2018-19 Player of the Year Discussion Thread

[Joey Wheeler]

My list is probably something like this:

Giannis
Curry
Harden
Kawhi
Jokic
Embiid
George
Durant
LeBron
Lillard

Call me crazy, but put Harden on the Raptors instead of Kahwi and they are a better team with a significantly higher offensive ceiling. He's a better isolation scorer than Kawhi and way beyond him as a passer.

Yes, this is crazy. The Raptors are built on being possibly the most suffocating defense ever in the NBA; you remove Kawhi to introduce Harden and that goes totally out the window. On offense, Kawhi is their leading scorer but everyone gets to eat, they have a lot of handlers and capable secondary scorers. You put Harden in and suddenly he's monopolizing the offense and everyone around him is relegated to being a shooter. They're out to the Sixers in the second round with this switch.

Anyway, Kawhi is clearly 1st here. 2nd to 5th are hard to decide though.

[Basileus777]

My list is probably something like this:

Giannis
Curry
Harden
Kawhi
Jokic
Embiid
George
Durant
LeBron
Lillard

Call me crazy, but put Harden on the Raptors instead of Kahwi and they are a better team with a significantly higher offensive ceiling. He's a better isolation scorer than Kawhi and way beyond him as a passer.

Yes, this is crazy. The Raptors are built on being possibly the most suffocating defense ever in the NBA; you remove Kawhi to introduce Harden and that goes totally out the window. On offense, Kawhi is their leading scorer but everyone gets to eat, they have a lot of handlers and capable secondary scorers. You put Harden in and suddenly he's monopolizing the offense and everyone around him is relegated to being a shooter. They're out to the Sixers in the second round with this switch.

Anyway, Kawhi is clearly 1st here. 2nd to 5th are hard to decide though.

Harden's monopolizing offense is way more productive than what the Raptors produced, even accounting for the postseason. There is a defensive decline, but Kawhi is like the 3rd most important player on that defense, the offensive improvement more than offsets it.

Harden's just a vastly superior passer and playmaker to Kawhi. And it matters.

[HeartBreakKid]

Curry and Harden are by far the best offensive players in the world. Curry’s probably the best overall player in the world right now honestly.


No way in hell do I take Giannis over him in any situation.

Kawhi was elite in the playoffs but even he said he wouldn’t have been able to play in the postseason if not for coasting and load management.

He took it easy on a pretty loaded team.

His overall season is definitely worse than Harden, Curry, Jokic, and possibly Giannis.

You think he would have missed the playoffs if he had been a Warrior instead? It isn't hard to make the NBA playoffs. You're ally discrediting Kawhi's season due to his team being loaded when Curry wasn't even the best Warrior most of this season?

[Basileus777]

Curry and Harden are by far the best offensive players in the world. Curry’s probably the best overall player in the world right now honestly.


No way in hell do I take Giannis over him in any situation.

Kawhi was elite in the playoffs but even he said he wouldn’t have been able to play in the postseason if not for coasting and load management.

He took it easy on a pretty loaded team.

His overall season is definitely worse than Harden, Curry, Jokic, and possibly Giannis.

You think he would have missed the playoffs if he had been a Warrior instead? It isn't hard to make the NBA playoffs. You're ally discrediting Kawhi's season due to his team being loaded when Curry wasn't even the best Warrior most of this season?

Curry was the best player on the Warriors pretty much the entire time he was healthy. Kawhi has a much better argument for not being the best player on his team in the regular season.

[Jaivl]

And at the end of the day nothing changed. Harden still my #1.

[Joey Wheeler]

My list is probably something like this:

Giannis
Curry
Harden
Kawhi
Jokic
Embiid
George
Durant
LeBron
Lillard

Call me crazy, but put Harden on the Raptors instead of Kahwi and they are a better team with a significantly higher offensive ceiling. He's a better isolation scorer than Kawhi and way beyond him as a passer.

Yes, this is crazy. The Raptors are built on being possibly the most suffocating defense ever in the NBA; you remove Kawhi to introduce Harden and that goes totally out the window. On offense, Kawhi is their leading scorer but everyone gets to eat, they have a lot of handlers and capable secondary scorers. You put Harden in and suddenly he's monopolizing the offense and everyone around him is relegated to being a shooter. They're out to the Sixers in the second round with this switch.

Anyway, Kawhi is clearly 1st here. 2nd to 5th are hard to decide though.

Harden's monopolizing offense is way more productive than what the Raptors produced, even accounting for the postseason. There is a defensive decline, but Kawhi is like the 3rd most important player on that defense, the offensive improvement more than offsets it.

Harden's just a vastly superior passer and playmaker to Kawhi. And it matters.

