My ranking of Kobe if he wins 6th chip in 2013

Tien · Post #1 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:19 am

I believe this is the year (barring any injuries) that the Lakers win 2013. All the Kobe haters will be quick to point out how washed up Gasol is or how much of a chucker Kobe is.

But what you guys don't understand is that Kobe has been showing us in the Team USA games exactly how he will approach the game.

What we saw was a Kobe that only showed himself when the team really needed him to. Kobe made clutch shots and then stepped aside for CP3 / Durant / LeBron to close it out. Rarely did I see him ball hog and jack up bad shots.

He is looking to take a step back and let Nash / Dwight / Pau work their magic and abuse their mismatches on offense.

Kobe gets it now and I've always said, the day Kobe takes a step back and starts utilizing his teammates to their fullest potential, is the day we see the next version of a champion Kobe. Kobe has the right teammates to do this. Last year he didn't.

It will take them the full season to work out the kinks, but come playoff time, it will be a juggernaut team steamrolling.

1. MJ
2. Russel
3. Kareem
4/5 Magic = Kobe (with 6 chips)
6. wilt
7/8/9 Bird = Shaq = Duncan
10.Hakeem
11.Jerry West
12.LeBron
13.Oscar / Moses Malone

Post #2 » by **Tommy Udo 6** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:24 am

Do people expect the heat to just lie down & go to sleep??

Heat are the Champions & clearly the favorites

The Lakers are only a contender. They may win the West - but they are not beating a healthy Heat team

TheXFactor · Post #3 » by **TheXFactor** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:25 am

Tommy Udo 6 wrote:but they are not beating a healthy Heat team

yaaar · Post #4 » by **yaaar** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:28 am

Tommy Udo 6 wrote:Do people expect the heat to just lie down & go to sleep??

Heat are the Champions & clearly the favorites

The Lakers are only a contender. They may win the West - but they are not beating a healthy Heat team

Considering this new team has spent zero minutes on the court together isn't saying they can't beat the Heat for sure just as bad as saying they will beat the Heat?

Tien · Post #5 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:30 am

I watched every single Heat game last 2 seasons.

The Heat's biggest glaring weakness is the Heat's ability to guard against dominant front court teams.

Putting Lebron at the 4 or 5 may neutralize opposing centers, but it also diminishes his ability offensively due to fatigue. It's basically not a solid defensive strategy in a 7 game series.

Indiana wasn't able to abuse Miami because they didn't have a point guard that could beat the front defense that Miami used. Celtics basically abused this mismatch with Rondo / Garnett and took it to 7 games.

You can argue that Bosh is back, but you are forgetting the other 7 ft Spanish monster that nearly wrecked Team USA.

A fluid functioning LA team > Miami
An LA team that hasn't yet figured itself out player purpose wise < Miami.

Jazza2319 · Post #6 » by **Jazza2319** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:34 am

IMO, a title this year does more for Gasol's legacy than Kobe

andremcosta · Post #7 » by **andremcosta** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:34 am

Kobe can only lose in my list.

Now, he is top10.

Winning with Howard, Gasol, Artest and Nash is not big deal. He won't be a top6 by winning 3 more rings with these guys.

If they lose, it will be worst than Miami's loss last year. Way worse. Lebron got Wade and Bosh and people cried a whole year that he needed too much help.

If they win, it's Howard's team.

Post #8 » by **Tommy Udo 6** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:34 am

The lakers will need a period of adjustment of playing together......

They are not a lock for the title - as the OP says in his first line.

Sure, injuries will determine the eventual victor - but unless they suffer a major injury, the Heat must be considered the favorite.

Heat have 2 of the top players in the NBA & they have a much better coach than the Lakers

Cpt Lebyadkin · Post #9 » by **Cpt Lebyadkin** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:36 am

Kobe 2 finals MVP's from 7 finals appearance = GOAT & GOAT clutch player! :lol:

Tien · Post #10 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:38 am

yaaar wrote:
Tommy Udo 6 wrote:Do people expect the heat to just lie down & go to sleep??

Heat are the Champions & clearly the favorites

The Lakers are only a contender. They may win the West - but they are not beating a healthy Heat team

Considering this new team has spent zero minutes on the court together isn't saying they can't beat the Heat for sure just as bad as saying they will beat the Heat?

No.

When LeBron / Bosh / Wade came together a friend of mine who is a very knowledgeable basketball fan and I concluded that Miami would not win year 1, but would 100% win year 2. Year 1 as well as the 2011 finals was spent letting Wade / LeBron figure themselves out because a lot of their game overrides the other.

Lakers don't have this problem if Kobe knows how to position himself. Dwight and Pau even though I haven't seen them play together is a much better functioning front court than Bynum / Pau. Plus Nash, who will keep the front court bigs very happy.

Tien · Post #11 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:43 am

Tommy Udo 6 wrote:The lakers will need a period of adjustment of playing together......

They are not a lock for the title - as the OP says in his first line.

Sure, injuries will determine the eventual victor - but unless they suffer a major injury, the Heat must be considered the favorite.

Heat have 2 of the top players in the NBA & they have a much better coach than the Lakers

They're not a lock, but Vegas puts them at even odds.

