2012-13 Player of the Year Voting Thread (LeBron wins)

[GSP]

No one has voted for Melo?

That really surprises me.

I place Melo No.9 but I think there were a few players better. He has more value on offense for Pf but there are diminishing returns for defense. He plays a more impactful defensive position now while his defense didnt improve at all. He prolly was a bit better since Id guess he had more opportunities for post defense. He was better this season but not by alot IMO. Felton and Tyson were very important for offense too.

Knicks 12: 17th Ortg, 5th Drtg
Knicks 13: 3rd Ortg, 18th Drtg

[fatal9]

Don't have time to go in super detail, so just quick comments.

1. LeBron
2. KD
3. Paul
4. Curry
5. Gasol

LeBron's jumper and overall half court scoring (even the post) was a little disappointing in the playoffs. I don't think he needs to go crazy as a volume scorer or anything, I think his patience to promote ball movement and stick to the plan might even be a little under appreciated, but there were many phases during several (winnable) games where I felt he had to be more aggressive as a scorer. It's something that will allow him to dictate the game better offensively and be more effective against different types of defensive schemes. #1 easily, but GOAT, not quite. I bought into his improvement as a jumpshooter because of the career numbers he was putting up, but the natural tendency of his jumpshot is still "streaky" and the large increase in jumpshot efficiency numbers might have more to do with shot selection and using certain spots on the floor better than a huge skill improvement in his actual jumpshooting ability (though that probably improved a little too).

KD I think might require a long discussion on this board, as people cooled on him a little too much after the playoffs (driven more by outcome than some revelation of a previously unknown flaw in his game). Some preferred Paul to him before the playoffs, which is fine, but I think anyone dramatically changing their opinion on him after the playoffs needs to analyze the situation a little more carefully. I would say he even slightly surpassed my expectations with the type of role he was being asked to play. It ended ugly, but that's how it usually ends when you combine those kind of minutes with the role he was asked to play, it's unsustainable over an extended period of time.

Curry vs. Parker was really close. Parker had an amazing stretch mid-season-ish but I don't think he was necessarily 100% physically since his string of late season injuries, he was getting better as playoffs went on but then was slowed down again by ailments in the finals. Then again, Curry also kept injuring his ankle in the playoffs and as the Spurs series went on, it did seem to have an effect on his ability to free himself from Danny Green who hounded him off and on the ball. Still, Curry even when he's off the ball is a tremendous threat who the defense gears to not give any free space because of not only his shooting ability, but how quickly he can release the shot (literally can't play any help defense off him). GS's on/off offense numbers in playoffs are pretty crazy when Curry was out of the game (110 vs. 88), which is impressive considering he has one of the better backups behind him, albeit this is over a small sample. I think as a team defender Curry is improved, underrated and very heady, but sometimes needs to be protected as a man defender depending on the matchup. Parker while is the engine to the Spurs offense, I think is also very fortunate to be surrounded by such a well spaced system with great shooting support and smart ball movement that maximizes his effectiveness. Curry's offensive impact I think is more transferable from roster to roster, coach to coach.

Gasol vs. Duncan. I'd take Duncan on a per minute basis, but Gasol is capable of playing more minutes, which to me matters, especially in playoffs when on most teams you want to shorten your rotation as much as possible. +4.9 mpg in regular season and +5.6 mpg in the playoffs. That's really the deciding factor for me to lean towards Gasol.

[HeartBreakKid]

1) Lebron James - He is the rightful MVP. Lead the Heat to an historic regular season. Got the same beastly numbers he always has. Didn't play great defense for the first half of the season, but by the time the playoffs came around he started to lay it on (especially when he guarded Parker in the finals). Performed well in the post season. Best player in the world, no question.

2) Kevin Durant - Not really positive if I should give him the benefit over CP3. But with time running out, I'll have to make a gut call. Durant and CP3 is pretty close offensively. But Durant likely impacts defense more, and he also rebounds a lot. Durant was on pace for an historic scoring season, making a tremendous amount of points on low volume. He cooled down as the season went on, and post All-Star he was arguably being carried by Westbrook. I thought he played good in the post season considering how much out of his element he was due to Russell's injury.

3) Chris Paul - Offensively, he may even be superior to Durant despite his usual hobbled status. The Clippers started out very hot, then hit a cold spot, and toward the end of the RS started to finish strong. The Clips lost to a tough team in Memphis in the Playoffs, where the team played like trash with the exception of Chris Paul. CP3 has a legit argument for #2, but at the very least everyone's top 3 should include James, Durant and CP3.


4) Stephen Curry - Again, I have to make a gut check here since time is running out. I feel like there is a chance we'll look back at this voting and think "what the hell we were thinking placing Curry this high?". Curry was a great player, but the only problem with me rating him this high is that I didn't think he was a top ten during the RS. Curry did turn it up during the playoffs, and was making some all time great 3 point plays. I think his ability to play off guard is what really gives him that extra credit. He's the point guard version of Reggie Miller. His offensive impact is immense, and his defense has come along a long way. The other wings and guards are all defensive liabilities except Wade, who faded due to heavy injuries. Curry beats the other wings due to not needing the ball, but being fully capable of playing with it at a high level. His portability makes him a special player.

5) Tim Duncan - Timmy was my DPOY. He had some crazy ass statlines this season, and was playing at a level we haven't seen in a half decade. He was off and on during the playoffs offensively, but defensively he was always doing his job. The Spurs had a great defense while also maintaining one of the best offenses in the league. I'll give Timmy credit for that, he was probably the best Center this year. Marc Gasol has an advantage over Duncan due to minutes, but I think at the end of the day, the difference in impact is pretty clear.