Switching the two makes the Raptors a completely different team. Kawhi is the Raps best player but they play team basketball, everyone contributes on both ends. With Harden you need to make your team the Harden one-man show for him to be at his most effective; who's to say Lowry, Siakam, Van Vleet, etc... are playing with the same energy and effectiveness on both ends under a Harden offense?

I'll give it to you that Harden is a much better one-man offense than Kawhi, but that's not how the Raptors play at all. You can't change the entire identity of a team and assume everyone else will just remain at the same level.

[Basileus777]

Yes, this is crazy. The Raptors are built on being possibly the most suffocating defense ever in the NBA; you remove Kawhi to introduce Harden and that goes totally out the window. On offense, Kawhi is their leading scorer but everyone gets to eat, they have a lot of handlers and capable secondary scorers. You put Harden in and suddenly he's monopolizing the offense and everyone around him is relegated to being a shooter. They're out to the Sixers in the second round with this switch.

Anyway, Kawhi is clearly 1st here. 2nd to 5th are hard to decide though.

Harden's monopolizing offense is way more productive than what the Raptors produced, even accounting for the postseason. There is a defensive decline, but Kawhi is like the 3rd most important player on that defense, the offensive improvement more than offsets it.

Harden's just a vastly superior passer and playmaker to Kawhi. And it matters.

Switching the two makes the Raptors a completely different team. Kawhi is the Raps best player but they play team basketball, everyone contributes on both ends. With Harden you need to make your team the Harden one-man show for him to be at his most effective; who's to say Lowry, Siakam, Van Vleet, etc... are playing with the same energy and effectiveness on both ends under a Harden offense?

I'll give it to you that Harden is a much better one-man offense than Kawhi, but that's not how the Raptors play at all. You can't change the entire identity of a team and assume everyone else will just remain at the same level.

Harden produces better team offense, not one man offense. Because he is a world class passer and playmaker, something Kawhi struggles with. And Harden coexists with Paul and Gordon just fine, why wouldn't Lowry and Van Vleet be able to do the same? Siakam might actually be even better as PNR partner with Harden instead of watching Kawhi isolate and miss easy passes.

[TheGOATRises007]

This is an odd season.

There's no clear cut #1.

I've still got Kawhi 1st, but he did tail off a bit in the finals for me and his poor playmaking was fully on display.

[Joey Wheeler]

Harden's monopolizing offense is way more productive than what the Raptors produced, even accounting for the postseason. There is a defensive decline, but Kawhi is like the 3rd most important player on that defense, the offensive improvement more than offsets it.

Harden's just a vastly superior passer and playmaker to Kawhi. And it matters.

Switching the two makes the Raptors a completely different team. Kawhi is the Raps best player but they play team basketball, everyone contributes on both ends. With Harden you need to make your team the Harden one-man show for him to be at his most effective; who's to say Lowry, Siakam, Van Vleet, etc... are playing with the same energy and effectiveness on both ends under a Harden offense?

I'll give it to you that Harden is a much better one-man offense than Kawhi, but that's not how the Raptors play at all. You can't change the entire identity of a team and assume everyone else will just remain at the same level.

Harden produces better team offense, not one man offense. Because he is a world class passer and playmaker, something Kawhi struggles with. And Harden coexists with Paul and Gordon just fine, why wouldn't Lowry and Van Vleet be able to do the same? Siakam might actually be even better as PNR partner with Harden instead of watching Kawhi isolate and miss easy passes.

That is true if you add a regular season caveat. Houston's offense really struggled last year vs the Warriors, it was good this year, still not as good as the Raptors in the Finals. Not great vs Utah either.

Harden's reputation, like Curry's btw, of leading elite offenses is pretty much entirely built on the RS, it doesn't translate to the playoffs.

[ardee]

1. Kawhi
2. Giannis
3. Harden/Curry
5. Jokic

I can't pick the 3 spot right now, will decide by the time voting rolls around.

Sent from my SM-G615F using RealGM mobile app

[Dr Spaceman]

Yes, this is crazy. The Raptors are built on being possibly the most suffocating defense ever in the NBA; you remove Kawhi to introduce Harden and that goes totally out the window. On offense, Kawhi is their leading scorer but everyone gets to eat, they have a lot of handlers and capable secondary scorers. You put Harden in and suddenly he's monopolizing the offense and everyone around him is relegated to being a shooter. They're out to the Sixers in the second round with this switch.

Anyway, Kawhi is clearly 1st here. 2nd to 5th are hard to decide though.

Harden's monopolizing offense is way more productive than what the Raptors produced, even accounting for the postseason. There is a defensive decline, but Kawhi is like the 3rd most important player on that defense, the offensive improvement more than offsets it.