This is probably because of the unknown factor which is chemistry and Nash age. But if Nash age isn't a factor and the guy is still averaging 10+ assists, plus chemistry is figured out by playoff time, Lakers are the favorites IMO.

andremcosta · Post #12 » by **andremcosta** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:45 am

Tommy Udo 6 wrote:They are not a lock for the title - as the OP says in his first line.

That's what can hurt Kobe's legacy. LA is a lock for the title if Kobe is still something close to a top5 player.

Tien · Post #13 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:50 am

andre

Kobe's ability to take a step back is the only question about Kobe I have, not this top 5 garbage. Lakers don't need him to be a top 5 player just like LeBron didn't need Wade to be a top 5 in the league player (except in Indiana missing Bosh).

Lakers only need Kobe to be a facilitator / scorer. He showed us this in Team USA games, I believe he will again this season.

He basically used Team USA to prepare his on court purpose for the next season.

To me, a superstar player that knows when to step back so that his team can have a better chance to win speaks huge volumes to me about his leadership abilities. In my rankings, leadership abilities rank very high on my list.

Cpt Lebyadkin · Post #14 » by **Cpt Lebyadkin** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:51 am

The title itself wouldn't matter as much as his actual performance during that run. His record in the finals isn't that great, well not in terms of hardware at least, (for a lot of different reasons it should be emphasised) and this comes into play when comparing great players to one another. it may seem nitpicking and unfair but its very hard to separate the best of the best and the only way to do so a lot of the times is value certain things over others, and so and so forth.

With one more title, he surpasses magic as the greatest Laker in my mind. Thats a pretty incredible feat in its own right.

andremcosta · Post #15 » by **andremcosta** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:54 am

Tien wrote:andre

Kobe's ability to take a step back is the only question about Kobe I have, not this top 5 garbage. Lakers don't need him to be a top 5 player just like LeBron didn't need Wade to be a top 5 in the league player (except in Indiana missing Bosh).

Lakers only need Kobe to be a facilitator / scorer. He showed us this in Team USA games, I believe he will again this season.

He basically used Team USA to prepare his on court purpose for the next season.

I think Kobe is a top5 if he's able to take a step back. He can still play top defense if he accepts to take 15FGA, forcing shots only when the team needs him. If he accepts to do it, Lakers is a lock to win. If he doesn't they can lose. And it will be his fault.

I think he has nothing to add to his legacy because wither they will lose because of him or he will be a role player.

Not saying it's bad, only saying he has no chance to jump in top6 imo. I can see 6 guys Kobe won't surpass even with 9 rings.

Maybe people in general are willing to give him props to accept being a role player to help the team.

Cpt Lebyadkin · Post #16 » by **Cpt Lebyadkin** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 3:55 am

* only if he wins the finals MVP as well.

andremcosta · Post #17 » by **andremcosta** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:00 am

Cpt Lebyadkin wrote:The title itself wouldn't matter as much as his actual performance during that run. His record in the finals isn't that great, well not in terms of hardware at least, (for a lot of different reasons it should be emphasised) and this comes into play when comparing great players to one another. it may seem nitpicking and unfair but its very hard to separate the best of the best and the only way to do so a lot of the times is value certain things over others, and so and so forth.

With one more title, he surpasses magic as the greatest Laker in my mind. Thats a pretty incredible feat in its own right.

I'd still go with Magic. The second best PG of modern (3pt) basketball is a joke compared to Magic.

I'd still think Shaq is better than Kobe, no matter how much rings they end with. Maybe Kobe is the best Laker, because he has a whole career there.

GetItDone · Post #18 » by **GetItDone** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:03 am

Should reword the title too...."Kobe with another FMVP"

Another ring would do nothing in the ranking in books if he doesn't win a FMVP. He's already at only 2/5 FMVPs...2/6 is NOT top 5 status what so ever. If wins a FMVP he will then be 8-10 IMO.

Tien · Post #19 » by **Tien** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:04 am

Kobe taking a step back and averaging 22/5/5 is not definitely not role player in my eyes, especially on such a stacked team, with everyone chipping in.

Finals MVP to me doesn't matter as much as what Kobe's actual finals play is. Remember Kareem only has 2/6 Finals MVP. Doesn't knock him down any.

If Kobe plays 1 game and then sits out cuz of injuries and the rest of team carries, than obviously he doesn't climb the rankings.

If he wins a 6th chip while chipping in a solid 22/5/5, hell yeah I'm putting him with Magic.

andremcosta · Post #20 » by **andremcosta** » Wed Aug 15, 2012 4:10 am

Tien wrote:Kobe taking a step back and averaging 22/5/5 is not definitely not role player in my eyes, especially on such a stacked team, with everyone chipping in.

Not my point. I think people will consider relevance in each ring.

Horry probably not a top100 because he was a role player his whole life. He was very relevant in some years, delivered at playoffs, but everyone always knew he was a role player.

Lebron hurt his case by going to Miami. He had a case for top3 winning only one rings with scrubs in Cleveland. Now, he'll fight hard to join top5 even with a lot of FMVPs.

Kobe lead his team to 2 rings, and now he's getting all the help a man can imagine. He's a top10 anyway, that's not bad. He's a sure HoF, a legend. But he can't add a lot to what he already did imo.