The LeBron Thread 2021 Off-Season Edition

[TroubleS0me]

https://www.pickswise.com/anti-social-media/

saw this posted on twitter and the fact that black athletes in predominantly white countries/sports dominate the list is sad yet expected

'im surprised Lillard is that high on the list, thought he was likeable

[Freighttrain]

Oh hey look, a guy putting up monster stats in the finals and his teammates are nowhere to be found in the finals. Haven't seen that one before.

[Baski]

https://www.pickswise.com/anti-social-media/

saw this posted on twitter and the fact that black athletes in predominantly white countries/sports dominate the list is sad yet expected

"NOBODY is as hated as Curry/Westbrook/Harden/Durant/Jokic/Luka waa waa"

"I don't understand why LeBron is such a slimeball and gets a pass waa waa"

"LeBron and the Nike/ESPN machine have successfully brainwashed the masses into thinking he's so great but I know the truth"

[falcolombardi]

is even more interesting cause nobody else has that volume. brady/messi/ronaldo/ tennis big 3

in fact those guys are not even #1 for their sports, Marcus rashford amd washed ozil are no one idea of top players in soccer

ozil, rightfully or wrongly called germany coach bigoted against him for being ethnically turkish, rashford is a black guy in england team which is a well known hate sink reasom in United kingdom media

other guys include the only black pilot in nascar

in general the whole thingh has a strong racial component imo, black guys who are outspoken about racism (even those like ozil who may have been wrong there since nobody else had a issue with germany coach ) or are black in traditionally white fields stand out

it is telling when a outspoken black player in england that is not even top 50 in relevancy receivers more hate messages than superstars like messi or ronaldo

it shows hate to athletes is not only "a normal thingh that happens to every succesful athlete" like is often said in usa media. but usually has other reasons behind

[Mos_Heat]

is even more interesting cause nobody else has that volume. brady/messi/ronaldo/ tennis big 3

in fact those guys are not even #1 for their sports, Marcus rashford amd washed ozil are no one idea of top players in soccer

ozil, rightfully or wrongly called germany coach bigoted against him for being ethnically turkish, rashford is a black guy in england team which is a well known hate sink reasom in United kingdom media

other guys include the only black pilot in nascar

in general the whole thingh has a strong racial component imo, black guys who are outspoken about racism (even those like ozil who may have been wrong there since nobody else had a issue with germany coach ) or are black in traditionally white fields stand out

it is telling when a outspoken black player in england that is not even top 50 in relevancy receivers more hate messages than superstars like messi or ronaldo

it shows hate to athletes is not only "a normal thingh that happens to every succesful athlete" like is often said in usa media. but usually has other reasons behind

Sports fans don't like politics in sports.

[McBubbles]

is even more interesting cause nobody else has that volume. brady/messi/ronaldo/ tennis big 3

in fact those guys are not even #1 for their sports, Marcus rashford amd washed ozil are no one idea of top players in soccer

ozil, rightfully or wrongly called germany coach bigoted against him for being ethnically turkish, rashford is a black guy in england team which is a well known hate sink reasom in United kingdom media

other guys include the only black pilot in nascar

in general the whole thingh has a strong racial component imo, black guys who are outspoken about racism (even those like ozil who may have been wrong there since nobody else had a issue with germany coach ) or are black in traditionally white fields stand out

it is telling when a outspoken black player in england that is not even top 50 in relevancy receivers more hate messages than superstars like messi or ronaldo

it shows hate to athletes is not only "a normal thingh that happens to every succesful athlete" like is often said in usa media. but usually has other reasons behind

Sports fans don't like politics in sports.

I can't speak for every country, but at least when it comes to Britain and the US that statement is a myth. Sports fans love politics in sports as long as it's conservative politics and not liberal politics.

