Page 1 of 5
DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:28 pm
by Doctor MJ
Here's the link:
http://nba.si.com/2013/05/13/2013-nba-a ... ony-allen/Put another way: Only 7 of 30 voters named Gasol on either the 1st or 2nd team.
Also of note, the two guys who beat the hell out of him in this vote finished 4th (Noah) & 13th (Chandler) respectively in the DPOY voting. Each missed a good amount of time, and each led a defense worse than Gasol's, with Chandler in particular noteworthy because he led a below average defense.
In Chandler's defense for his defense of course, he looked much better last year so we can all be assured that Gasol will get respect next year.
The All-D awards need to be re-booted with people who actually put in an effort doing the voting.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:31 pm
by NO-KG-AI
Lol. God I love it. The NBA's analysts and experts ability to evaluate defense might be the most comical thing in all of sports.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:34 pm
by CBA
NO-KG-AI wrote:Lol. God I love it. The NBA's analysts and experts ability to evaluate defense might be the most comical thing in all of sports.
All-Defensive Teams are voted on by the coaches. At least they're supposed to be.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:36 pm
by NO-KG-AI
CBA wrote:NO-KG-AI wrote:Lol. God I love it. The NBA's analysts and experts ability to evaluate defense might be the most comical thing in all of sports.
All-Defensive Teams are voted on by the coaches. At least they're supposed to be.
The experts comment was directed towards them, former players, and the other people that some on this site hold up as gospel, even in the face of overwhelming evidence.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:36 pm
by tsherkin
Deke won it from the 2nd Team once.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:39 pm
by ceiling raiser
Doctor MJ wrote:Here's the link:
http://nba.si.com/2013/05/13/2013-nba-a ... ony-allen/Put another way: Only 7 of 30 voters named Gasol on either the 1st or 2nd team.
Also of note, the two guys who beat the hell out of him in this vote finished 4th (Noah) & 13th (Chandler) respectively in the DPOY voting. Each missed a good amount of time, and each led a defense worse than Gasol's, with Chandler in particular noteworthy because he led a below average defense.
In Chandler's defense for his defense of course, he looked much better last year so we can all be assured that Gasol will get respect next year.
The All-D awards need to be re-booted with people who actually put in an effort doing the voting.
Maybe the PC board can submit retro all-defensive teams along with its DPOY if that's voted to be the summer project?
The coaches may be hopeless, but perhaps participants could produce respectable selections.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:42 pm
by Dr Positivity
If I'm reading it correctly, 5 people voted for Kobe. Expected but still funny
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:46 pm
by SideshowBob
Someone gave Mike James a first place vote. Two people even voted for Corey Brewer
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:46 pm
by Jase
OTHER PLAYERS WHO GOT VOTES (listed with the number of points): Andre Iguodala, Denver, 16; Larry Sanders, Milwaukee, 16; Thabo Sefolosha, Oklahoma City, 15; Luol Deng, Chicago, 11; Dwight Howard, L.A. Lakers, 9; Kobe Bryant, L.A. Lakers 6; Roy Hibbert, Indiana, 6; Kenneth Faried, Denver, 4; Russell Westbrook, Oklahoma City, 4; Shane Battier, Miami, 2; Nicolas Batum, Portland, 2; Corey Brewer, Denver, 2; George Hill, Indiana, 2; Mike James, Dallas, 2; Kawhi Leonard, San Antonio, 2; Tony Parker, San Antonio, 2; Dwyane Wade, Miami, 2; Metta World Peace, L.A. Lakers, 2; Eric Bledsoe, L.A. Clippers, 1; Kevin Durant, Oklahoma City, 1; Jrue Holiday, Philadelphia, 1; Andrei Kirilenko, Minnesota, 1; Iman Shumpert, New York, 1; David West, Indiana, 1.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Mon May 13, 2013 11:53 pm
by Doctor MJ
tsherkin wrote:Deke won it from the 2nd Team once.
This is a good thing to point out. It's not the disagreement that's the issue to me but how extreme that disagreement is here.
In '94-95, Deke was competing with prime DRob & Hakeem. 3 centers who made up the 3 of the top 4 DPOY spots that year and all won the DPOY in other years playing about as well.
By contrast here it's just clear that by and large the NBA coaches never really saw Gasol come into a debate in their minds with Noah & Chandler. Especially with Chandler, it's hard to even imagine making a case for him over Gasol this year, and yet he was decisively preferred over Gasol by this group.
