'15-16 RealGM Player of the Year Discussion Thread

[GSP]

Donovan showing why he's nowhere on my COY ballot. Down the stretch of a huge game and the entire offense is give the ball to Westbrook or Durant and hope they make a tough shot or they get an OREB. Meanwhile GSW gets good shots for great shooters over and over.

Yeah Donovan had his moments and i like his promise but he showed why he was a rookie coach and im not sure any coach can really make Okc a non-heavy iso offense on a regular basis. Kd/Westbrook as a duo just isnt that. I thought theyd really challenge Kobe/Shaq for best offensive duo but theyll never be on that level. They have too many performances over their postseason careers where one plays terrible, other plays well or they both play poorly.

Donovan not putting Roberson earlier is gonna haunt Okc for a long, long time. Looks like theyre destined to be the 90s Jazz of this era.

And the players were gassing out emotionally and physically. They gave so much more room on switches now its a massive change from earlier in the series. This one is done, game 7 will be a blowout to balance out Okcs insane 1st 2 home performances

[GSP]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Its just a two man race b/w him and Lebron. Id still put Lebron ahead unless Steph severely outplays him in the finals which isnt likely.

[therealbig3]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Nah, I've actually been convinced by others that the missed playoff games is just too big of a deal to ignore.

I can no longer take him over LeBron on my list, even if the Warriors win game 7 and then go on to beat Cleveland in the Finals.

It's not like Curry is playing historically great either. He's been up and down in this series.

[Nbafanatic]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Its just a two man race b/w him and Lebron. Id still put Lebron ahead unless Steph severely outplays him in the finals which isnt likely.

Right now, I have something like this: Lebron, Westbrook, Curry then Durant with today's pivotal bad performance. Westbrook and Durant still have game 7 to turn things around, and Curry having a finals on last year's level plus the title, should do it for him to capture the POY in my mind.

[Nbafanatic]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Nah, I've actually been convinced by others that the missed playoff games is just too big of a deal to ignore.

I can no longer take him over LeBron on my list, even if the Warriors win game 7 and then go on to beat Cleveland in the Finals.

It's not like Curry is playing historically great either. He's been up and down in this series.

Until game 4 I had him out because of those reasons, but with the last two games he regained some very important ground, to me.

[cpower]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Nah, I've actually been convinced by others that the missed playoff games is just too big of a deal to ignore.

I can no longer take him over LeBron on my list, even if the Warriors win game 7 and then go on to beat Cleveland in the Finals.

It's not like Curry is playing historically great either. He's been up and down in this series.

Curry sure has been struggling, but what has Lebron done to surpass Curry so far? Beat the raptors?

[therealbig3]

And just like that, Curry is back in contention.

Nah, I've actually been convinced by others that the missed playoff games is just too big of a deal to ignore.

I can no longer take him over LeBron on my list, even if the Warriors win game 7 and then go on to beat Cleveland in the Finals.

It's not like Curry is playing historically great either. He's been up and down in this series.

Curry sure has been struggling, but what has Lebron done to surpass Curry so far? Beat the raptors?

Well, the biggest thing is that he's actually been available in these playoffs. He didn't miss basically 2 playoff series like Curry did.

And he's played outstanding. The Hawks were the 2nd best defense in the league and he tore them apart.

And those Raptors were a 56-win team this year.

Curry hasn't been himself. I think he's played himself back into a decent playoffs, but he hasn't been near his RS level, and combined with the missed time, I can't have him #1.

[cpower]

Nah, I've actually been convinced by others that the missed playoff games is just too big of a deal to ignore.

I can no longer take him over LeBron on my list, even if the Warriors win game 7 and then go on to beat Cleveland in the Finals.

It's not like Curry is playing historically great either. He's been up and down in this series.

Curry sure has been struggling, but what has Lebron done to surpass Curry so far? Beat the raptors?

Well, the biggest thing is that he's actually been available in these playoffs. He didn't miss basically 2 playoff series like Curry did.

And he's played outstanding. The Hawks were the 2nd best defense in the league and he tore them apart.

And those Raptors were a 56-win team this year.

Curry hasn't been himself. I think he's played himself back into a decent playoffs, but he hasn't been near his RS level, and combined with the missed time, I can't have him #1.