Singing the national anthem, literally blessing the queen, bowing down to a flag, honouring veterans and the police state, having god damn fighter jets fly over games. Shiiiet, Tim Tebow had fuggin Bible verses on his face and the media loved him. I guarantee you if LeBron James insulted Russia, prayed to Jesus, talked about how the police are great and how they're only two genders on a semi regular basis all these "get politics out of sports" "sports is too woke" folks would be calling him a truth teller.

[homecourtloss]

Rajon Rondo and Dwight Howard had terrible post seasons. Yes, LeBron isn’t responsible for all their success last season, but interesting that both become big negative players the year they’re away from James when last year Rondo was a positive and Howard useful and a slight negative perhaps. Through the years, how many players who were completely useless elsewhere helped win titles and make deep runs with LeBron?

Rondo:

-2.7 BPM,
-6.4 ON, -14.8 ON-OFF, benched in elimination games
-11.8 RAPTOR, lowest of 100 qualifying players

Howard:

-2.5 BPM
-8.8 ON, -23.0 ON-OFF
-9.7 RAPTOR, 2nd lowest of 100 qualifying players

[thebigbird]

is even more interesting cause nobody else has that volume. brady/messi/ronaldo/ tennis big 3

in fact those guys are not even #1 for their sports, Marcus rashford amd washed ozil are no one idea of top players in soccer

ozil, rightfully or wrongly called germany coach bigoted against him for being ethnically turkish, rashford is a black guy in england team which is a well known hate sink reasom in United kingdom media

other guys include the only black pilot in nascar

in general the whole thingh has a strong racial component imo, black guys who are outspoken about racism (even those like ozil who may have been wrong there since nobody else had a issue with germany coach ) or are black in traditionally white fields stand out

it is telling when a outspoken black player in england that is not even top 50 in relevancy receivers more hate messages than superstars like messi or ronaldo

it shows hate to athletes is not only "a normal thingh that happens to every succesful athlete" like is often said in usa media. but usually has other reasons behind

Sports fans don't like politics in sports.

I can't speak for every country, but at least when it comes to Britain and the US that statement is a myth. Sports fans love politics in sports as long as it's conservative politics and not liberal politics.

Singing the national anthem, literally blessing the queen, bowing down to a flag, honouring veterans and the police state, having god damn fighter jets fly over games. Shiiiet, Tim Tebow had fuggin Bible verses on his face and the media loved him. I guarantee you if LeBron James insulted Russia, prayed to Jesus, talked about how the police are great and how they're only two genders on a semi regular basis all these "get politics out of sports" "sports is too woke" folks would be calling him a truth teller.

I don’t want to turn this into a political thread, but most of the things you listed aren’t “conservative politics.” There isn’t anything “conservative” and “not liberal” about singing the national anthem, honoring veterans, having fighter jets fly over games, etc.

[falcolombardi]

Sports fans don't like politics in sports.

I can't speak for every country, but at least when it comes to Britain and the US that statement is a myth. Sports fans love politics in sports as long as it's conservative politics and not liberal politics.

Singing the national anthem, literally blessing the queen, bowing down to a flag, honouring veterans and the police state, having god damn fighter jets fly over games. Shiiiet, Tim Tebow had fuggin Bible verses on his face and the media loved him. I guarantee you if LeBron James insulted Russia, prayed to Jesus, talked about how the police are great and how they're only two genders on a semi regular basis all these "get politics out of sports" "sports is too woke" folks would be calling him a truth teller.

I don’t want to turn this into a political thread, but most of the things you listed aren’t “conservative politics.” There isn’t anything “conservative” and “not liberal” about singing the national anthem, honoring veterans, having fighter jets fly over games, etc.

at risk of further moving this thread into politics...neither should be political or "liberal politics"to talk about racism but it still is viewed as such

marcus rashford, the footballer with most hate messages in that list is hated for talking about racism experiemced. nothingh about actual politics

this is a guy who in nba terms, is a darius gsrland level "star" in soccer yet seemingly receives more hate that ultra prominent worldwide stars like ronaldo amd messi

[dcstanley]

Sports fans don't like politics in sports.

