The Lebron Thread (Pt. 3)

[PCProductions]

I'd really like to see him work on his decision making. Thinking back, there were so many times that Lebron just did such predictable plays (especially in the Milwaukee series) that resulted in turnovers. I think his game strategy probably needs a little more diversifying.

[MagicFan32]

top 10 all time, but not top 5. he took a shortcut to get his rings, that's a fact. when was the last time a player in his class, in their prime jumped ship to another hall of famers team? hell the most recent one was charles barkley and kevin johnson was no d wade.

lets not forget the fact that while he had many great moments, he also got very lucky that chris bosh and ray allen saved his legacy because lebron made some terrible plays at the end of game 6 that people simply gloss over now. he will never surpass MJ, so lets halt that narrative. has he passed kobe? yes, kobe's last finals mvp was a joke and makes people overlook how awful he was in 10' game 7.

i say, jordan, russell, wilt, magic, kareem, hakeem, duncan, and shaq are ahead of him. many of you will scoff at me putting shaq or hakeem there, but they were just as dominant as lebron, in different ways.

He exercised his option in free agency and took less money to go to another team.

All those other guys chased the most money.

Putting winning over money is a trait that I am glad our best player has and I don't see it as a negative.

lebron left minimal money on the table going to miami, he exercised his option to go to another hall of famers team, and i exercise my opinion that to be in the "goat" discussion, you shouldn't have to do that to win

[NO-KG-AI]

If you base your opinion on how great a basketball player is on anything other than how well he plays basketball... I don't know what to even say.

[MagicFan32]

If you base your opinion on how great a basketball player is on anything other than how well he plays basketball... I don't know what to even say.

it is relevant to playing basketball. where have i said lebron is not a great player? he is, but he will never reach the mountain top

[JordansBulls]

I think he may be a bit more laxed in the regular season next year so it doesn't take as much out of him for the playoffs.

[orangeparka]

If you base your opinion on how great a basketball player is on anything other than how well he plays basketball... I don't know what to even say.

it is relevant to playing basketball. where have i said lebron is not a great player? he is, but he will never reach the mountain top

Do we penalize MJ for being gifted HOFs as well?

If anything, most teams are built by franchises and they're fortunate to play with othee great players.

LeBron on the other hand, took matters into his own hands and helped orchestrate it without help from the FO/etc.

[mitrandil20]

Dont know if anyone feels the same, but it is kind of absurd trying to live through the emotions that went on two-three years ago and the normal acknowledge of greatness that stands now around LeBron. In 2011 LeBron was covered by the epitome of loser, non-winner, a heck of a player that couldnt win it all though - now, right now, he has 2 rings. It is kind of weird to metabolize the fact. Wow.

[Brenice]

Why does LeBron deserve credit because the Heat won 2 championships? What did everybody expect after "the decision"? What shouldn't have been expected was losing to Dallas in the Finals with a stacked deck. It is excuse that they lost because of it being the first year or LeBron taking a backseat to Wade. They made "the decision". The only reason Dirk has a ring is because it was gifted by LeBron because of his strangely poor performance. There are a lot of hall of famers who don't have a ring thanks to Jordan. Part of playing basketball is mental and heart, both of which LeBron pales in comparison to Jordan.

[ronnymac2]

Why does LeBron deserve credit because the Heat won 2 championships? What did everybody expect after "the decision"? What shouldn't have been expected was losing you to Dallas with a stacked deck. The only reason Dirk has a ring is because it was gifted by LeBron because of his strangely poor performance. There are a lot of hall of famers who don't have a ring thanks to Jordan. Part of playing basketball is mental and heart, both of which LeBron pales in comparison to Jordan.

What do you know about heart and what it takes to win? You root for the Wizards man...

[Brenice]

Why does LeBron deserve credit because the Heat won 2 championships? What did everybody expect after "the decision"? What shouldn't have been expected was losing you to Dallas with a stacked deck. The only reason Dirk has a ring is because it was gifted by LeBron because of his strangely poor performance. There are a lot of hall of famers who don't have a ring thanks to Jordan. Part of playing basketball is mental and heart, both of which LeBron pales in comparison to Jordan.

What do you know about heart and what it takes to win? You root for the Wizards man...

So by your measure, I can't watch other teams besides the wizards and make a conclusion? I can get great insight by watching YOUR team. Unless you played and won a ring in the NBA, your opinion is as meaningless as anyone else in Realgm.

[ronnymac2]

Why does LeBron deserve credit because the Heat won 2 championships? What did everybody expect after "the decision"? What shouldn't have been expected was losing you to Dallas with a stacked deck. The only reason Dirk has a ring is because it was gifted by LeBron because of his strangely poor performance. There are a lot of hall of famers who don't have a ring thanks to Jordan. Part of playing basketball is mental and heart, both of which LeBron pales in comparison to Jordan.

What do you know about heart and what it takes to win? You root for the Wizards man...

So by your measure, I can't watch other teams besides the wizards and make a conclusion? I can get great insight by watching YOUR team. Unless you played and won a ring in the NBA, your opinion is as meaningless as anyone else in Realgm.

My statement was made in jest, but my big-picture point is that you harp on players being mentally weak or mentally strong. How do you prove that though?

