At this point, Lakers probably have full domino of offseason signings ready to fall, so we may guess the names based on rumors and intuition. If Lakers are able to sign Wesley Matthews AND use MLE for another acquisition, then I'm a fan of this Schroeder's trade. I don't think Matthews is any worse than last year's Green, and I don't think #28 is a big prize for Schroeder. If they think about using this MLE for Wesley Matthews (I wouldn't be suprised if they do so in case of trade market being less favourable than Pelinka&Co thought), then I'm slightly disappointed because I don't think Schroeder-Matthews duo is that big improvement in comparison to Rondo-Green pair.

PG: Schroeder, Cook
SG: KCP, Caruso, maybe Bradley
SF: Matthews, Kuzma, Horton-Tucker
PF: LeBron, AD
C: Ibaka/another MLE player, JaVale

+ some vets and trade deadline signings

Like I said, I'm not a fan of using MLE for Ibaka, but if Lakers sign Matthews/3&D wing by non-MLE, then they'll use MLE for a big. So this roster above is very-optimistic-but-maybe-realistic scenario: I believe Lakers would be much stronger in spacing (Ibaka) and scoring (Schroeder) areas, and better team in general if they able to do that stuff. I'd love to see another wing for MLE if they can't sign Ibaka.

If they use MLE for Matthews/Harkless/Holiday/3&D wing and sign rotation big (Tristan? Dwight?) for BAE/minimum, then I feel this roster is maybe slightly better than last year, but I anticipate that opposition this year will be much better than last season, and because of COVID/short offseason I believe length of rotation will be much more important than it was in 19-20.

[Fadeaway_J]

LeBron needs MORE help! LMAO. In all seriousness though, they will regret losing Rondo. He was a legit secondary facilitator to helping buoy the offense. I'm not sure if Schroder can make a similiar or even greater impact compared to Rondo's play this postseason. I think the Lakers will get worse. Although things may change and new discoveries are bound to happen later on that may change viewpoints. Losing Green is a small loss too. He brings you defense and 3. I think the Lakers will get worse next season across the board.

Rondo's impact was negative for most of the season. I think people are too quick to overlook this because he actually played competently in the playoffs.

[LikeABosh]

Am I the only one who would prefer re-signing Morris for cheap than Ibaka for the Full MLE?

I don't think Kieff can sustain ~40% 3pt shooting, and without ~40% 3pt shooting he's not rotation-level player. It will be nice to re-sign him for minimum, but I wouldn't consider Morris to be anything more than 10/11th piece of rotation. But yes, I'm not a fan of getting Ibaka for full MLE ahead of other options, I can agree on that.

How come? 40% is a really high mark for a SF/PF. I like his mobility on defense for the Lakers' small ball unit and he provides a reasonable amount of spacing. I would say 35% is acceptable for someone who will only play 14-18 mpg at the PF position

[The Master]

How come? 40% is a really high mark for a SF/PF. I like his mobility on defense for the Lakers' small ball unit and he provides a reasonable amount of spacing. I would say 35% is acceptable for someone who will only play 14-18 mpg at the PF position

Morris was okay in postseason because:
1) he shot over 40% from 3 point line
2) he is mobile as a defender

so he was a good fit on both offensive (stretch 4) and defensive end (smallball lineups with AD as a center). Still, his offense is irrelevant without jumper, and his awareness in team defense, rim protection or rebounding are pretty weak. If he's back to his 34-35% from downtown I don't think he can be positive as a player impact-wise for a contender: he can still be useful from time to time, but like I said I wouldn't consider him as an option for permanent place in team rotation.

[homecourtloss]

Interesting thing about Green is how he’s produced some poor or mediocre looking individual defensive numbers but somehow manages to be a plus defender because of his high BBall IQ that leads to his top tier help defense.

With the Lakers

ISO, 1.27 PPP allowed, bottom 8%; 1.07 in the playoffs, bottom 26%
Pick and roll ball handler, .93, bottom 33%; .74 in the playoffs, top 82%
Spot up, 1.01, top 52%; 1.30 in playoffs, bottom 21%
Off screens, .91, top 57%; 1.08 in playoffs, bottom 23%

With the Raptors

ISO, .91 PPP allowed, bottom 44%; 1.13 in the playoffs, bottom 21%
Pick and roll ball handler, .84, top 58%; .82 in the playoffs, top 64%
Spot up, 1.17, bottom 13%; 1.03 in playoffs, bottom 38%
Off screens, 1.12, bottom 23%; .64 in playoffs, top 78%

[nzahir]

How come? 40% is a really high mark for a SF/PF. I like his mobility on defense for the Lakers' small ball unit and he provides a reasonable amount of spacing. I would say 35% is acceptable for someone who will only play 14-18 mpg at the PF position

Morris was okay in postseason because:
1) he shot over 40% from 3 point line
2) he is mobile as a defender

so he was a good fit on both offensive (stretch 4) and defensive end (smallball lineups with AD as a center). Still, his offense is irrelevant without jumper, and his awareness in team defense, rim protection or rebounding are pretty weak. If he's back to his 34-35% from downtown I don't think he can be positive as a player impact-wise for a contender: he can still be useful from time to time, but like I said I wouldn't consider him as an option for permanent place in team rotation.

