The Lebron Thread (Pt. 2)

[bondom34]

2013 LeBron is the best Lebron to date, but as a Lebron fan I'm not sure he's my favorite Lebron to watch. Sometimes I miss Cleveland LeBron. I marvel at his efficiency nowadays, but from a selfish fan standpoint looking to be entertained, I wish he wasn't so selective at times looking for his shot. I also think he economizes his energy output a lot more nowadays

This is definitely my favorite version of Lebron to watch. He just plays with such intelligence on both ends of the floor now, almost in a Magic/Bird way. While watching him heat check and take bad shots was entertaining on occasion, it quickly gets frustrating when the shots aren't going in (usually the case), it's the same reason why I was never really a fan of Kobe's game. I'm just not entertained by bad shot selection and decision making.

Not trying to make any statement of causation, but this is the 2nd time Lebron's shown a substantial jump in level of play following an Olympic Summer.

Seems to me like it's probably a coincidence, unless somehow the Olympics were responsible for the greatly improved mobility last summer.

This Heat team on offense is one of the most fun teams I've ever watched. And when they're playing at their highest on defense that half of the court is pretty damn entertaining as well.

So even if Lebron as an individual is not as entertaining (which I don't necessarily agree with), he's still delivering a more entertaining offense overall.

Agreed, this is insane to watch the guy perform like this. I feel like its statistically not as dominant as 09 was, but that his comfort level is higher in Miami than it used to be in Cleveland, where he knew he had to ball out every night or it was an L. There's gotta be a huge comfort factor in that he has teammates he can trust to reliably score in a game, and he does trust them too, which is amazing.

[bondom34]

2013 LeBron is the best Lebron to date, but as a Lebron fan I'm not sure he's my favorite Lebron to watch. Sometimes I miss Cleveland LeBron. I marvel at his efficiency nowadays, but from a selfish fan standpoint looking to be entertained, I wish he wasn't so selective at times looking for his shot. I also think he economizes his energy output a lot more nowadays

This is definitely my favorite version of Lebron to watch. He just plays with such intelligence on both ends of the floor now, almost in a Magic/Bird way. While watching him heat check and take bad shots was entertaining on occasion, it quickly gets frustrating when the shots aren't going in (usually the case), it's the same reason why I was never really a fan of Kobe's game. I'm just not entertained by bad shot selection and decision making.

Not trying to make any statement of causation, but this is the 2nd time Lebron's shown a substantial jump in level of play following an Olympic Summer.

Seems to me like it's probably a coincidence, unless somehow the Olympics were responsible for the greatly improved mobility last summer.

This Heat team on offense is one of the most fun teams I've ever watched. And when they're playing at their highest on defense that half of the court is pretty damn entertaining as well.

So even if Lebron as an individual is not as entertaining (which I don't necessarily agree with), he's still delivering a more entertaining offense overall.

Agreed, this is insane to watch the guy perform like this. I feel like its statistically not as dominant as 09 was, but that his comfort level is higher in Miami than it used to be in Cleveland, where he knew he had to ball out every night or it was an L. There's gotta be a huge comfort factor in that he has teammates he can trust to reliably score in a game, and he does trust them too, which is amazing.

[TheChosen618]

Lebron was probably more fun to watch in Cleveland 2009-2010 but that was because he was the Maverick of the team. The guy that did it all and had to do it all or his team would have no shot what so ever.

In terms of which Lebron was better, it's definitely Miami Lebron. I think both 2012 and 2013 Lebron are better than any versions of Cleveland.

The only reason why he wasn't better in 2011 was because he looked big and not big in a strength sense either. He actually looked kind of out of shape and it might have been why he looked tired and fatigued in the Finals. It truly would not surprise me if he was out of shape since he was crazy arrogant thinking he could win that many titles and win them like its nothing. The other reason why his 2011 season was clearly worse than his 2009 and 2010 years was because it was his first year in Miami. He had new teammates, new roles, new everything, so he had to adjust and do all sorts of stuff.

2013 Lebron is currently the best version though. I'm hoping for an even better version in 2014 though.

[GreenHat]

While I agree this is probably the best, most refined LeBron version we have seen, I think people also need to realize that playing for this Heat team (as oppose to playing for those Cavs) makes a huge difference in one's stats (especially efficiency wise).

On the Cavs he had to be the alpha and the omega, he still has to do a lot of what he did in Cleveland in Miami (facilitating, scoring, handling, rebounding) but everything just comes at a higher efficiency when you're playing with Chalmers,Wade,Battier,Bosh,Allen instead of Williams,West,Varejao,Big Z,Gibson, there's a huge disparity in offensive talent, ability to create something, spacing, everything, which makes LeBron's game on offense that much easier.