But he had such a big lead in RS. The gap between him and Lebron is like 20 amazing games. Lebron has done nothing to impress me so far. If he will play his finals in 2009 PS form, i might give him the slightest edge. But Curry is in a clear lead for me so far

[lorak]

Donovan showing why he's nowhere on my COY ballot. Down the stretch of a huge game and the entire offense is give the ball to Westbrook or Durant and hope they make a tough shot or they get an OREB. Meanwhile GSW gets good shots for great shooters over and over.

It's not like Warriors played some sophisticated offense down the stretch... The difference is that Klay and Curry were making shots when they played isolation/hero ball, while Durant and RW not.

[RebelWithACause]

Curry sure has been struggling, but what has Lebron done to surpass Curry so far? Beat the raptors?

Well, the biggest thing is that he's actually been available in these playoffs. He didn't miss basically 2 playoff series like Curry did.

And he's played outstanding. The Hawks were the 2nd best defense in the league and he tore them apart.

And those Raptors were a 56-win team this year.

Curry hasn't been himself. I think he's played himself back into a decent playoffs, but he hasn't been near his RS level, and combined with the missed time, I can't have him #1.

But he had such a big lead in RS. The gap between him and Lebron is like 20 amazing games. Lebron has done nothing to impress me so far. If he will play his finals in 2009 PS form, i might give him the slightest edge. But Curry is in a clear lead for me so far

Things really should be put in perspective here.

-Curry had a RS that is in contention for the GOAT RS

- He returned as soon as the 2nd round and helped his team winning the first game of the 1st round.
If the title is your goal, you probably need a supporting cast that is capable of winning a first round against an 8th seed anyway.
So I personally don't punish him too much for that

- obviously since returning he isn't the GOAT caliber player, that we got to see in the RS, but he is still at 28/7/7 on 60 % TS since he returned.
That is still pretty elite!

- it's obvious he isn't at 100 %, since he is noticeably slower and out of rhythm, it has nothing to do with him struggling against OKC.

- If they get to the finals and he is playing up to his standards there it will be very hard to punish him up to that level, like some of you are doing.

[Dr Spaceman]

Donovan showing why he's nowhere on my COY ballot. Down the stretch of a huge game and the entire offense is give the ball to Westbrook or Durant and hope they make a tough shot or they get an OREB. Meanwhile GSW gets good shots for great shooters over and over.

Why would Donovan go away from what had his team in the lead for the previous 282 minutes?

[Dr Spaceman]

Man. Klay is going to get all the attention for last night, and understandably so, but that 2nd half was one of the most impressive ensemble performances I can remember. Bogut's offensive rebounding was ENORMOUS, and there's no player in the league I'd take to guard Kevin freaking Durant with no help down the stretch of the 4th quarter. Iguodala just had one of the GOAT role player games I can remember, you could literally see the team screw its collective heads back on when he was in the game.

Ironically this series may end up strengthening their claim as GOAT team in my mind.

[Texas Chuck]

Donovan showing why he's nowhere on my COY ballot. Down the stretch of a huge game and the entire offense is give the ball to Westbrook or Durant and hope they make a tough shot or they get an OREB. Meanwhile GSW gets good shots for great shooters over and over.

Why would Donovan go away from what had his team in the lead for the previous 282 minutes?

Really? I'm honestly surprised at how much backlash I've gotten over this post. But I've covered this before: KD and Westbrook are extraordinary offensive talents. So you can have a simple system with tons of iso ball and score lots of points and have nice otrgs and be really successful---as they have been.

But you could do even better if you had even a little bit more structure particularly down the stretch of a game you absolutely have to win when KD and Westbrook are clearly fatigued playing against very good individual and team defenders who know they don't have to worry about much of anything happening off-ball.

I don't see why earlier success based on sheer talent should make us praise Donovan. Or why it should make us give him a pass for going exclusively to iso-ball.