I would def welcome Kieff back for the min

But rather not use any of the mle or the BAE on him

I wonder if we can get Dwight to come back on the BAE, sign Boogie for the min, and then use mle on Wes and Harkless (I assume Gallo takes more and Ibaka stays with Raps)

Not even sure if those 2 could be had for the mle tbh

Bring KCP back on a big 1 year deal

Avery, Wes, Lebron, AD, Boogie
Schroeder, AC, KCP, Kuzma, Dwight
Cook, THT, Harkless, Kieff, Mcgee

Mcgee and Cook could be moved if needed, but not sure where, don't mind keeping just for bench consistency

Don't have an open roster spot though. Dudley is also gone, not that he was valuable on the court though, but off court

Edit:
Just read Avery may be opting out, so I guess KCP would start here

I don't know too much about hard cap and how much this helps, if anything, but I thought Avery was overall a slight positive player

We did win w/o him anyways, but I am a little worried about losing 2 defensive starting guards (even though KCP was the playoff starters, which means he is even more valuable now imo)

[trickshot]

Can a Laker fan tell me why they are so keen on 2021 FA. Had a look and outside of Giannis it's a bit overhyped. If he doesn't have an interest in forming another big 3 they would have to re-sign their own free agents all in one summer which could be really expensive.

[LikeABosh]

How come? 40% is a really high mark for a SF/PF. I like his mobility on defense for the Lakers' small ball unit and he provides a reasonable amount of spacing. I would say 35% is acceptable for someone who will only play 14-18 mpg at the PF position

Morris was okay in postseason because:
1) he shot over 40% from 3 point line
2) he is mobile as a defender

so he was a good fit on both offensive (stretch 4) and defensive end (smallball lineups with AD as a center). Still, his offense is irrelevant without jumper, and his awareness in team defense, rim protection or rebounding are pretty weak. If he's back to his 34-35% from downtown I don't think he can be positive as a player impact-wise for a contender: he can still be useful from time to time, but like I said I wouldn't consider him as an option for permanent place in team rotation.

I would def welcome Kieff back for the min

But rather not use any of the mle or the BAE on him

I wonder if we can get Dwight to come back on the BAE, sign Boogie for the min, and then use mle on Wes and Harkless (I assume Gallo takes more and Ibaka stays with Raps)

Not even sure if those 2 could be had for the mle tbh

Bring KCP back on a big 1 year deal

Avery, Wes, Lebron, AD, Boogie
Schroeder, AC, KCP, Kuzma, Dwight
Cook, THT, Harkless, Kieff, Mcgee

Mcgee and Cook could be moved if needed, but not sure where, don't mind keeping just for bench consistency

Don't have an open roster spot though. Dudley is also gone, not that he was valuable on the court though, but off court

Edit:
Just read Avery may be opting out, so I guess KCP would start here

I don't know too much about hard cap and how much this helps, if anything, but I thought Avery was overall a slight positive player

We did win w/o him anyways, but I am a little worried about losing 2 defensive starting guards (even though KCP was the playoff starters, which means he is even more valuable now imo)

You can only use one of the exceptions, not both. According to spotrac at least

[Baski]

LeBron needs MORE help! LMAO. In all seriousness though, they will regret losing Rondo. He was a legit secondary facilitator to helping buoy the offense. I'm not sure if Schroder can make a similiar or even greater impact compared to Rondo's play this postseason. I think the Lakers will get worse. Although things may change and new discoveries are bound to happen later on that may change viewpoints. Losing Green is a small loss too. He brings you defense and 3. I think the Lakers will get worse next season across the board.

Lmao it's gonna be hilarious watching Rondo make whichever team gets him worse while everyone scratches their head wondering why, because it can't possibly be him .

Personally I hope the Clippers get him for 8 mil

[Mos_Heat]

If they will have their full MLE, they would probably split it between Mathews and one of Morris/Howard

Seems like they are betting on THT being substantial contributor, cuz if not or they don't strike gold with their vet mins, I have a hard time seeing this team being better than the previous one.

[Greyhound]

Am I the only one who would prefer re-signing Morris for cheap than Ibaka for the Full MLE?

Nope.

I said the same thing a few posts back.