This is the difference here as well. Not to mention the major injuries to key players in the Eastern conference alone. Granger, Rose, Rondo, Amare to name a few which makes it where Miami probably will have the 3 best players on the floor until they play the Knicks but will still have the two top players on the floor in that one.

As another poster said none of those players would matter against this Heat team.

Also a lot of great teams had the top two players many times so I don't see the issue. Shaq/Kobe and Jordan/Pippen were the best players in many series

[mopper8]

Most of the arguments to discredit Lebron are just different variations of special pleading

[GreenHat]

Most of the arguments to discredit Lebron are just different variations of special pleading

I'm stealing that characterization.

The good thing is as Lebron gets better and better the arguments against him have to get dumber and dumber to compensate.

Of course I remember being on this board and arguing with multiple posters that Lebron doesn't have something specific in his nature that makes it impossible for him to EVER win a title so not sure if that isn't dumber than he didn't win a title with a team that hadn't previously won a title.

[RubiosBeard]

Insane how the guy can 'coast' to 27 points on 11 freakin shots. It's gotten to the point where I just can't see any team beating the heat in a series. Even for a team like the Thunder firing on all cylinders it just seems like an impossible task. LeBron and the Heat are just that good...

[JulesWinnfield]

Everything is in the paint in this series so far for LeBron. He took two threes in game 1, but I don't recall a mid range jumper through 6 quarters. He's 14 for 17 from the field, by my count 15 of those 17 looks have been basically at the rim. I'm just going by recollection though, I haven't looked it up

[PCProductions]

Lebron looked really good despite the bucks playing great d on him. The rest of the heat just haven't hit most of their shots. I think the second half we'll see them run away with it.

[Mutnt]

Horrible 3rd quarter but the Bucks are playing some stellar defense on him. MUCH better than in game 1. He got stripped, hacked, doubled on almost every move, lost the ball twice or thrice, was blocked, missed shots, bricked a three. On top of that almost every pass he makes results in a brick by his team. Pretty ugly.

[PCProductions]

Damn... Lebron is fired up in the beginning of the fourth.

[Colbinii]

Damn... Lebron is fired up in the beginning of the fourth.

Yeah this one is over.

[Mutnt]

That's how he should've played in the 3rd...

ps: I hate when LeBron's being overly selective with his shots. It's come to the point when he's trying to get his head in the rim 100% of the time. They've given him the mid-range and the 3-pointer the whole game but he hasn't taken it... Sometimes it's better to settle with a jumper than trying to finish over 3 bodies in the paint.

[toodles23]

Definitely a pretty crappy game by Lebron so far by his standards, some bad TOs and indecision. And literally while I'm typing indecision, he makes an indecisive move down the lane after he got in the air and had to throw it at the hoop. Missed some easy shots at the hoop too, though it looks like he probably should have gotten an extra foul call or two. Defensively, he's been pretty good, though early in the game he seemed to be step slow on a few rotations.

And is it just me, or were there unusually long stretches of this game where Lebron barely even touched the ball?

Oh well, I think this will easily be his worst game of the series. I expect him to clean those TOs up.

[C0bR]

He has to shoot some jumpers, he needs them to respect his shot... That over-selectivness is pi**ing me off.

[IG2]

He has to shoot some jumpers, he needs them to respect his shot...

This. He's being way too conscious of his FG%. The way Milwaukee's playing him today, they have basically taken the half-court drive out of the equation. Just shoot the damn jumper.

[GSP]

Just got home can someone tell me what is happening with Lebrons turnovers and shooting percent?>?????

[Mutnt]

Just got home can someone tell me what is happening with Lebrons turnovers and shooting percent?>?????

TO's = pretty much what happened in Game 1

Shooting percentage (by memory) = Was blocked by Sanders once, was hacked once on a baseline layup he missed - no call, missed a tip in, shot a end-of-the-shotclock three that bricked, shot a halfcourt shot at the end of the 3rd that bricked, missed a put-back layup he was fouled on - no call, missed a bunny layup cause he was indecisive, missed another three pointer.

Those were the shot's he missed if I recall correctly... He was 1/8 in the 2nd half

[SideshowBob]

Miami with a 109.3 ORTG and a 95.9 DRTG tonight (116.0 ORTG and 96.4 DRTG for the series so far). Its funny, they've been a rebounding juggernaut in these two games on both ends (unsurprising offensively, as the Bucks were the 3rd worst DRB% team in the league). 31.5% ORB% and 82.5% DRB% through the first two. On the other hand, they've been super turnover prone, particularly Lebron. Credit Milwaukee's defense.

They've also been great at getting to the line frequently. So their strong suit from the regular season, shot making, has been subpar (their outside shooting has been dismal), but they've managed to make it up so far by extending possessions and getting to the line.

[SideshowBob]

Miami with a 116.3 ORTG and 98.3 DRTG with Lebron on the floor tonight.