[Krodis]

Donovan really has made a lot of good moves though. The offense may not be sophisticated but there's some wrinkles in it that have helped, and he's made really good adjustments over the last couple series. (Playing Kanter +Adams vs the Spurs and having Roberson as the pick and roll big man in small lineups vs the Warriors were both very inspired adjustments). But whatever offensive structure or pace pushing or picking their spots there is just goes away late to isolate a good but not great ball handler in Durant on one of the 5 or 10 best perimeter defenders ever from the 3 point line.

[Dr Spaceman]

Donovan showing why he's nowhere on my COY ballot. Down the stretch of a huge game and the entire offense is give the ball to Westbrook or Durant and hope they make a tough shot or they get an OREB. Meanwhile GSW gets good shots for great shooters over and over.

Why would Donovan go away from what had his team in the lead for the previous 282 minutes?

Really? I'm honestly surprised at how much backlash I've gotten over this post. But I've covered this before: KD and Westbrook are extraordinary offensive talents. So you can have a simple system with tons of iso ball and score lots of points and have nice otrgs and be really successful---as they have been.

But you could do even better if you had even a little bit more structure particularly down the stretch of a game you absolutely have to win when KD and Westbrook are clearly fatigued playing against very good individual and team defenders who know they don't have to worry about much of anything happening off-ball.

I don't see why earlier success based on sheer talent should make us praise Donovan. Or why it should make us give him a pass for going exclusively to iso-ball.

Not trying to tear you down Chuck, but in my opinion Donovan having more offensive structure isn't going to stop Westbrook waving off every screen like he's AI and taking early clock contested 3s, nor making the worst possible decision on an inbounds pass. Nor is it going to stop Klay Thompson morphing into the GOAT two-way force.

We can't forget GSW are heavy, heavy favorites in this series. Even Down 3-1, they by every measure are the far better team. Them losing this series this way doesn't mean any more to me than them losing any other way, the Warriors just outclass them. I mean Westbrook is a 7 year vet now, at some point you just can't tame the beast.

[Texas Chuck]

Of course they were underdogs. But so what. They had every chance to close that series out last night.

And I know its popular here to suggest that Westbrook can only play one way. I guess I refuse to buy that. Yes you have to live with some of his aggressive mistakes, but do we honestly think that if Pop or Rick were coaching this team that we would still be seeing this simplistic of offense? Of course not.

And so for me that's enough that I'm not elevating Donovan on my COY ballot.

[lorak]

Of course they were underdogs. But so what. They had every chance to close that series out last night.

And I know its popular here to suggest that Westbrook can only play one way. I guess I refuse to buy that. Yes you have to live with some of his aggressive mistakes, but do we honestly think that if Pop or Rick were coaching this team that we would still be seeing this simplistic of offense? Of course not.

Down the stretch yes, because that's what happened with Spurs afterall.

[Dr Spaceman]

Of course they were underdogs. But so what. They had every chance to close that series out last night.

And I know its popular here to suggest that Westbrook can only play one way. I guess I refuse to buy that. Yes you have to live with some of his aggressive mistakes, but do we honestly think that if Pop or Rick were coaching this team that we would still be seeing this simplistic of offense? Of course not.

And so for me that's enough that I'm not elevating Donovan on my COY ballot.

Well maybe I'm misinterpreting you here because I don't know where Donovan is on your COY list now. But my point was more that the Thunder losing last night had more to do with mistakes players were making that couldn't be fixed by Pop or Rick or whoever unless they had a remote control tapped into their players' brains.

[Dr Spaceman]

.

Random thought that popped into my head: it seems like in recent years we've had kind of an epidemic of stars having a really tough time making sense of the defenses they're shown. We saw it with LeBron, Durant, Curry, etc... I wonder if this is A. A real thing or just recency bias and B. Owing to advancing techniques and influence of coaches or C. Some other factor.

Would appreciate your thoughts on this.

[RSCD3_]

I dont know if its just me but a lot of lebron's performance in the playoffs is based on how he performs in the finals. If he pulls another sub 50 TS% performance and curry lights it up id probably have curry above lebron. How well he performed vs the pistons and hawks dont impact me on his playoffs as much as how he does vs the warriors.

Also if the cavs get swept or blown out like the spurs and curry plays reasonably well it's gonna be hard for me to personally put lebron ahead of curry...He's facing a better team but his support is higher han t ws last year by a lot more than the warriors have improved.