I can't speak for every country, but at least when it comes to Britain and the US that statement is a myth. Sports fans love politics in sports as long as it's conservative politics and not liberal politics.

Singing the national anthem, literally blessing the queen, bowing down to a flag, honouring veterans and the police state, having god damn fighter jets fly over games. Shiiiet, Tim Tebow had fuggin Bible verses on his face and the media loved him. I guarantee you if LeBron James insulted Russia, prayed to Jesus, talked about how the police are great and how they're only two genders on a semi regular basis all these "get politics out of sports" "sports is too woke" folks would be calling him a truth teller.

I don’t want to turn this into a political thread, but most of the things you listed aren’t “conservative politics.” There isn’t anything “conservative” and “not liberal” about singing the national anthem, honoring veterans, having fighter jets fly over games, etc.

None of them are inherently political but neither is a pandemic.. The anthem in particular has been a hot button political issue over the years. If Lebron criticized Kaepernick for kneeling those same fans that are against the intersection of sports and politics would be buying his jersey.

[D.Brasco]

For those who followed LeBron's career from day one, the irrational hate he's received existed way before he became known as political which is really only the last few years.

He was hated from day 1 when this "overhyped" HS kid was getting his games broadcast on national TV and being on the cover of Sports Illustrated. LeBron had so many people hoping he'd be a draft bust or fail to live up the hype, instead he arguably and improbably blew the hype away with what he achieved.

In my belief LeBron was/is hated as he was truly the first post Jordan player who ever looked like a legit threat to Jordan as GOAT argument. Kobe was hated at first by a lot of Jordan fans early on too but once it became clear he wouldn't ever really challenge Jordan's legacy they backed off.

[homecourtloss]

For those who followed LeBron's career from day one, the irrational hate he's received existed way before he became known as political which is really only the last few years.

He was hated from day 1 when this "overhyped" HS kid was getting his games broadcast on national TV and being on the cover of Sports Illustrated. LeBron had so many people hoping he'd be a draft bust or fail to live up the hype, instead he arguably and improbably blew the hype away with what he achieved.

In my belief LeBron was/is hated as he was truly the first post Jordan player who ever looked like a legit threat to Jordan as GOAT argument. Kobe was hated at first by a lot of Jordan fans early on too but once it became clear he wouldn't ever really challenge Jordan's legacy they backed off.

There’s literally proof of what you say right here on ReaGM. The poster JordansBulls used to post anti-Kobe things and prop young LeBron but as soon as it was clear that impact metrics and advanced stats made it clear that Kobe would never be a threat Jordan, but Lebron’s stats would, you had the narratives from Jordan’s old guard begin to start the anti-Bron narratives.

[D.Brasco]

For those who followed LeBron's career from day one, the irrational hate he's received existed way before he became known as political which is really only the last few years.

He was hated from day 1 when this "overhyped" HS kid was getting his games broadcast on national TV and being on the cover of Sports Illustrated. LeBron had so many people hoping he'd be a draft bust or fail to live up the hype, instead he arguably and improbably blew the hype away with what he achieved.

In my belief LeBron was/is hated as he was truly the first post Jordan player who ever looked like a legit threat to Jordan as GOAT argument. Kobe was hated at first by a lot of Jordan fans early on too but once it became clear he wouldn't ever really challenge Jordan's legacy they backed off.

There’s literally proof of what you say isn’t here on ReaGM. The poster JordansBulls used to post anti-Kobe things and prop young LeBron but as soon as it was clear that impact metrics and advanced stats made it clear that Kobe would never be a threat Jordan, but Lebron’s stats would, you had the narratives from Jordan’s old guard begin to start the anti-Bron narratives.

Jordan fans were used to the "next Jordan" player types getting exposed quite early as not being able to live up to the hype or threat. From true duds like Harold Miner to actually good players like Grant Hill and Vince Carter, T-Mac, Kobe etc. Eventually after a few seasons it became evident none of those would be able to make a true argument against surpassing MJ.

LeBron however was the total opposite, his case just became stronger and stronger year by year.