Harden's just a vastly superior passer and playmaker to Kawhi. And it matters.

Switching the two makes the Raptors a completely different team. Kawhi is the Raps best player but they play team basketball, everyone contributes on both ends. With Harden you need to make your team the Harden one-man show for him to be at his most effective; who's to say Lowry, Siakam, Van Vleet, etc... are playing with the same energy and effectiveness on both ends under a Harden offense?

I'll give it to you that Harden is a much better one-man offense than Kawhi, but that's not how the Raptors play at all. You can't change the entire identity of a team and assume everyone else will just remain at the same level.

We’re you around for Harden’s early career? He doesn’t need to play his current style to be effective. The current style is a happy accident; halfway through the 18 season D’Antoni just said if they’re gonna switch just iso against their big men and it turns out that was way more effective than anyone could have predicted.

[Dupp]

1) Kawhi- probably an underrated regular season but nothing too special. Insane playoff run.


2) Harden - Very special regular season and I’m more impressed with his playoffs than giannis. Comes down to His performance v warriors vs Giannis va the raps. Boston and Utah series also taken into account. Detroit series is meaningless to
me.


3)Giannis- see above but very special reg season and very good playoffs

4)Curry ( might bump him to 3 with some more thought) Heaps of help but very good season and very very good team playoffs. Did pull some disappearing acts though as is tradition.

5) Joel. Very disappointing playoffs offensively in my opinion but his impact on the game was still enormous. Great regular season too.


Edit- joker slots in ahead of Joel. Better regular season and playoffs. I actually think his supporting cast is a bit overrated so his achievements this year are very impressive

[Jaivl]

Leaning

Harden
Jokic/Leonard/Giannis
GSW guy

right now.

I'm pretty happy with

1) Harden
2) Giannis
3) Leonard
4) Curry
5) Jokic

[HeartBreakKid]

I'm not exactly sure where to put Harden or Durant. I think Durant might be getting a bit overlooked, he still clocked in 12 playoff games, that's not a negligible amount - and he was really good in those games.

Excluding those two as I'm figuring out if they rank and where

1) Leonard
2) Curry
3) Giannis
4) Jokic
5) Embiid

[ShotCreator]

Curry and Harden are by far the best offensive players in the world. Curry’s probably the best overall player in the world right now honestly.


No way in hell do I take Giannis over him in any situation.

Kawhi was elite in the playoffs but even he said he wouldn’t have been able to play in the postseason if not for coasting and load management.

He took it easy on a pretty loaded team.

His overall season is definitely worse than Harden, Curry, Jokic, and possibly Giannis.

You think he would have missed the playoffs if he had been a Warrior instead? It isn't hard to make the NBA playoffs. You're ally discrediting Kawhi's season due to his team being loaded when Curry wasn't even the best Warrior most of this season?

Read on Twitter

?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1137090827136753664&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fuproxx.com%2Fdimemag%2Fkawhi-leonard-credits-load-management-nba-finals%2F

Him fortunately being on a loaded team that went 17-5 without him doesn’t change the fact that his coasting would cost him in other guys spots.


I’m confident the Rockets wouldn’t have done nearly as well if you replace Harden with Kawhi.

Or Jokic on the Nuggets. Or George on OKC.

[Krodis]

I'm feeling pretty confident with:

1. Harden
2. Giannis
3. Leonard
4. Curry
5. Jokic

[Eskobar13]

1 - Leonard
2 - Giannis
3 - Harden
4 - Curry
5 - Jokic
6 - Embiid
7 - Durant
8 - Dray
9 - George
10 - Lillard

After further thought I switched Embiid back to 6th. I weirdly don't feel comfortable with Kawhi number one for various reasons but also don't with anyone else so this will do.

Oh and I also have belief Curry or Harden in place of Leonard is a title team.

[Eskobar13]

Watch on YouTube

;feature=youtu.be

Anybody feel like we should do a "best player" thread following the trade value format we did?

[LKN]

This is an odd season.

There's no clear cut #1.

I've still got Kawhi 1st, but he did tail off a bit in the finals for me and his poor playmaking was fully on display.

He also seemed kind of easy to neutralize down the stretch in some of the games. I think maybe it's because he's not a great shot creator and isn't super quick.

Example - in last nights game Kawhi only managed to get 1 shot up in the last 5 minutes of the game.

[Colbinii]

And at the end of the day nothing changed. Harden still my #1.

This is where I am at as well. Deciding 2-6 between Jokic, Curry and Kawhi is difficult. I then have Green, George, James, Gobert, Embiid in some order.