Greater: Kobe Bryant vs Stephen Curry

[Lockdown504090]

Kobe sure is one of the very few players who is a consistent litmus vs other players. I wonder if you aggregated all the comparison threads ever posted on Realgm, which players would come out on top.

woah, yeah thats true as hell. Like theres the guys who have a reasonable case as being better who are in everyones top 8, then theres guys that kinda could who are like 11-20, if i cant talk about a player in the same breath as kobe, then theres no reason to think of them as even top 20. Like steph aint higher than kobe, but because the convo doesnt sound ridiculous, hes probably around top 15 all time.

[Onlytimewilltel]

I like how this poll turned out, kudos to the GB for getting it right!

Start another one today and you’ll probably get slightly different results. What have you done for me lately is a thing.

I was about to until I searched and found this one. It has nearly 500 votes, no way a new poll will match that level of voter participation.

That’s ok, just start another one. Hell there are 2 million lebron vs Jordan threads. I think you’re ok with a fresh perspective on Kobe vs Curry (plus I do want to see just how much the “what have you done for me lately” will play a role here lol, it can be like an experiment)

[rtiff68]

Steph and Kobe actually have similar enough careers, funnily enough. Whether its playing with an arguably more dominant force (KD & Shaq) for 3-4 seasons in their early primes, their early career slow rise to success then immediate championship level success, their rings /finals totals at that point in their respective careers.

At this point, I have Kobe, because of that second 2peat and 3rd finals run. What he did after that wasn't too bad either.

5 titles
7 finals
20 seasons

There's a pretty good chance you're going to the finals with Kobe on your team, whether he's a 1A or 1B on your team.

Its similar with Steph now. Hes been there a lot, as a 1A or 1B. His career isn't over yet though.

3 rings
5 finals
13 seasons

Full disclosure: I’m a lifelong Warriors fan who has Kobe 7-12 and Curry 12-17.

If we’re going to make this comparison genuine, then we need to point out the fact that Kobe was not 1B to Shaq, he was the clear cut 2. He closed the gap between them during their run, but he never overtook Shaq as the team’s best and most important player, and I don’t think many Laker fans would even dispute that unless they are Kobe fans first.

Kareem was better than Magic early, and then it eventually flip-flopped. Curry and Durant were the definition of 1A/1B. Shaq/Kobe was closer to Jordan/Pippen than it was to Curry/Durant.

[Johnny Tomala]

Both playes exude greatness and have had their nay sayers.

But Curry is unlike anything I have seen before. Curry will go down as a top 5 player ever. I do not even mind that his defense isn't good, his offense is that otherworldly.

He won't go down top 5 ever. He won't even reach Top 10.

[rtiff68]

Both playes exude greatness and have had their nay sayers.

But Curry is unlike anything I have seen before. Curry will go down as a top 5 player ever. I do not even mind that his defense isn't good, his offense is that otherworldly.

He won't go down top 5 ever. He won't even reach Top 10.

He isn’t there currently, but it’s not like he’s miles away, either.

You’re acting like it’s completely beyond the realm of possibility. If he wins another MVP or championship or both, then he’s firmly in that group with Shaq, Duncan, and Kobe.

[bbalnation]

Steph and Kobe actually have similar enough careers, funnily enough. Whether its playing with an arguably more dominant force (KD & Shaq) for 3-4 seasons in their early primes, their early career slow rise to success then immediate championship level success, their rings /finals totals at that point in their respective careers.

At this point, I have Kobe, because of that second 2peat and 3rd finals run. What he did after that wasn't too bad either.

5 titles
7 finals
20 seasons

There's a pretty good chance you're going to the finals with Kobe on your team, whether he's a 1A or 1B on your team.

Its similar with Steph now. Hes been there a lot, as a 1A or 1B. His career isn't over yet though.

3 rings
5 finals
13 seasons

Full disclosure: I’m a lifelong Warriors fan who has Kobe 7-12 and Curry 12-17.

If we’re going to make this comparison genuine, then we need to point out the fact that Kobe was not 1B to Shaq, he was the clear cut 2. He closed the gap between them during their run, but he never overtook Shaq as the team’s best and most important player, and I don’t think many Laker fans would even dispute that unless they are Kobe fans first.

Kareem was better than Magic early, and then it eventually flip-flopped. Curry and Durant were the definition of 1A/1B. Shaq/Kobe was closer to Jordan/Pippen than it was to Curry/Durant.

Meh, I disagree with you.

It depended on the matchup, and the year, and whether it was the season or playoffs, or which playoff series... it was never all or nothing with those two imo.

The averages even in the playoffs points wise weren't waaaaaaaay far off between Shaq & Kobe iirc. I imagine their usage wouldn't be if that was a thing back then too (eye test, idk if it was?).

In the Finals, the East would send a 35 year old Dikembe/Matt Geinger/Todd MacColluch (Philly), or for the Nets... Jason Collins/Todd MacColluch/Kenyon Martin....

