Isiah Thomas vs Dwyane Wade - Higher on the all time list?

[NYK_89]

Jesus had the Pistons won the game 7 against the spurs would people be talking about billups like this in 20 years?... Obviously he is better then Billups but there is little comparison Wade was without a doubt better.

[Langdon Alger]

Jesus had the Pistons won the game 7 against the spurs would people be talking about billups like this in 20 years?... Obviously he is better then Billups but there is little comparison Wade was without a doubt better.

A lot of it is just blind nostalgia. "Everything back then is better than everything now". It is the same reason why I've read on realgm people claiming that Jordan never got winded in a game. That he would give guys like Lebron a tough fight at age 50. Bill Russell would average close to double digit blocks in the game today. It's just human nature.

[JordansBulls]

Jesus had the Pistons won the game 7 against the spurs would people be talking about billups like this in 20 years?... Obviously he is better then Billups but there is little comparison Wade was without a doubt better.

A lot of it is just blind nostalgia. "Everything back then is better than everything now". It is the same reason why I've read on realgm people claiming that Jordan never got winded in a game. That he would give guys like Lebron a tough fight at age 50. Bill Russell would average close to double digit blocks in the game today. It's just human nature.

I think the reverse is true, people seem to overrate the current guy because he is currently playing.

[jman2585]

Wade easily. The myth of Isiah must stop.

[Not Bias]

Wade handily, he was the better player!!

[GAME TIME]

Wade would had been Jordan toughest competition in the 90s due to depleted wing men

I have Wade here too

[Brenice]

I think the reverse is true, people seem to overrate the current guy because he is currently playing.

Agreed! A lot of times they think players are better because they are better 3pt shooters. Well guess what, that's what they grew up doing. Previous generations didn't practice 3pt shots. They are playing a different game, but that does not make them better, either era of players. Would the new era player be able to play with the floor less spread with 3pt shooters everywhere? Some would, but some wouldn't be as effective. It goes both ways.

[jman2585]

I guess that was why when Isiah was playing he was overrated at the time by all the media and award voters... for being a current player to that generations media... oh wait.

[Brenice]

Zeke wasn't overrated. He needed help, just like everybody else. He just played in an era where there was more than 1 superteam, and he and his team held their own.

[jman2585]

He was on a superteam too. He was rated about fairly by the media and his contemporaries. That rating does not do any favours to a comparison with Dwayne Wade, who is on a whole other level to him.

[Brenice]

He was on a superteam too. He was rated about fairly by the media and his contemporaries. That rating does not do any favours to a comparison with Dwayne Wade, who is on a whole other level to him.

The Lakers, Celtics, Pistons, and eventually the Bulls were all superteams. Maybe Zeke is slightly underrated and Wade is slightly overrated. Just my opinion.

[jman2585]

Take the best player off the Lakers/Celtics/Pistons and Bulls. The remaining support cast for the 1988-90 Pistons is by far the best. The reason Isiah often didn't win titles was because those other alpha dogs were much, much better than him.

[Brenice]

I don't know about that. The Lakers and Celtics were stacked more than the Pistons. The Bulls, probably not. Are you putting Wade on Bird, Magic, and Jordan's level?

[jman2585]

He's a heck of alot closer to it than Isiah was, that's for sure.

[JordansBulls]

He's a heck of alot closer to it than Isiah was, that's for sure.

Peak wise he probably is, career wise they are roughly equal. Which is why the thread was created to see how close they are careerwise.

[jman2585]

Career wise they're not close. Wade's peak was way higher, and he has comparable longevity already. Even this season is better than any season Isiah ever had. Isiah was a guy who hovered around the 8th-17th best player in the NBA. He wasn't some secret MVP candidate. The thread's a joke really, except for how many people believe it.

[JordansBulls]

Career wise they're not close. Wade's peak was way higher, and he has comparable longevity already. Even this season is better than any season Isiah ever had. Isiah was a guy who hovered around the 8th-17th best player in the NBA. He wasn't some secret MVP candidate. The thread's a joke really, except for how many people believe it.

Why would you say they aren't close career wise? Where do you list Isiah?

[qm22]

I think Thomas is kind of underrated on RealGM, but I would take Wade anyway. Thomas had worse stats but he was a CP3 type of player who could make his team better than his boxscore stats suggested, I think.

I'd like to point out Thomas probably should have been a 3x champion with 2 finals MVPs. The Pistons first trip to the finals went 7 games and on game 6 Thomas injured an ankle which took him out for game 7, and it really looks like game 6, on the last play, was won by FTs for Kareem on a foul that Kareem himself said did not happen. Although a losing effort, that game 6 showed Thomas can elevate his game when needed, so perhaps throughout the regular season his abilities were not fully shown in stats. A lot of anecdotes suggest Thomas really only played for the post-season.

That said, Wade has done more as an individual than Thomas, clearly, and by all measures is a better player with better accomplishments. Because of the difficulty I have in judging Thomas purely by stats I like to judge him by his accomplishments in leading his team over difficult opponents, which is why I rate him over Stockton, but it would not change his comparison with Wade who has 2 titles and counting and also one finals MVP, and a collection of amazing playoff series.

Damn is Isiah getting hosed in here. '80s Thomas is a guy you wanted to go to war for if he was your teammate. Was he a mean, racist, homophobic S.O.B.? Yeah, but that doesn't take away from his ability to lead in every facet of the game.

Wade is a superb 2-way SG but he never won a title without a sidekick (or 2). Isiah had good teammates, but Thomas would take the credit or blame for an outcome of a game when it came down to final minutes of contests.

I'm taking Isiah.

That's just ignorant. Homophobic? The guys kissing Magic Johnson on the court before tip off? There was an LA reporter(s) that said Thomas started a rumor about Johnson being gay, but it was baseless slander. Racist? For agreeing with a teammate who said Bird got more attention because he was white? That isn't racist, that is saying there was a racial bias in media coverage of Bird, which really isn't that hard to distinguish from racism.

[jman2585]

Career wise they're not close. Wade's peak was way higher, and he has comparable longevity already. Even this season is better than any season Isiah ever had. Isiah was a guy who hovered around the 8th-17th best player in the NBA. He wasn't some secret MVP candidate. The thread's a joke really, except for how many people believe it.

Why would you say they aren't close career wise? Where do you list Isiah?

I already explained in this thread why. Isiah? Dunno, certainly not in my top 30, and maybe not even in the top 50. I haven't had to spend much time thinking about him, because I usually only go up to about 30, and he's not in that (or even in the discussions at that point). But then I've seen you cite "how much he meant to the history of his club" as an argument, so maybe my standards are different (read: better) than yours.

[sheba021]

Isiah was a guy who hovered around the 8th-17th best player in the NBA. He wasn't some secret MVP candidate.

There was a huge media bias against him, so the fact that he wasn't a favorite to win the borderline meaningless NBA congeniality award is not so surprising.