It just feels to me like All-D votes represent some kind of time machine into a distorted past.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:04 am
by Texas Chuck
I think its as simple as during the season head coaches are going to so completely absorbed by their own team that they really arent paying attention to what everyone is doing in that year. So they go back to the work they did over the offseason with the GM and scouts when talking about roster moves for the next year or they look a t last year's awards and go yeah that guy's good.
They should get someone other than coaches to vote on awards because those guys live and breathe their own team and only look at the rest of hte league when preparing for a specific game.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:06 am
by ThaRegul8r
tsherkin wrote:Deke won it from the 2nd Team once.
There's a difference between being on the Second Team, and being 14th in the voting.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:06 am
by tsherkin
Analysis is best done not by those involved...
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:07 am
by Not Bias
As a Knick fan I must say Chandler is so overrated on defense, he didn't deserve to make the team. Gasol,Noah or Duncan should have made that 1st team spot. Oh and how can I forgot the one and only shot blocker Serge Ibaka, my lawd get him off the team as well!!
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:38 am
by Doctor MJ
Let me also note something else. Check out the specifics of the voting:
Noah 22
Chandler 22
Sanders 16
Gasol 12
Howard 9
Not only did Gasol only make 2nd team because of a fluke/cheat tie involving the top two. He shouldn't have made the 2nd team anyway given Sanders votes. And he barely earned essentially the 4th team spot over a Dwight Howard who arguably contributed negative impact this year.
Oh the humanity.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:40 am
by ardee
Replace Conley with LeBron and the second team is what the first team should have been. Chris Paul is absolutely a joke.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:48 am
by ThaRegul8r
Doctor MJ wrote:Let me also note something else. Check out the specifics of the voting:
Noah 22
Chandler 22
Sanders 16
Gasol 12
Howard 9
Not only did Gasol only make 2nd team because of a fluke/cheat tie involving the top two. He shouldn't have made the 2nd team anyway given Sanders votes.
I found it curious that Gasol somehow made the Second Team in the first place, looking at the voting.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:49 am
by Doctor MJ
fpliii wrote:Maybe the PC board can submit retro all-defensive teams along with its DPOY if that's voted to be the summer project?
The coaches may be hopeless, but perhaps participants could produce respectable selections.
It's something to consider. To be honest after working really hard on a heavy project last summer and seeing a lack of enthusiasm I'm personally not running anything big this summer and in general I'd have to really think about how it would work with anything this challenging.
By that I mean the reason the coaches are so bad at this is because it's hard to do it justice. We can blow the coaches away in legitimacy for contemporary years, but when we go deep in the past we're going to be relying quite a bit on the reputation even as we insist that reputation-based defensive evaluation is so ineffective.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 12:59 am
by Doctor MJ
ThaRegul8r wrote:Doctor MJ wrote:Let me also note something else. Check out the specifics of the voting:
Noah 22
Chandler 22
Sanders 16
Gasol 12
Howard 9
Not only did Gasol only make 2nd team because of a fluke/cheat tie involving the top two. He shouldn't have made the 2nd team anyway given Sanders votes.
I found it curious that Gasol somehow made the Second Team in the first place, looking at the voting.
I find it to be more than a little shady.
All-D voting has no requirement that you vote by officially designated positions, and in the past we've seen All-D teams which only have one guard on them. So what does it say when a guy gets on the team over others with more points? That we have someone in a position of authority picking & choosing when to enforce rules strategically.
Even if Larry Sanders didn't exist, Marc Gasol only made that team because the NBA thought it would look better if Gasol at least made the 2nd team.
When you add in that Sanders IS A CENTER it becomes a complete conspiracy. They strategically chose to insist on having a center on the 2nd team AND insisted on classifying Sanders as a non-center when even the nba's website calls Sanders center. Why did they do this? To spare themselves the embarrassment of having the DPOY not even make All-D 2nd team.
The All-D awards are completely meaningless when the NBA abuses the results in this way.
Re: DPOY Marc Gasol finishes 14th in All-Defensive votes
Posted: Tue May 14, 2013 1:19 am
by Bodhi
People have mentioned that the head coaches aren't the ones who actually vote on these teams. They typically defer it to an assistant who may or may not have any NBA knowledge. That would explain certain choices such as Derek Fisher consistently getting All-D votes