Top 15 finishers of all-time

[Top10alltime]

I agree that this has been the case traditionally for what one considered "finishing." I think you have to delineate between certain types of "finishers."

Finishing efficiency should be evaluated in the context of shot creation. The more difficult or self-generated the opportunity, the greater the finishing burden.

There are three categories of rim finishing that we can separate methodologically:

Assisted finishes
--These come from designed plays: dump-offs, lobs, post feeds.
--The finisher’s role is execution, not creation.
--Examples: Shaquille O’Neal, DeAndre Jordan, Dwight Howard, AD

Putbacks/Offensive rebounds
--These are somewhat self-generated through positioning and strength, but not through on-ball creation.
--The player earns the attempt via rebounding, not off-the-dribble skill.
Examples: Moses Malone, prime Shaq, Giannis to an extent, Barkley in Philly

Unassisted / Self-created finishes
--These come from beating defenders, handling the ball, attacking in transition, and finishing through contact.
--The player is both creator and finisher.
Examples: LeBron James, Giannis Antetokounmpo, Michael Jordan, Dwyane Wade, Curry, Kyrie, Magic.

If you separate finishing types, the hierarchy looks different:



So if two players both finish at +15% rRIM, someone generating his own shots seems a lot more impressive.

To rank “finishers” in any real meaningful way, you can adjust for creation type by separate assisted vs. unassisted rim makes, weight for volume byhow many attempts per 100 possessions come at the rim, include playtype context by transition, isolation, post-ups, offensive rebounds. I don't have the time to do this year, but it would be interesting to look.

With this said, it still might be Shaq given how far ahead of his peers he is but to me something like 2017 LeBron or 2014 seems more impressive given how those shots at the rim are generated. Post Philadelphia Barkley had lost athleticism, but became a very crafty finisher with his offhand and off the dribble with very subtle improvements in his footwork. and they can be many more delineations.

Ooh, this is actually very interesting! I might as well track this, to separate the players finishing (again, VOTE to make this happen).

I should also add how much rim pressure each of these player's added, so this could be more meaningful, thank you.

Do it--if you are going to do it by hand, it's gonna take a lot of time, though and – if you're gonna scrub some data then it's possible. I would love to do it, but I just don't have time right now.

Yeah, but I first need people to post their top 15 lists of finishers, here, then I'll do it. Read the OP

[Top10alltime]

Is that it? No more interest, or any lists?

[70sFan]

I am sharing my rough attempt:

1. Shaquille O'Neal
2. Wilt Chamberlain
3. LeBron James
4. Giannis Antetokumpo
5. Charles Barkley

6. Artis Gilmore
7. Dwight Howard
8. Julius Erving
9. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
10. Michael Jordan
11. Dwyane Wade

12. Anthony Davis
13. David Robinson
14. Hakeem Olajuwon
15. George Gervin

Something like that, though it's extremely hard to rank bigs next to guards.

[PistolPeteJR]

You misunderstood. Curry's more efficient, not Kyrie. Kyrie's volume is higher.

Yes, I know. I stated both of these things outright in the post you quoted. I also noted that Kyrie's volume is not that much higher, to the degree that it's debatable as to whether that should offset the efficiency edge [in Steph's favour].

And it's not about style points. It's about the ability to finish in a large plethora of ways while doing so efficiently.

But is he, though [finishing them "efficiently"]? Or does it just stand out in your mind when he DOES finish them in spectacular fashion?
It would take some analysis. It could be that he's only finishing the REALLY high degree of difficulty shots at a rate of ~50%......and finishes the rest at a rate comparable to Steph Curry. i.e. it's possible those occasional REALLY hard finishes he attempts that are drawing his overall % down below Curry's, because Curry will rarely even attempt to go in among the trees if it's going to be that difficult.

The subtext here is that maybe they're not always good attempts to begin with, no matter how acrobatic they look.


I'm just pitching a hypothetical here. But if it were found to be essentially correct, then it is indeed simply awarding Kyrie 'style points' for putting himself in a position to finish a difficult shot (which perhaps should have been reconsidered).

I don’t agree and don’t think it’s purely about style points. The point of this thread is to discuss finisher quality, which includes efficiency, creativity (ie. multiple ways to get around the defense in order to finish at the rim), etc. While Curry’s only slightly more efficient, Kyrie’s volume is greater and finishes in more diverse ways. As previously mentioned, I am not in a position to quantify that, it’s just pure observation on my end. I wouldn’t chalk up said creation purely to “style points”, because it gets the job done. If this thread was about more effective offensive hub, okay, but it’s not that.