[SideshowBob]

Ballot

1. James
2. Durant
3. Paul
4. Curry
5. Duncan

[SideshowBob]

Ballot

1. James
2. Durant
3. Paul
4. Curry
5. Duncan

Not much to say regarding the first spot, James is an easy choice here.

I ended up leaning Durant for second, but I don't have too much separation between him and Paul. I thought they were fairly close during the regular season, and I think either one could be argued into the 2 spot.

After that's where its been tricky. I had a cluster of Westbrook, Curry, Harden, Gasol, Duncan, Wade, George, (Garnett fits in there somewhere as well, but I feel as though he clearly ran out of steam) followed by another close group of Parker, Bryant, Anthony, Williams, Hibbert. Injuries only made things muddier. Westbrook and Bryant both dropped in stock by not even (or barely) playing in the PS. Wade's as well, as he looked pretty poor save less than a handful of games (though I thought he was fantastic as the secondary offensive catalyst in Miami's offensive explosion in the 2nd half of the RS). With Harden, the longer the season went on, the more I lost slight confidence, his skillset is still underdeveloped for the kind of role he's starting to undertake, though I expect to see him make strides.

Curry I was thinking long and hard about all season long. I know fatal was making the case for him as a top player in the MVP thread WAYY back early in the season, and at this point I'm pretty convinced that he's a stronger offensive player than Harden, clearly a more portable one, and he's not a defensive liability either. I think he could go 4th or 5th.

Duncan was the clear best player on San Antonio IMO. I see Parker's offense and his defense as a wash, but Parker roughly breaks even on the defensive end while Duncan is a weak positive on offense. Pretty similar to Garnett last season. In a year less riddled with injuries, him and Curry are probably both dropping lower, but that whole cluster is so tight that it may have been anyone's game.

[mysticbb]

Update after 23 votes:

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Player               Pts    Shares  1   2   3   4   5
Lebron James         230    1.000   23
Kevin Durant         157    0.683       21  2
Chris Paul           119    0.517       2   21
Stephen Curry         35    0.152               11  2
Tim Duncan            18    0.078               4   6
James Harden          17    0.074               5   2
Marc Gasol            7     0.030               1   4
Tony Parker           6     0.026               1   3
Paul George           5     0.022               1   2
Deron Williams        2     0.009                   2
Russell Westbrook     1     0.004                   1
Kobe Bryant           1     0.004                   1

[Doctor MJ]

Update after 23 votes:

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Player               Pts    Shares  1   2   3   4   5
Lebron James         230    1.000   23
Kevin Durant         157    0.683       21  2
Chris Paul           119    0.517       2   21
Stephen Curry         35    0.152               11  2
Tim Duncan            18    0.078               4   6
James Harden          17    0.074               5   2
Marc Gasol            7     0.030               1   4
Tony Parker           6     0.026               1   3
Paul George           5     0.022               1   2
Deron Williams        2     0.009                   2
Russell Westbrook     1     0.004                   1
Kobe Bryant           1     0.004                   1

Sweet!

Thank you mystic, and also realbig, and to all who participated. Very interesting results this year.

[Doctor MJ]

I'm going to update my lists today and give some noteworthy data. I'll also contact sentient to get the RPOY site updated.

[semi-sentient]

I'll try to get to that tomorrow or Saturday. Have lots of eating, drinking, and swimming to do on this great day in 'Merica.

[Doctor MJ]

I'll try to get to that tomorrow or Saturday. Have lots of eating, drinking, and swimming to do on this great day in 'Merica.

Awesome. One other thing, I made a typo last year that needs to be corrected on your site:

Paul didn't have 1 3rd place vote, he had 11. So his total points were 82, not 32.

[mysticbb]

Very interesting results this year.

From #4 down, indeed. Would have probably be more interesting, if we had cut out the Top3 and just voted on a Top10 list behind those 3 players. I assume that Dwight Howard will make it more interesting next season again, maybe even challenging James for that top spot.

[GSP]

Very interesting results this year.

From #4 down, indeed. Would have probably be more interesting, if we had cut out the Top3 and just voted on a Top10 list behind those 3 players. I assume that Dwight Howard will make it more interesting next season again, maybe even challenging James for that top spot.

Why do u think that? Lebron has been a +8 player for avg in Miami. Dwights peak is around +5.5-6 coming back from injury. He was better in 2nd half but I think its more reasonable to say he will challenge Kd/Cp3 for 2nd spot.

[semi-sentient]

OK, I've got the site updated and made the correction to CP3's results in 2011-12.

http://rpoy.dolem.com

LeBron passes Irving in POY shares and that was the only significant change in the top 15.

Code: Select all

1.  Bill Russell          10.956
2.  Kareem Abdul-Jabbar   10.221
3.  Michael Jordan         9.578
4.  Wilt Chamberlain       7.818
5.  Magic Johnson          7.114
6.  Tim Duncan             6.231
7.  Larry Bird             6.147
8.  Shaquille O'Neal       5.910
9.  LeBron James           5.692
10. Julius Erving          5.046
11. Karl Malone            4.649
12. Bob Pettit             4.466
13. Oscar Robertson        4.413
14. Kobe Bryant            4.380
15. Hakeem Olajuwon        4.380