I agree: in those series, Shaq is 1, 1A & 2.

[celticfan42487]

Curry and it's not close.

Kobe was a nice player for his time. A lesser Mike, a lesser LeBron. Someone who played while Shaq forced the NBA to change the rules of the game to try and stop his dominance.

Curry changed the way every single NBA team is forced to play in order to try to be as effective as he is on the court. And is a far better player. Kobe will have some fans of an older generation but it'll only be one and the objective heads of future generations won't feel the need to make this comparison or elevate Kobe above his station because they won't have grown up with ESPN marketing around him for their entire childhood - adulthood.

[Karate Diop]

In pressure situations the answer is Kobe 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

We saw what Curry was made of when the Cavs were actually healthy and Woke Kyrie sent him to the shadow realm.

[rtiff68]

Steph and Kobe actually have similar enough careers, funnily enough. Whether its playing with an arguably more dominant force (KD & Shaq) for 3-4 seasons in their early primes, their early career slow rise to success then immediate championship level success, their rings /finals totals at that point in their respective careers.

At this point, I have Kobe, because of that second 2peat and 3rd finals run. What he did after that wasn't too bad either.

5 titles
7 finals
20 seasons

There's a pretty good chance you're going to the finals with Kobe on your team, whether he's a 1A or 1B on your team.

Its similar with Steph now. Hes been there a lot, as a 1A or 1B. His career isn't over yet though.

3 rings
5 finals
13 seasons

Full disclosure: I’m a lifelong Warriors fan who has Kobe 7-12 and Curry 12-17.

If we’re going to make this comparison genuine, then we need to point out the fact that Kobe was not 1B to Shaq, he was the clear cut 2. He closed the gap between them during their run, but he never overtook Shaq as the team’s best and most important player, and I don’t think many Laker fans would even dispute that unless they are Kobe fans first.

Kareem was better than Magic early, and then it eventually flip-flopped. Curry and Durant were the definition of 1A/1B. Shaq/Kobe was closer to Jordan/Pippen than it was to Curry/Durant.

Meh, I disagree with you.

It depended on the matchup, and the year, and whether it was the season or playoffs, or which playoff series... it was never all or nothing with those two imo.

The averages even in the playoffs points wise weren't waaaaaaaay far off between Shaq & Kobe iirc. I imagine their usage wouldn't be if that was a thing back then too (eye test, idk if it was?).

In the Finals, the East would send a 35 year old Dikembe/Matt Geinger/Todd MacColluch (Philly), or for the Nets... Jason Collins/Todd MacColluch/Kenyon Martin....

I agree: in those series, Shaq is 1, 1A & 2.

Fair enough.

I believe you do find yourself in a significant minority, though.

The average points weren’t WAY off their last two titles years (they were the first year), but their advanced stats were. There’s basically no reasonable statistically based argument that favors Kobe over Shaq during the 3-peat.

[NetsWorld]

Kobe. And Kobe didn’t have the quality of players in his later years that Curry had. I’m talking 07-10 Lakers. Kobe’s prime yielded two rings in a tough league. He was the man, the role model and the only player to reach MJ status( yes he got there). Kobe only needed Gasol with good role players to get over the hump. I miss him, his tenacity, his drive and motivation. No Kobe means many players today would suck. A lot of players modeled their games after him. RIP KB24. It would have been nice to see him in a Net uniform but i understand LA is where it was at.

[Cubbies2120]

In pressure situations the answer is Kobe 7 days of the week and twice on Sunday.

We saw what Curry was made of when the Cavs were actually healthy and Woke Kyrie sent him to the shadow realm.

You sure about that? Here's Kobe's playoff career game-tying or game-winning shots:

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-7a662e44273d340f1b5b9368d7535118-pjlq

7-25 or 28%...not exactly a great "pressure situation" player there...

[Liam_Gallagher]

Kobe doesn’t get FMVP because of Shaq: “He’s a beta!”

Curry with zero FMVP’s: “what a great team player.”

[bbalnation]

Full disclosure: I’m a lifelong Warriors fan who has Kobe 7-12 and Curry 12-17.

If we’re going to make this comparison genuine, then we need to point out the fact that Kobe was not 1B to Shaq, he was the clear cut 2. He closed the gap between them during their run, but he never overtook Shaq as the team’s best and most important player, and I don’t think many Laker fans would even dispute that unless they are Kobe fans first.

Kareem was better than Magic early, and then it eventually flip-flopped. Curry and Durant were the definition of 1A/1B. Shaq/Kobe was closer to Jordan/Pippen than it was to Curry/Durant.

Meh, I disagree with you.

It depended on the matchup, and the year, and whether it was the season or playoffs, or which playoff series... it was never all or nothing with those two imo.

The averages even in the playoffs points wise weren't waaaaaaaay far off between Shaq & Kobe iirc. I imagine their usage wouldn't be if that was a thing back then too (eye test, idk if it was?).