I really ask this question. How do you know anything about what is going on in a player's head at a particular time? What gives you the audacity to think you know something that everybody else doesn't? Do you know these players as people? Do you speak to them regularly? Are you in the locker room? How do you know? How do you know what they are thinking at any given time?

[Brenice]

People say similar things win comparing wilt and russell. Are you saying I'm wrong on those factors when comparing LeBron to Jordan, provable ir not? Just because things can't be "statted" does not mean they aren't there. Was not Jordan know for his mental dominance? Was jordan not known for never not stepping up in the Finals? You can put LeBron up with LeBron with Jordan on those unmeasurable aspects, but we both know that is not the case.

[Brenice]

As for how do I know? I've been on the court when players have been taken out of their game by a player on the opposite team and thry do exactly what LeBron did against Dallas. They disappear and stand around on the perimeter and pass, avoiding the paint.

[ronnymac2]

As for how do I know? I've been on the court when players have been taken out of their game by a player on the opposite team and thry do exactly what LeBron did against Dallas. They disappear and stand around on the perimeter and pass, avoiding the paint.

Have you been on an NBA court with LeBron James?

[Brenice]

As for how do I know? I've been on the court when players have been taken out of their game by a player on the opposite team and thry do exactly what LeBron did against Dallas. They disappear and stand around on the perimeter and pass, avoiding the paint.

Nope. But I can recognize it when it happens just like you can recognize when someone is choking, is scared, intimidated, etc. We can tell when these types of unmeasurables happen in various types of events, including sports, especially if you been there, done that.

Now, if you disagree about those unmeasurables when comparing LeBron and Jordan, explain, because you haven't yet. You must think they are equal. Btw, it's ok to have an opinion on these unmeasurables. It really is ok. And if you choose not to form an opinion on unmeasurables, don't fault me as wrong for an opinion, just do the mature thing and don't respond.

[ronnymac2]

As for how do I know? I've been on the court when players have been taken out of their game by a player on the opposite team and thry do exactly what LeBron did against Dallas. They disappear and stand around on the perimeter and pass, avoiding the paint.

Nope. But I can recognize it when it happens just like you can recognize when someone is choking, is scared, intimidated, etc. We can tell when these types of unmeasurables happen in various types of events, including sports, especially if you been there, done that.

Now, if you disagree about those unmeasurables when comparing LeBron and Jordan, explain, because you haven't yet. You must think they are equal. Btw, it's ok to have an opinion on these unmeasurables. It really is ok. And if you choose not to form an opinion on unmeasurables, don't fault me as wrong for an opinion, just do the mature thing and don't respond.

To be honest with you, no, I don't have an opinion on the mental abilities of Michael Jordan or LeBron James. I wish I did. I wish I had more information on it. But I don't.

I don't think it'd be OK for me to have an opinion on the mental capabilities — the unmeasurables — of people I have no personal experience with. I think that'd be like looking at somebody's Facebook profile page and claiming to intimately know them.

I am not an expert in body language analysis. I am not a doctor of mental health.

I'm an empathetic human being (I would hope), and I can read when those whom I have a personal, or even professional relationship with, are feeling a certain way. I can make educated guesses.

I really don't think I can get a handle on an athlete's psyche and thought process based on PR-managed/rehearsed interviews and on-court body language. I've been around basketball and sports my entire life. Played. Reffed. Reported on. Interviewed. Watched. Marketed and sold. One thing I haven't done is coach — yet.

I can maybe make a guess about a player's unmeasurables. Not an educated one. Certainly not one where I can then judge two athletes' unmeasurables with accuracy.

[Brenice]

Ok. But you know what, your analyzation of athletes is flawed and you know it.

[mademan]

Anyone care to predict LeBron's box score production for next year? 27/8/7-ish seems like a safe bet, but maybe Spoelstra finally reduces his minutes during the course of the regular season and that drops a bit. Also, hard to imagine he could top his fg% from last year, but who knows. Hopefully he can creep up just over the 80% mark as a free throw shooter, I see him working on that a lot this summer given his comments earlier in the year about seeing himself in the 50/40/90 club as feasible.

I love these types of exercises but it's hopeless to try unless we know whether he's going to be more of a big next year, or if Wade will continue to drop off and LeBron will have more ball-handling duties...

I expect to see a rise in scoring at the very least. 28.5-29 ppg is something I'd put money on. His rebounds will go up as well I think, maybe 8.5-9 as the front-line continues to get older (Andersen and Battier are both 35+) and he spends more time at the 4. Assists are all dependent on Wade. I could see anything from 6.5 to 8.

28.5/8.5/7 is my bet, maybe something like 63-65% TS, 32-33 PER.

I think Lebron's raw stats, minutes, and PER will go down next year, even if it's his best season ability-wise (which I think it will be). I expect he'll conserve his energy more next season after experiencing dead legs in the Finals.

I think after seeing the success the Spurs had in resting their players throughout the season, the Heat might follow a similiar model. Cut down the minutes for the Big 3, pursue some young talent in the draft this year, sign a centre, cut Howard/Jones and play their role players more for the first 65 or so games of the season. Sacrificing their regular season success for more energy and health in the postseason.

Apparently Riley was making it a personal mission to scout young players this year.

[ronnymac2]

Ok. But you know what, your analyzation of athletes is flawed and you know it.

How is my analysis flawed?

[dynamic duo]