Doctor MJ wrote:Man. I'm stunned by how low this group is on Curry.
Just completely floored.
I mean im not participating much and mostly reading for enjoyment, and even though I would have curry on my ballot by here I dont think theres anything wrong with havitn concerns about his ability in the playoffs
Teams attack you defensively (as in like their defensive tactics) much more aggressively in the playoffs, theyll scout for the rs but itll be more so ok so we should guard him like X, vs in the playoffs its like, ok they like running plays x y and z and they try to run x with curry to get space, they also like to do..., they have a strong p and r attack lets throw different looks, keep on guessing
Vs in the rs its
Oh curry, blitz, drop if you forget lt
Even his off ball impact is mitigated because of how much harder teams scout, sure there will be defensive miscommunications here and there but theyll know the things warriors deploy curry off ball more like those screens near the corner to draw two fefenders and get open cutters
Its worth noting, since he started being deployed this way
(Using bball ref numbers)
2015
102.2 to 116.8 during the rs for curry, whereas it went from 109.6 to 107.9
2016
105.4 to 119.6 during the rs for curry, whereas it went from 109.7 to 111.6 in the postseason for curry
2017
104.7 to 121.1
99.8 to 126.0
2018
108 to 122.7
111.6 to 116.2
2019
110 to 120.8
108.5 to 117.5
BUT, that trend where currys is way higher than everyone else's on his team doesnt hold true in the playoffs where durant has a higher one overall 2/3 years (although 2019 is obv odd, but at the very least in the rs it isnt even close and the ps its pretty arguable).
Is this a definitive argument? Obviously not, the stat used is raw net rtg so clearly its gonna have caveats
Otoh, given the nature of playoff defenses i think its perfectly fair to say its a valid concern that curry might struggle more versus the types of defenses teams throw in the playoffs more, typically the ones gokd at adjusting. Not even from his mumbers but just an impact standpoint, i wouldnt be suprised if the crazy curry and dray p and r wasnt as effective pre ddurant, or if the off ball breakdowns, which are gonna still occur cuz curry is curry, will decrease.
Otoh we saw kerrs ability to make adjustments on the fly are like mid tier+ ish and not high tier at all, so idk maybe its a thing they should be able to counter.
Ill be really curious to see their offense against the lakers personally. I dont really have that many reservations for curry and i do think hes fine against playoff defenses but if someone believes he has those limitations and that hes a much more rs impact guy thats still ver impactful in thepostseason but not the same extent, and that durants been as important in their playoff runs,
I dont think that its unfair for curry to not be in the top 20 ish range given hes only had 5 years at the "top"
The set in stone stuff is weird, im not sure if i read you right there but using a public opinion goat list and the idea that this would be seen weird later on is a really weird argument to make considering garnetts higher than kobe which would be a million times more sacriligious in the publics eyes
Like i personally have kobe way higher than most people here do partially because my criteria is different partially because im way higher on him in general (As in hes in my top 3-7 range probably in terms of who i think is the guy id wanna start with on my team) but like i get why people have garnett higher or kobe really low and there are strong arguments for it even if i dont neccessarily agree with the arguments
Like idk lol i think when it comes to the criteria of career value currys gonna end up hurt by that because his prime was relatively recent, i dont think its unfair to value paul, who went skadoosh since 08 over curry though, and i get reservations people have with curry as a player even if i personally dont believe them to the same extent, i think its justified
Also on that the "what the warriors did was special" idea
I mean it was, but like, man, no one enjoyed that lol and like, that would be alot more valid if it was curry and a strong cast but my man no one called it team curry lol.
Like i get the idea it was built around curry, that the system was built around curry, but at the end of the day, I dont think someone is wrong neccessarily to say that durant played better in their 3 years together during he playoff, even if he wasnt neccessarily more important, and the usual statistical arguments justifying curry dont really work over that sample, theres reason to believe currys impact as a whole is mitigated in the playoffs beyond his lower box score numbers, such as his off ball impact being lessened since at its core its about causing breakdowns which are gonna occur less with greater scouting and attention to detail, and less effective ball screening actuon which is just a given.
More so than that when you think about the biggest series in those runs, the 17 cavs vs 17 warriors, and the 18 rockets vs 18 warriors, while there are arguments for both is really arguably durant was better in both even given currys off ball impact vs that cavs team (not really against the rockets team with how the rockets defended).
Also like i get its currys offense they were built around but like, that would imply they needed curry to win but man that team was sk utterly and absurdly stacked that you could replace curry with a good amount of people and im still pretty sure theyd win 2/3.
Idk lol like i get praising curry and i think its fine for him to be here or to have been voted for before but man, curry was special in the way that he was the main part of the most stupidly talented team ever, like sure he was the guy they built around but like, its not as if you replace curry with a, lets say a lillard and the offense would crumble and the adjustments they decide to make would not make them the best team ever still, like when you can genuinly make an argument a team is a contender without its best player i think it becomes much more about how ridiculous that team is vs any individual whoever it may be