It's a total revision as I mentioned that if LeBron were less political he'd more liked, maybe by a little but MJs shadow and his fans especially was a much bigger impact on that.

The "Miami decision" show was a dumb PR move but players have done much worst things for much less hate.

[SeniorWalker]

LeBron gets hate for his political stances because he's not genuine about them. He does whatever his corporate overlords tell him to do for his brand building and because in the west it is very easy to take non-stances like "fk trump" and "equality", etc. And many guys do, LeBron is just the biggest one but his legions of fans believe him and that's the travesty.

I have no issue with him or any athlete having a voice or opinion but I'm not going to take them seriously just because they have one. And LeBron has not shown really even a modicum of careful thought on political issues, he really knows zilch and it's really a joke that people compare him to Ali, who was far more serious and informed, and risked it all in a truly hostile environment which popular media was not supportive of him and many of his peers, the total opposite of today.

I think LeBron has gotten a lot of hate. I don't think all of it is fair all of the time but a hell of a lot of it is deserved. His team put a target on his back with a lot of things he said and did and he has to live with that. To his credit, LeBron has had an incredible career and managed to keep his image (with a lot of help) very clean. Good for him, honestly.

[falcolombardi]

this may be the okc fan in me talking but i am always surprised that so many people have dursnt as default best player these years

he literally has 1 healthy playoffs run in 3 years where he went evenly (arguably outplayed slightly) with giannis

the other years he was unhealthy and his team made the finals without him for half of that run or missed the year altogher

lebron actually has as many full series played the past 3 years , kawhi has more, curry has as many and he is a dude who missed the playoffs in 2021 and got hurt all of 2020

and i think all of those 3 have similar or better series in that period

why do so many people default to durant as best player? i unironically think he has a better case in 2017-2018 when his team was absurd.
2019-2021 is a total crapshoot period

[Mos_Heat]

I can't speak for every country, but at least when it comes to Britain and the US that statement is a myth. Sports fans love politics in sports as long as it's conservative politics and not liberal politics.

Singing the national anthem, literally blessing the queen, bowing down to a flag, honouring veterans and the police state, having god damn fighter jets fly over games. Shiiiet, Tim Tebow had fuggin Bible verses on his face and the media loved him. I guarantee you if LeBron James insulted Russia, prayed to Jesus, talked about how the police are great and how they're only two genders on a semi regular basis all these "get politics out of sports" "sports is too woke" folks would be calling him a truth teller.

I don’t want to turn this into a political thread, but most of the things you listed aren’t “conservative politics.” There isn’t anything “conservative” and “not liberal” about singing the national anthem, honoring veterans, having fighter jets fly over games, etc.

at risk of further moving this thread into politics...neither should be political or "liberal politics"to talk about racism but it still is viewed as such

marcus rashford, the footballer with most hate messages in that list is hated for talking about racism experiemced. nothingh about actual politics

this is a guy who in nba terms, is a darius gsrland level "star" in soccer yet seemingly receives more hate that ultra prominent worldwide stars like ronaldo amd messi

He's not hated for fighting racism, please. Jordan Henderson is as much if not more outspoken than him. It's a combination of factors, but the main reason I would guess, that a young and quite frankly massively overhyped dude, instead of focusing on the game is beefing with Prime Minister. I'm not saying he deserves this, btw

[TroubleS0me]

Read on Twitter

[kayess]

Rajon Rondo and Dwight Howard had terrible post seasons. Yes, LeBron isn’t responsible for all their success last season, but interesting that both become big negative players the year they’re away from James when last year Rondo was a positive and Howard useful and a slight negative perhaps. Through the years, how many players who were completely useless elsewhere helped win titles and make deep runs with LeBron?

Rondo:

-2.7 BPM,
-6.4 ON, -14.8 ON-OFF, benched in elimination games
-11.8 RAPTOR, lowest of 100 qualifying players

Howard:

-2.5 BPM
-8.8 ON, -23.0 ON-OFF
-9.7 RAPTOR, 2nd lowest of 100 qualifying players

Too **** many. But that won't stop the irrational haters from saying his teams are too stacked, etc.

