Damian Lillard vs Kyrie Irving: Better player?

[cpower]

Lillard by a hair because of the 1st option. Irving could be the better player but he needs to go to another team to demonstrate how he does as a first option

[Baski]

But I'm not taking anything away from Lillard here--I'm just not giving him anything he hasn't shown yet. We know Kyrie's game elevates in the highest of leverage situations. We don't know that about Lillard. Since I rate them closely, that's the kicker for me.

Consider that whenever these high leverage situations come up (which LeBron James and Kevin Love play a huuuuuge role in making possible), LeBron James and to a lesser extent, Kevin Love, are right there next to him making it tough to stop him alone. When Kyrie is going off, you probably don't want to let up on LeBron to try and stop him. Now i don't mean to say that teams leave Kyrie free to get his, but he derives a huge benefit in sharing the defense's attention with LeBron and Love to a lesser extent. I don't even want to mention team USA because that's basically the equivalent of an All-Star team playing against scrubs. Any star on that team who cares enough will look good if he wants to.

You want me to consider that he's playing on the Cavs, basically? Is that your argument?

Cool, now that we've gotten that across, what does that have to do with my point?

Oh I'm sorry i was under the impression that you were using it as a point to say Kyrie is better, in which case i don't see how you can ignore how amazingly easy it is, at least relative to Lillard, for Kyrie to "elevate his game", as you say.
But apparently you were just saying it for saying's sake i suppose. My bad. Carry on.

[FNQ]

I'll take Lillard. The gap isn't big but it's pretty clear for me.

Exactly how i feel

I dont think Lillard is way better by any means, but he has ranked higher than Kyrie in RPM every one of the last 4 years and has done so as the unquestioned #1 option in his offense, while Kyrie didnt really blossom until he had someone taking away the majority of defensive attention. And for that reason I'd easily take Lillard over Kyrie right now

[Onus]

Everyone taking dame based on the fact he's the no. 1 option, are you sure dame could win a title as a no. 1 option if he's supposedly on the same tier as Kyrie and you're sure that Kyrie couldn't win as a no. 1 option. It just seems hypocritical to say dame could do it and not Kyrie if they're on the same tier.

We know Kyrie can as a second option and thrive in it.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Kyrie is too limited in terms of playmaking and playing off the ball.

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[Mr. Crowley]

Lillard for me, not by a lot but pretty clearly.

I think the difference here is that Lillard doesn't need to freeze his teammates to get hes.

Very similar negative defenders, Lillard scores 2 more points in .1 more shots, a little more efficient doing so also while being #1 on the team.

Lillard just have better advanced metrics all around, not much separation though, similar level players.

[Duke4life831]

Kyrie is too limited in terms of playmaking and playing off the ball.

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Kyrie and Lillard averaged the same amount of assists this year and Kyrie had a better AST% and this was as the secondary facilitator on his team compared to Lillard being the primary facilitator. And how is more limited to playing off the ball? 22% of Kyrie's 2pt shots were assisted on while 23% of Lillards 2pt shots were assisted on. 53% of Kyrie's 3s were assisted on while 49% of Lillard's 3s were assisted on. Statistically speaking theyre very similar facilitators, can even maybe give Kyrie the edge because their numbers are almost identical but Kyrie wasnt the primary ball handler or facilitator on his team. And they have almost identical amount of their shots coming off the ball.

[RCM88x]

Kyrie is too limited in terms of playmaking and playing off the ball.

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Kyrie and Lillard averaged the same amount of assists this year and Kyrie had a better AST% and this was as the secondary facilitator on his team compared to Lillard being the primary facilitator. And how is more limited to playing off the ball? 22% of Kyrie's 2pt shots were assisted on while 23% of Lillards 2pt shots were assisted on. 53% of Kyrie's 3s were assisted on while 49% of Lillard's 3s were assisted on. Statistically speaking theyre very similar facilitators, can even maybe give Kyrie the edge because their numbers are almost identical but Kyrie wasnt the primary ball handler or facilitator on his team. And they have almost identical amount of their shots coming off the ball.

Kyrie did have an infinitely better offensive supporting cast and basically the same usage rate as Lillard.

Statistically they might be identical. But I don't think Lillard's play making suffers as much as Kyrie in terms of an on-off sense. Kyrie cannot do both scoring and play making at one, its an either or thing the moment he touches the ball. Which easily more of the problem than simply his passing ability, because that definitely is there.

He needs to learn how to use his handles and isolation ability to create looks for others, not just himself.

[JordansBulls]

Kyrie for me.