The Lebron Thread (Pt. 3)

[toodles23]

Disagree about Wade. The key switch in the series was Wade playing well at the same time of Lebron.

In general Lebron was great in elimination games, but very ordinary in non-eliminations. His defense dropped off this year some, and Miami's #9 DRtg for the year kinda reflected that. Offensively Lebron was much better at utilizing his cast in 2012, and he picked his spots better.

2012 Lebron wouldn't have gone 7 games against the Pacers or Spurs.

You're right, Miami would've lost to the Spurs in 6. Lebron made more jumpers tonight than he did in the entire 2012 Finals; no chance they win with his jumper that broke.

And lol @ utilizing his cast better in 2012. He took more shots, assisted less, and the Heat performed markedly worse on the offensive end. Care to actually back your assertions up with more than ridiculous conjecture?

[therealbig3]

I'll admit I've been a prisoner of the moment this year with LeBron, but I've maintained that I see LeBron making my top 5 if he's able to play well in the playoffs...and he did. He played extremely well, and a lot of what he did well went beyond just scoring. It was certainly a dropoff from the regular season...but his regular season was GOAT-caliber...he dropped to a little less than GOAT-caliber in the playoffs. Overall, there just aren't more than 4 other players that I'd take over a prime LeBron James and that I believe gives a random team a better shot at a title.

1. Michael Jordan
2. Bill Russell
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4. Shaquille O'Neal
5. LeBron James

Yes, he's surpassed Magic and Bird imo.

[D.Brasco]

What were his final stats in the end?

[CJ_18]

THIS is where we true fans who stuck with him and never questioned him in this thread celebrate!! I see tons of y'all posting in here congratulating him when you've been picking every little thing in his game apart up until today..

CLUTCH AS THEY COME!! The Man is BIGTIME

[An Unbiased Fan]

Disagree about Wade. The key switch in the series was Wade playing well at the same time of Lebron.

In general Lebron was great in elimination games, but very ordinary in non-eliminations. His defense dropped off this year some, and Miami's #9 DRtg for the year kinda reflected that. Offensively Lebron was much better at utilizing his cast in 2012, and he picked his spots better.

2012 Lebron wouldn't have gone 7 games against the Pacers or Spurs.

You're right, Miami would've lost to the Spurs in 6. Lebron made more jumpers tonight than he did in the entire 2012 Finals; no chance they win with his jumper that broke.

And lol @ utilizing his cast better in 2012. He took more shots, assisted less, and the Heat performed markedly worse on the offensive end. Care to actually back your assertions up with more than ridiculous conjecture?

Utilization isn't about how much you shoot, or your assist count. It's about HOW you play, and HOW you use your teammates. The Heat won because this game was 5 on 5, instead of 1 on 5.

[The Explorer]

This has been my top 12 for some time. I said if James wins another title he could crack this list. I would put him ahead of Erving for now, and re-evaluate after some time again.

1. Jordan
2. Russell
3. Abdul-Jabbar
4. Chamberlain
5. Johnson
6. Olajuwon
7. Bird
8. O'neal
9. Robertson
10. Duncan
11. Bryant
12. Erving

[JordansBulls]

What were his final stats in the end?

25/11/7 on 45% FG

[D.Brasco]

What were his final stats in the end?

25/11/7 on 45% FG

Hmm for all the flack he got those are some pretty nice stats still.

[toodles23]

Utilization isn't about how much you shoot, or your assist count. It's about HOW you play, and HOW you use your teammates. The Heat won because this game was 5 on 5, instead of 1 on 5.

And Miami's offense was markedly better this year, with Lebron being the primary catalyst in that improvement. I find it very hard to believe that worse offense from Lebron led to better offense for the Heat.

You've yet to supply a single shred of evidence showing that Lebron was better offensively last year - all you've done is state your opinion over and over without backing it up with anything.

[mademan]

I'm not sure how Lebron doesn't crack top7ish right now. Hakeem/Bird/Kobe all have the same number of FMVP's, less r.season MVP's, peaked lower all while being worse on both sides of the ball (save for Hakeem on D). And Lebron now has played 10 years and has been a superstar for 8 of them. He's in the discussion with Shaq/Duncan, imo, and he just left Bird/Hakeem/Kobe in the dust.

[mademan]

What were his final stats in the end?

25/11/7 on 45% FG

Hmm for all the flack he got those are some pretty nice stats still.

You should see the splits. First 3 games, and last 4 games.