In the Finals, the East would send a 35 year old Dikembe/Matt Geinger/Todd MacColluch (Philly), or for the Nets... Jason Collins/Todd MacColluch/Kenyon Martin....

I agree: in those series, Shaq is 1, 1A & 2.

Fair enough.

I believe you do find yourself in a significant minority, though.

The average points weren’t WAY off their last two titles years (they were the first year), but their advanced stats were. There’s basically no reasonable statistically based argument that favors Kobe over Shaq during the 3-peat.

Hm.

I never suggested that Kobe favored Shaq.

I am suggesting that Stephs impact might have been similar to Kobe. So, if we look at the point difference between Steph & KD, and Kobe & Shaq (season & playoffs), I dont imagine it being TOO far off.

Similar with usage #s, defensive stats/impact (ie points allowed) versus assists/flow, etc.

[theforumblue]

Kobe sure is one of the very few players who is a consistent litmus vs other players. I wonder if you aggregated all the comparison threads ever posted on Realgm, which players would come out on top.

woah, yeah thats true as hell. Like theres the guys who have a reasonable case as being better who are in everyones top 8, then theres guys that kinda could who are like 11-20, if i cant talk about a player in the same breath as kobe, then theres no reason to think of them as even top 20. Like steph aint higher than kobe, but because the convo doesnt sound ridiculous, hes probably around top 15 all time.

kobe will be ranked closer to top 20 soon enough in realgm.

[HurricaneKid]

WTF is going on with the re-writing of Kobe's defense in this thread? Over the course of his 19 year career and 100,000+ defensive possessions he was a minus defender. Period.

And that's for one of the biggest DRPM sample sizes available.



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[HurricaneKid]

Its incredibly tough for now to rank a guy like Curry and even KD.

Curry has 0 fmvps and won 1 ring without KD in a year where the cavs lost 2 of their top 3 guys. On top of Delly going to the hospital and Shump playing hurt for half the series.

KD has 2 rings and 2 fmvps, but also didn't accomplish too much without Curry.

For now, Curry doesn't have the longevity, fmvp(s), and the big shot moments. On top of him never being able to touch Kobe defensively in his prime. This is all coming from a guy who doesn't like kobe and thinks he is one of the most overrated players of all time (for people who think hes top 3-5)

So I'm going Kobe. If Curry was to win a ring or two on his own and win 1-2 fmvp, this could swing in Curry's favor

Exactly, Curry beat a 1 man team in the 2015 finals and than choked in 2016. 2017\2018 he would of been a clown to lose with KD\Klay\Dray all on his team. I don't see how he's ever going to win another title unless he takes advantage of a 1 man team in the finals again.

Curry "choked" in 2016 Finals when they all but played a box and 1 on him and he shot .580ts%.

Kobe was a 2 time FMVP with .525 and .528ts%

Meanwhile, Kobe legit lost his team the 04 Finals when he refused to pass to Shaq, took 29 more shots in a 5 game series in shooting .456ts% while Shaq was shooting 63% from the field.

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[HurricaneKid]

Have to pick Kobe, Steph never had defenses focus on just him. Kobe after Shaq and before Gasol had to do it alone. Steph hasn’t yet.

How did that Kobe fare? The one after Shaq and before Pau while he was in his prime?

Missed the playoffs once and lost in the first round the other two times.

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[theforumblue]

Have to pick Kobe, Steph never had defenses focus on just him. Kobe after Shaq and before Gasol had to do it alone. Steph hasn’t yet.

How did that Kobe fare? The one after Shaq and before Pau while he was in his prime?

Missed the playoffs once and lost in the first round the other two times.

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Because warriors did so well without klay and KD last couple of years?

[Colbinii]

Have to pick Kobe, Steph never had defenses focus on just him. Kobe after Shaq and before Gasol had to do it alone. Steph hasn’t yet.

How did that Kobe fare? The one after Shaq and before Pau while he was in his prime?

Missed the playoffs once and lost in the first round the other two times.

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Because warriors did so well without klay and KD last couple of years?

HurricaneKid shifted the goal posts and now you've taken the goal posts and removed them from the stadium.

The original comment "Have to Pick Kobe, Steph never had defenses focus on him" is a joke of a post.

1) Did 2013-2016 not happen in this guys reality? Every team in the league was key'd in on Curry and attempting to stop him yet he put together arguably the greatest regular season of all-time.

2) Curry did it last year and is doing it this season. Curry produced a OBPM in 2021 and this season in which Kobe never reached.

3) Kobe never produced offensive results anywhere close to Curry when alone. From 2005-2007, Kobe peaked with an on-court Ortg of 111 while Curry has produced two 115 on-court offenses the past two seasons.

After everything I have said as a counterpoint to the absurdity of Snaquille Oatmeal [who may have the GOAT RealGM Name], does any of this actually matter?

[SNPA]

I'm a big Steph fan, but it will be hard for Steph to be greater than Kobe with the amount of defensive accolades that Kobe has under his belt. Kobe was all defensive 1st team 9 times!

Several of those rightfully belong to Doug Christie.