[kayess]

LeBron gets hate for his political stances because he's not genuine about them. He does whatever his corporate overlords tell him to do for his brand building and because in the west it is very easy to take non-stances like "fk trump" and "equality", etc. And many guys do, LeBron is just the biggest one but his legions of fans believe him and that's the travesty.

I have no issue with him or any athlete having a voice or opinion but I'm not going to take them seriously just because they have one. And LeBron has not shown really even a modicum of careful thought on political issues, he really knows zilch and it's really a joke that people compare him to Ali, who was far more serious and informed, and risked it all in a truly hostile environment which popular media was not supportive of him and many of his peers, the total opposite of today.

I think LeBron has gotten a lot of hate. I don't think all of it is fair all of the time but a hell of a lot of it is deserved. His team put a target on his back with a lot of things he said and did and he has to live with that. To his credit, LeBron has had an incredible career and managed to keep his image (with a lot of help) very clean. Good for him, honestly.

Lol you have to be delusional to think he gets hatred because he's not genuine about them. Dude donated money to help people vote, put pressure on the NBA to show more support for BLM, paid for underprivileged kids going to college... Most of the hate is 100% because conservative nutjobs can't take it.

"Not shown really even a modicum of careful thought" LMAO, do you really need "careful thought" on the topics he's supported? Absolutely mind-bogglingly bad hot take.

The only legitimate reason to hate on James for his political stances are his take on the China (absolutely godawful, he should be crucified on that alone), and his inconsistency (supporting BLM but being quiet on SJAX's outspoken support of an anti-semite). On the latter, sure you can argue that he's not obliged to comment on everything, but that was in the wake of the George Floyd stuff and would have sent a powerful message. It's clear he didn't want to step on some toes.

And no, NOT good on him for being able to keep a clean image if that's not what he deserves. All the good and bad have to be taken together, just like Ali. Guy ragged on Joe Frazier and claimed he represented the unheard part of America; imagined doing that when you're a middle-class kid talking to someone who grew up in abject poverty, in **** sharecropper county. But it's ok, it was for "promotion" LMAO. Also made some extremely sexist comments, had a relationship with a 16 year-old (as a 30+ year old), was a philanderer, and had some reaaally questionable views on race (as well as questionable alignments). He's almost the opposite of LeBron, people view his legacy without much criticism, while LeBron gets hated on for (mostly) the wrong things viz his political views, as people have forgotten about his China comments already.

[falcolombardi]

Rajon Rondo and Dwight Howard had terrible post seasons. Yes, LeBron isn’t responsible for all their success last season, but interesting that both become big negative players the year they’re away from James when last year Rondo was a positive and Howard useful and a slight negative perhaps. Through the years, how many players who were completely useless elsewhere helped win titles and make deep runs with LeBron?

Rondo:

-2.7 BPM,
-6.4 ON, -14.8 ON-OFF, benched in elimination games
-11.8 RAPTOR, lowest of 100 qualifying players

Howard:

-2.5 BPM
-8.8 ON, -23.0 ON-OFF
-9.7 RAPTOR, 2nd lowest of 100 qualifying players

Too **** many. But that won't stop the irrational haters from saying his teams are too stacked, etc.

in fairness i dont think everyone does it in bad faith. they just judge basketball talent in very superficial name recognition/boxscore totals ways

is why many people thought warriors vs cavs was a fair big 3 vs big 3 duel
they had it as durant/curry/KLAY big 3 vs lebron/kyrie/love big 3

ignoring draymond, fit, role players, having irving anywhere close to curry etc

lebron has played with many good scorers simce 2011 and that makes peopke overstimate his teams stackedness
comparatively a team like jordan bulls stackedness is understimated because it didnt have many great scorers or big names (most people dont even remember horace grant, let alone know he was an all star level player)