[SideshowBob]

Jumpshooting by series (BBR)

Code: Select all

Year     Series     FG     FGA     eFG%

2009     Detroit    4.8    12.0   .427
2009     Atlanta    6.0    12.8   .598
2009     Orlando    5.8    15.5   .435
2010     Chicago    6.2    12.8   .586
2010     Boston     3.8    11.5   .384
2011     76ers      4.4    11.6   .414
2011     Boston     6.0    15.8   .443
2011     Chicago    5.4    13.8   .442
2011     Dallas     3.5     9.8   .432
2012     Knicks     4.8    13.0   .423
2012     Pacers     5.5    14.8   .388
2012     Boston     6.4    15.9   .446
2012     Thunder    3.4    12.6   .294
2013     Bucks      2.8     6.3   .500
2013     Chicago    2.6     9.0   .356
2013     Pacers     5.7    13.1   .516

Code: Select all

Year     Series     FG     FGA     eFG%

2013     Spurs      4.5     14.0  .363

Updated

Code: Select all

Year     Series     FG     FGA     eFG%

2013     Spurs      5.3     15.0  .410

[GSP]

Sideshowbob whats your final Srs rating for Lebron this year or do u still need to think about it?

[dynamic duo]

LeGOAT when it's all said and done and it's not even close.

[SideshowBob]

:D

Sideshowbob whats your final Srs rating for Lebron this year or do u still need to think about it?

+7.0 Offense, +3.0 Defense, +10.0 Overall

[LikeABosh]

37 points on 52% shooting, but apparently all that matters is lebron started out 1-5 for the first 14 minutes

[SideshowBob]

4th Quarter vs. SAS (PS)

2013

Code: Select all

MP    PTS    ORB    DRB    TRB    AST    BLK    STL    TO    TS%
9.4   7.7    1.0    2.3    3.3    1.3    0.3    0.4    0.9  .633

2007

Code: Select all

MP    PTS    ORB    DRB    TRB    AST    BLK    STL    TO    TS%
11.6  9.8    0.3    1.8    2.0    2.3    0.3    1.0    1.8  .565

Wouldn't make anything of that, just thought it was interesting.

[GreenHat]

To be fair, I do believe 2009 James would've been more equipped to attack the paint (if his jumper was shady, like it has been for the most part of the series) than this version of LeBron.

I don't know, I feel like a lot of people are underestimating the player LeBron was in Cleveland, he was a beast, sometimes it takes a little bit of luck (and teammate production) to win titles.

He didn't win it all so he couldn't have been good.

But yeah I agree Cleveland Lebron is underrated. The funny thing is if they weren't so good (60+ wins) the expectations wouldn't have been so high. Lebron would be more well regarded as a player to most people if his team didn't over achieve so much because of his amazing play. That's the "logic" that we're up against.

[Rasho_libre]

Why people even respond to unbiased fan baffles me. Lebron is a way better defender this year than last. Trust me, eye test is all you need.

[GreenHat]

No way, Lebron was better last year on offense & defense.

Defense? Probably, but as I stated a few pages back it has to do with consistency, not ability though. Lebron is more athletic this season, so he is quicker with his switches, close outs, etc. He is also smarter and more experienced which is always a plus.

Offense? No chance, Lebron was much better this season with his improved jump shot, finishing ability, and ability to get to the basket. I really doubt his post-game declined either. He didn't go to it as much as he should have, but I think that's more so on Spo than on him.

I think Lebron's struggles shooting in the Finals was a blessing in disguise because it forced him to rely more on his teammates, and that's what turned this series around for the Heat.

Lebron shooting struggled in the Finals and it was all on him, but overall he could have played much better had Wade not played. Wade was just getting in his way and forcing the Spurs to be able to load up on him. It took away Lebron's biggest strength which is driving to the basket.

As the stat showed before Game 7, the Heat are WAY better with Lebron and without Wade and it's because they surround him with shooters when Wade is out.

Wade has been his problem.

Disagree about Wade. The key switch in the series was Wade playing well at the same time of Lebron.

In general Lebron was great in elimination games, but very ordinary in non-eliminations. His defense dropped off this year some, and Miami's #9 DRtg for the year kinda reflected that. Offensively Lebron was much better at utilizing his cast in 2012, and he picked his spots better.

2012 Lebron wouldn't have gone 7 games against the Pacers or Spurs.

Wade didn't play well at the same time as Lebron for much of the series. Just look at the lineup data.

Also The #9 Drtg comes almost entirely from a drop in def rebounding. They went from above average to one of the worst in the league which hurt their Drtg. The other three factors were constant. It wasn't Lebron's fault. Spo just went small. Its clear from your ignorance on the issue that you didn't watch the Heat closely during the season and are just grasping at straws to hate.